Gas-Electric propulsion system for 3.5 ton conversion van

[oil pan 4]

Originally Posted by debit.servus

How can I faraday the 2001 FORD with it's computers, OBD and electronic fuel injection so those electronics won't fry when the inevitable EMP happens?

Easy.
With out a proper earth ground you can't.

[freebeard]

if I do not have boy love now in the good times, what is the point...

Whelp, I'm outa here.

[McDesign]

Paul - I'm a mechanical engineer, so you can trust me. I have like, patents and stuff.
Long post to respond to your thorough post.

Think about and analyze what you are trying to do from an energy balance standpoint - thinking and calculating is free!

First - locomotives are diesel-electric simply to eliminate the extremely torque mechanical connection between a low-speed 3000 hp and the multiple drive axles - far more dependable to have an electric motor in each axle. THERE IS NO EFFICIENCY "GAIN" IN THIS - it's done for reliability and cost - locomotive fuel was a few cents per gallon when they were designed.

Back to you.

You need to move x weight at y speed. You also have to accelerate that weight. You have to drag that weight at constant speed up hills. You have to push it through the air. You have to overcome drivetrain losses (a surprising amount with a non-lockup converter and in the rear-axle gearing). Hysteresis losses in your tires - all that.

OK. So after that, you have an energy budget. Now - what can supply that energy?

Internal combustion engines (gas or diesel) are easy to compare in terms of lbs of fuel per horsepower per hour - that's BSFC, or "brake specific fuel consumption". Broadly speaking, that's a number between .4 and .5, and is ~ the inverse of the torque curve of the engine - max efficiency happens near peak torque for a given engine.

Since you've calculated your energy budget, you can figure what's the BEST possible gas or diesel consumption for your needs over an average driving cycle by a theoretical engine - I'll bet you'll find for your situation, with that engine displacement and old-tech cylinder head design and a carb, it's around 12-15 mpg for gas, maybe ~3-5 MPG more for an injected diesel.

OK - so that's the best a well-tuned "theoretical" engine can do. You want to replace that with some other source. Let's say you could have a ~20-30 horsepower common-rail injected diesel generator running at perfect, consistent loading, such that you got maybe ~.35 or even .3 BSFC. Great - now you're making power (electric, not mechanical) at higher efficiency from your fuel.

But - you have to store that electricity in expensive or heavy batteries, so you can use a hundred horsepower or so when you need it to accelerate or climb a hill. Also - you have to convert that electricity into a form (voltage and frequency) that can be used by your motors, and then the motors have to generate mechanical torque from electrical energy. That will cost you 20-40%, which wipes out your great BSFC number back to where it was with a well-tuned IC engine.

All that work, and no better.

Wood gas, you'll find, is EXTREMELY limited as to power and efficiency -there are several folks who have build running versions, and this has been their experience. Also, all the anecdotal evidence form German and eastern Europe during WW2.

Full electric? I went through the exercise completely about four years go, as a rigorous engineering project. I wanted to convert my '91 Accord coupe to electric with a 105 mile range.

Lithium iron phosphate batteries of the appropriate size were $26,000. Absolutely no joke. Just the batteries - not the ~$4-8,000 for the rest of the conversion.

I realized i could never drive enough to save enough on gas to make back the cost of "pre-paying" for my energy.

Instead, I went through an annotated program of step-by-step aerodynamic improvements - I think there is a thread in here. I went from 27 to 36 mpg in my particular driving mix, and can get ~44 mpg at 75 mph and approaching 50 mpg at 55 mph on I-95 between South Carolina and Maryland - but that's dangerously slow.

So - there is no easy solution to what you want to do, even if you had a $30-50K budget.

But - you must do realistic calculation and prove your plan to yourself before you spend a dime - wishful thinking will cost you money!

[McDesign]

http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...ods-23570.html

My mild aero Honda thread

[csnyder]

As a former EV builder/owner/driver I can say with some certainty you would be wasting your money and effort following your plan.
First of all, the efficiency of a "series hybrid" really sucks. You are using a relatively inefficient engine to turn a relatively inefficient generator to run a possibly relatively efficient electrical traction motor - and without batteries to average your load you will be stuck with a roughly 15HP van that needs to run the generator at full output just to maintain urban speeds.

Add to that the fact that the lifespan of the generator you envision using is likely well under 1200 hours running at full tilt.

Get that little 318 tuned up properly - and perhaps get a fuel injection conversion installed and you can get well over 20MPG at a sedate highway cruise. If that doesn't turn your crank, find a rusted out Mercedes 300tD and swap the powertrain into your van, or some other all-mechanical diesel.

If you want to go hybrid electric , a parallel hybrid would make more sense.
Strap a 9" electric motor to the driveshaft - install a 4wd transmission/transfer case and connect the motor to the front driveshaft. Have the controls configured so when going downhill or braking, the motor runs as a generator and charges your batteries. At an easy cruise the generator can still be charging a wee bit if required, and on hills the motor switches on and takes some of that power back out of the battery to reduce the load on the engine. This way the engine runs in it's most efficient range and the power normally wasted going down hills, slowing down, and braking, gets saved and returned to use. In stop and go low speed urban traffic the gas engine can be shut off, eliminating idle time saving more fuel. To do that kind of a conversion, if you are skilled and careful, could cost as little as 4 or 5 000.

[sikbrik]

Sorry all, didn't read the entire thread but FYI, the 80s and early 90s Dakota used a 3.9 liter v6 with equal dimensions to the 318/360...even same mounts, just chopped off two cylinders. It came with a granny gear 5 speed and nice OD. I'd spend your 2k sourcing and swapping that drivetrain. Keep your 318 brackets and accessories, etc. Just my thoughts on economical and reliable path to 20+ mpg.

[McDesign]

I was looking for this one for the drivetrain to swap into my GreaseCar '59 Mercedes.

Mercedes Benz 300 Series Coupe | eBay

[Joe of Loath]

I think OP is having delusions of Mad Max.

[RoadRaceJosh]

What a thread. Inevitable EMP. Under/over unity. No money for mods, but money for a Diesel Ford van? Nice. The sub $1000 investment is now what?

I don't believe we've been expertly trolled, but have had a glimpse at a "true believer" and that type is far more dangerous.

I used to have a '72 Dodge B300 with a 318 and 4.10 gears. Bad carb, 6 MPG. Rebuilt carb, 11 MPG highway. That $120 investment was recouped in driving Portland to LA and back.

That the OP can't afford to travel the country in the style he wants bothers me not at all. If he really wanted to see the country. I mean really, really had to be on the road he'd fill a pack and start hitching. Shoe leather is highly EMP resistant.

[cRiPpLe_rOoStEr]

At least he found a relatively easy solution to his issue.