Comments on: $11 worth of mods plus new tires – Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/ Wrench smart - driver smarter - save fuel Fri, 18 Nov 2011 08:51:49 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: chris http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-5303 chris Fri, 11 Feb 2011 22:30:02 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-5303 i drive a pinto every day 2/11/11 my 78 pinto crusin wagon pannel i put a turbo 2.3 in it with a 3.18 rear gear and i get 40 mpg so dont tell me a 2.3 dont get mph evan befor i put efi in it i got 28 mpg i drive a pinto every day 2/11/11 my 78 pinto crusin wagon pannel
i put a turbo 2.3 in it with a 3.18 rear gear and i get 40 mpg so dont tell me a 2.3 dont get mph evan befor i put efi in it i got 28 mpg

]]> By: Darkhorse http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-4726 Darkhorse Mon, 25 Jan 2010 18:43:35 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-4726 Between 1976 - 1989 I owned eight Ford Pinto. They were one of the most maligned jem's in the automobile world. My first one produced a rock solid 25 MPG at 60-65 MPH before I began modding it. I never got over 27 MPG at 70 mph, but it could keep of with most of the V-8 pony cars of the day. The car and driver article was helpful, and gave me clues for the direction to take my modifications. Aerodynamically, the rear spoiler made the biggest difference. The airdam had a positive influence, but only if it did not extend below the front suspension crossmember. Blocking the grill made almost no difference, but did over heat the engine, especially modified engines (Ford built their cars with radiators on the small side, this increased mpg by running the engine hotter.) The Ford engineers obviously designed the Pinto for comfortable ergonomics, not aero-efficiency, (compare it's shape to a Prius and it becomes obvious they are aero opposites.) Plus, the frontal area of the Pinto limited it to 105 mph with engines of less than 150 hp. Extra horsepower made them quick, not fast. At the time I did my investigations I was actively racing autocross on the weekends in Denver, CO. I built a total of seven modified engines, cumulating in a fully balanced, alignment bored, ported head engine with headers and weber carburetion. That Pinto pulled away from a Pontiac Firebird at 80 mph, but delivered a consistent 25 mpg in my commuting. Back then the guys I hung with called our car's "mini cars," today they would be called "Tuner's." But, no matter what you call them, there is plenty of leeway for improving light weight, mass production automobiles. Between 1976 – 1989 I owned eight Ford Pinto. They were one of the most maligned jem’s in the automobile world. My first one produced a rock solid 25 MPG at 60-65 MPH before I began modding it. I never got over 27 MPG at 70 mph, but it could keep of with most of the V-8 pony cars of the day.
The car and driver article was helpful, and gave me clues for the direction to take my modifications. Aerodynamically, the rear spoiler made the biggest difference. The airdam had a positive influence, but only if it did not extend below the front suspension crossmember. Blocking the grill made almost no difference, but did over heat the engine, especially modified engines (Ford built their cars with radiators on the small side, this increased mpg by running the engine hotter.)
The Ford engineers obviously designed the Pinto for comfortable ergonomics, not aero-efficiency, (compare it’s shape to a Prius and it becomes obvious they are aero opposites.) Plus, the frontal area of the Pinto limited it to 105 mph with engines of less than 150 hp. Extra horsepower made them quick, not fast.
At the time I did my investigations I was actively racing autocross on the weekends in Denver, CO. I built a total of seven modified engines, cumulating in a fully balanced, alignment bored, ported head engine with headers and weber carburetion. That Pinto pulled away from a Pontiac Firebird at 80 mph, but delivered a consistent 25 mpg in my commuting. Back then the guys I hung with called our car’s “mini cars,” today they would be called “Tuner’s.”
But, no matter what you call them, there is plenty of leeway for improving light weight, mass production automobiles.

]]> By: hank antler http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-4478 hank antler Fri, 14 Aug 2009 21:20:46 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-4478 for the person who suggest that alternators slow down engines based on their maximum capacity: Alternator's resistance is not fixed. The physical resistance comes from the force needed to rotate the coil in magnetic field created by another coil (which creates electricity). The resistance and the charging is controlled by varying the current in the "other" coil. so in short alternator's braking effect is adjusted based on the need. Thus turning fan off, having lights off or low consumption LEDs will infact affect gas mileage. for the person who suggest that alternators slow down engines based on their maximum capacity:
Alternator’s resistance is not fixed. The physical resistance comes from the force needed to rotate the coil in magnetic field created by another coil (which creates electricity). The resistance and the charging is controlled by varying the current in the “other” coil. so in short alternator’s braking effect is adjusted based on the need.

Thus turning fan off, having lights off or low consumption LEDs will infact affect gas mileage.

]]> By: Akandodelsin http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-4244 Akandodelsin Fri, 08 May 2009 05:11:21 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-4244 Radial tires can be crossed in the rotation pattern from side to side. Bias ply tires have a front to back pattern. I got this information from a very dedicated tire and wheel company when I bought my tires online. Radial tires can be crossed in the rotation pattern from side to side. Bias ply tires have a front to back pattern. I got this information from a very dedicated tire and wheel company when I bought my tires online.

]]> By: FlycastNW http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-4223 FlycastNW Fri, 01 May 2009 00:20:01 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-4223 Wow, I didn't remember my first car, a 1971 Pinto, got that poor gas mileage. But then, I was paying 35 cents a gallon back then - 10 cents per gal. more than the least expensive gas because I thought there was something was wrong with it!!! LOL Wow, I didn’t remember my first car, a 1971 Pinto, got that poor gas mileage. But then, I was paying 35 cents a gallon back then – 10 cents per gal. more than the least expensive gas because I thought there was something was wrong with it!!! LOL

]]> By: PintoBean http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-4222 PintoBean Fri, 01 May 2009 00:18:49 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-4222 Wow, I didn't remember my first car, a red Pinto, got that poor gas mileage. But then, I was paying 35 cents a gallon in 1971 - 10 cents per gal. more than the least expensive gas because I thought there was something was wrong with it!!! LOL Wow, I didn’t remember my first car, a red Pinto, got that poor gas mileage. But then, I was paying 35 cents a gallon in 1971 – 10 cents per gal. more than the least expensive gas because I thought there was something was wrong with it!!! LOL

]]> By: The Ultimate DIY Aero Mod - Smart Car of America Forums http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-3971 The Ultimate DIY Aero Mod - Smart Car of America Forums Mon, 02 Feb 2009 04:25:44 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-3971 [...] Originally Posted by jwight I seem to remember Car & Driver doing a project like this (different car) during the early 70s fuel crisis. They got some good results also just by cleaning up the car's drag, although I don't think they went as far as the "boat tail." Yup, but I don't think it did anything about the explosive nature of the Pinto's character. $11 worth of mods plus new tires - Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% [...] [...] Originally Posted by jwight I seem to remember Car & Driver doing a project like this (different car) during the early 70s fuel crisis. They got some good results also just by cleaning up the car’s drag, although I don’t think they went as far as the “boat tail.” Yup, but I don’t think it did anything about the explosive nature of the Pinto’s character. $11 worth of mods plus new tires – Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% [...]

]]> By: John http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-3932 John Wed, 07 Jan 2009 20:51:05 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-3932 oh ford sux any way you paint it, their emmisions have always been the worst in the industry and their one electric car, they desided to shaft the leasers with reposessions, they made the car just to shut the hippies up and then they pulled the plug just like GM did to their electric vehicle, the american manufacturers make way to much money in consesions from the petroleum industry to make cars that are less efficient today than they where years ago, , my VW jetta 96 gets an incredible amount of miles, an i am still not satisfied, even though it is a gem to drive, the fact that with only 2 valves per piston, it still needs to be a 2.0litre car and only gets around 30 miles is deplorable, when my girlfriend's 1.7litre Honda has 4 valves per piston and gets better mileage than i can, with less hardware and moving parts to load against the force generated from combustion. Of course ford hasn't one car that can boast of getting better millage than mine or hers with half the creature comforts, still, it angers me that even though Porche invented the in wheel electric motor concept around WW2 with batteries, the gas car got taken more seriously than the car that did not cost nearly as much to maintain and constantly feed an even older concept, is the PRENDEV magnet motor to couple to a generator or alternator to generate the needed electricity using physics, the whole greasy petroleum addiction problem could have been averted and aerodynamics would not be an issue in design other than to economize on drag. oh ford sux any way you paint it, their emmisions have always been the worst in the industry and their one electric car, they desided to shaft the leasers with reposessions, they made the car just to shut the hippies up and then they pulled the plug just like GM did to their electric vehicle, the american manufacturers make way to much money in consesions from the petroleum industry to make cars that are less efficient today than they where years ago, , my VW jetta 96 gets an incredible amount of miles, an i am still not satisfied, even though it is a gem to drive, the fact that with only 2 valves per piston, it still needs to be a 2.0litre car and only gets around 30 miles is deplorable, when my girlfriend’s 1.7litre Honda has 4 valves per piston and gets better mileage than i can, with less hardware and moving parts to load against the force generated from combustion.
Of course ford hasn’t one car that can boast of getting better millage than mine or hers with half the creature comforts, still, it angers me that even though Porche invented the in wheel electric motor concept around WW2 with batteries, the gas car got taken more seriously than the car that did not cost nearly as much to maintain and constantly feed an even older concept, is the PRENDEV magnet motor to couple to a generator or alternator to generate the needed electricity using physics, the whole greasy petroleum addiction problem could have been averted and aerodynamics would not be an issue in design other than to economize on drag.

]]> By: wintervssummer http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-3552 wintervssummer Sat, 29 Nov 2008 19:34:21 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-3552 I very much love summer :) Someone very much loves winter :( I Wish to know whom more :) For what you love winter? For what you love summer? Let's argue :) I very much love summer :)
Someone very much loves winter :(
I Wish to know whom more :)
For what you love winter?
For what you love summer? Let’s argue :)

]]> By: AL http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-3209 AL Sun, 19 Oct 2008 22:34:25 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-3209 Best car I ever owned: 1972 1/2 Pinto Wagon. Used It only for commute purposes only, 5 days per week, 100 miles a day. Changed oil ever other Month, never used oil between changes. Drove 70 miles an hour to and from work. M.P.G. was 24, and tires were replaced every 70,000 miles. Never replaced the engine, the car had two paint jobs due to rock chips and blue paint fad. Always outside, never wrecked, or abused, a real cherry, but a lot of miles, 317 thousand, and was still running great when I sold It in, 1989. Bought an El Camino, 1985, and I am still driving It today, and It's also a cherry. If they were to build a new pinto today, just like the old one back In 1972, I would buy one. Yes, I would also keep my beautiful 85 El Camino. What do you think? Best car I ever owned:
1972 1/2 Pinto Wagon. Used It only for commute purposes only, 5 days per week, 100 miles a day. Changed oil ever other Month, never used oil between changes. Drove 70 miles an hour to and from work. M.P.G. was 24, and tires were replaced every 70,000 miles. Never replaced the engine, the car had two paint jobs due to rock chips and blue paint fad. Always outside, never wrecked, or abused, a real cherry, but a lot of miles, 317 thousand, and was still running great when I sold It in, 1989. Bought an El Camino, 1985, and I am still driving It today, and It’s also a cherry. If they were to build a new pinto today, just like the old one back In 1972, I would buy one. Yes, I would also keep my beautiful 85 El Camino. What do you think?

]]> By: Arthur http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-2433 Arthur Sun, 31 Aug 2008 21:48:35 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-2433 The improved MPG was for a Pinto going 70 MPH. This does not give the average MPG for a pinto which I believe was closer to 25 -30 MPG. Yes, over heating could still be a problem if you live in an area where the average temperature is higher than average. Grill blocks are best in areas with temperate climates. An adjustable Grill Block sounds good to me. May be even make one that adjusts automatically. Most replacement tires are not LRR. You have to shop around for those. Do some research on what tire models are currently the best. Do not count on tire sales people to know this. The improved MPG was for a Pinto going 70 MPH. This does not give the average MPG for a pinto which I believe was closer to 25 -30 MPG.

Yes, over heating could still be a problem if you live in an area where the average temperature is higher than average. Grill blocks are best in areas with temperate climates. An adjustable Grill Block sounds good to me. May be even make one that adjusts automatically.

Most replacement tires are not LRR. You have to shop around for those. Do some research on what tire models are currently the best. Do not count on tire sales people to know this.

]]> By: mzs http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-2403 mzs Wed, 27 Aug 2008 18:31:03 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-2403 With most cars that have an automatic transmission the radiator also cools the the transmission fluid and there is no temp gauge for or idiot light for that. There is a channel at the bottom of the radiator for the transmission fluid. I've had to install separate small radiators and fans in cars when I lived in CA after I had to buy a rebuilt transmission to prevent another costly repair. With most cars that have an automatic transmission the radiator also cools the the transmission fluid and there is no temp gauge for or idiot light for that. There is a channel at the bottom of the radiator for the transmission fluid. I’ve had to install separate small radiators and fans in cars when I lived in CA after I had to buy a rebuilt transmission to prevent another costly repair.

]]> By: DepFleeririp http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-2297 DepFleeririp Sat, 02 Aug 2008 22:20:22 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-2297 Thanks for the post Thanks for the post

]]> By: Vroum, vroum « Le Satellite Voyageur http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-2067 Vroum, vroum « Le Satellite Voyageur Mon, 07 Jul 2008 12:10:09 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-2067 [...] vous voyez ci-haut où on a réussi à faire entrer 13 contortionnistes dans une Smart !!! Puis, un article intéressant sur des propositions sur les voitures pour qu’elles consomment moins d... ! À l’époque (1973-74), il y eut une crise du pétrole et des gens se demandèrent comment [...] [...] vous voyez ci-haut où on a réussi à faire entrer 13 contortionnistes dans une Smart !!! Puis, un article intéressant sur des propositions sur les voitures pour qu’elles consomment moins d… ! À l’époque (1973-74), il y eut une crise du pétrole et des gens se demandèrent comment [...]

]]> By: Getting Better Gas Mileage…..3 Decades Ago!!!! « Gas Mileage http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-1994 Getting Better Gas Mileage…..3 Decades Ago!!!! « Gas Mileage Thu, 26 Jun 2008 21:57:21 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-1994 [...] Source: http://www.ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25... [...] [...] Source: http://www.ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25... [...]

]]> By: $11 worth of mods plus new tires - Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% « MrGreen.Biz http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-1826 $11 worth of mods plus new tires - Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% « MrGreen.Biz Fri, 13 Jun 2008 06:46:32 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-1826 [...] June 13, 2008 in Mr Green Archive March 12th, 2008 by Benjamin Jones · 16 Comments [...] [...] June 13, 2008 in Mr Green Archive March 12th, 2008 by Benjamin Jones · 16 Comments [...]

]]> By: ThinkDwell » Blog Archive » More MPG http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-1511 ThinkDwell » Blog Archive » More MPG Fri, 23 May 2008 13:43:52 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-1511 [...] during the first oil crisis the US experienced, Car + Driver magazine ran an article featuring $11 worth of modifications to a Ford Pinto, plus some radial tires and got a whopping 25% better fuel economy. How so? They focused their attention on minimizing the [...] [...] during the first oil crisis the US experienced, Car + Driver magazine ran an article featuring $11 worth of modifications to a Ford Pinto, plus some radial tires and got a whopping 25% better fuel economy. How so? They focused their attention on minimizing the [...]

]]> By: OME Lift and decreased MPG - reasoning?? - IH8MUD.com Forum http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-1258 OME Lift and decreased MPG - reasoning?? - IH8MUD.com Forum Fri, 25 Apr 2008 17:36:32 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-1258 [...] cool, a removable air dam... $11 worth of mods plus new tires - Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% : Ecomodder.com Fuel Economy B... __________________ 98 LX470 85 [...] [...] cool, a removable air dam… $11 worth of mods plus new tires – Car and Driver improves MPG by 25% : Ecomodder.com Fuel Economy B… __________________ 98 LX470 85 [...]

]]> By: charlie http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-1150 charlie Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:38:57 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-1150 This was a carbureated car but also may have had higher octane fuel. My dad had a 67 400 ci pontiac and pulled a small travel trailer and got 15 mpg in 71. 76 500ci caddys got pretty good mileage also. I had a new 8900 gvw 76 3/4 ton 4wd chevy silverado with the 300hp chev 327 cam and 600 holley that got 15 mpg with 4:10 gears and 16.5 tires. My company NCR went from 72 torino station wagons to the pinto station wagons (automatic) and they were real slugs but the little 2.3 ended up being a pretty good motor. Charlie This was a carbureated car but also may have had higher octane fuel. My dad had a 67 400 ci pontiac and pulled a small travel trailer and got 15 mpg in 71. 76 500ci caddys got pretty good mileage also. I had a new 8900 gvw 76 3/4 ton 4wd chevy silverado with the 300hp chev 327 cam and 600 holley that got 15 mpg with 4:10 gears and 16.5 tires. My company NCR went from 72 torino station wagons to the pinto station wagons (automatic) and they were real slugs but the little 2.3 ended up being a pretty good motor.
Charlie

]]> By: SVOboy http://ecomodder.com/blog/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/comment-page-1/#comment-814 SVOboy Mon, 24 Mar 2008 15:42:39 +0000 http://ecomodder.com/blog/2008/03/12/11-on-mods-plus-new-tires-car-and-driver-improves-mpg-by-25/#comment-814 Thanks for the comment, bob, unfortunately I'm going to have to disagree with you. If one has any concept of aerodynamics, it's not hard to make improvements over today's vehicles. In fact, while some of them are better than they were in the past, there has been little across the board aerodynamic improvement in a while. People who block their grill or change their radiator fan are very conscious of the way it affects engine heat. I've never heard of an engine overheating, and even if it began to, it's as simple as removing the grill block. Truckers and bus drivers do it, Honda even designed a factory grill block you could add to you car for just that purpose. I would say it's fairly safe. Thanks again. Thanks for the comment, bob, unfortunately I’m going to have to disagree with you.

If one has any concept of aerodynamics, it’s not hard to make improvements over today’s vehicles. In fact, while some of them are better than they were in the past, there has been little across the board aerodynamic improvement in a while.

People who block their grill or change their radiator fan are very conscious of the way it affects engine heat. I’ve never heard of an engine overheating, and even if it began to, it’s as simple as removing the grill block. Truckers and bus drivers do it, Honda even designed a factory grill block you could add to you car for just that purpose. I would say it’s fairly safe.

Thanks again.

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