I was thinking about getting a scooter. I don't need too much power just enough to keep up with traffic on city streets a 50cc or 150cc would work fine. Insurance is around $75 a year and they get around 60 to 100mpg. I guess this is more a move for safety/laziness then anything else. Rush hour traffic can get a bit dangerous on a bicycle. I think the ability to hold 30mph vs. 15mph would really help my sanity.
My trikes are "below the legal radar" - bicycle license but no insurance necessary. Not exactly scooters!
On the news tonight scooters were mentioned- a group of teachers in a Salinas, CA. school all got new scooters as an answer too gas prices. Very admirable!
In most cases, the 50cc scooters do not require a motorcycle license and will only go 45mph (which may be OK). These are the scooters that get 100mpg. 150's can hit 65mph, but you will need a license.
If you look at moped2.org they have a listing of laws by state and some of those laws group 50cc scooters in the same class as mopeds, the best option of course is to go to your department of motor vehicles and ask them for the pamphlet on scooters. scooters2.com also has some information, but I haven't spent any time looking around to find out how good it is. MopedArmy.com is awsome for information on mopeds, if you have questions about a scooter you will be informed that the site is not called scooter army.
For the most part, most states classify a 50cc scooter as a moped (altho mopeds have pedals) and put a speed limit on them that will vary by state, 25mph is common my state allows 30mph, automatic transmissions are also commonly required to make them simpler to operate as vehicles of this class often just require that you have a normal drivers license, at least in my state anything above 50cc engine size requires a motorcycle license.
I know more about mopeds then alot of the scooters as I work on most of the mopeds that are part of the local moped gang, and I also often get asked to help fix scooters and mopeds when they come in to the motorcycle shop that is down the road.
My Tomos Arrow (2005 50cc scooter) is supposed to get 100+ mpg, I don't have solid numbers because I only have 50 miles on it.
My old (sold last summer) Tomos Bullet (1982 moped) got 80-90mpg with an after market exhaust that gave it a big power boost for climbing hills, and raised the top speed to 35mph.
I also sold a Honda E-lite 50cc scooter last summer, it was a little sluggish compared to my Tomos's when going up hills, on flat and from a stop wasn't bad, gas mileage on that was around 90mpg.
I've ridden a friend's 250cc 2005 Vespa, claims to get around 75-80mpg with it, has a top speed of 80mph, requires a motorcycle license, for an engine that size I would prefer to have a motorcycle, but the vespa has fuel injection so it requires less matence.
If I was to recommend a new 50cc scooter, I would say to look at the Honda Ruckus (never ridden one, but it's a 4 stroke Honda), a Sachs Madass (never ridden that either, but has a 4 stroke 50cc Honda dirt bike engine), or any of the non-china made Tomos mopeds (you can get them with pedals, or foot pegs), apparently the new Tomos scooters (Nitro and Velo models) are made in china and their quality dropped when that happened.
My trikes are "below the legal radar" - bicycle license but no insurance necessary. Not exactly scooters!
They should be registered as motorcycles or scooters, technically... That being said, people get away with registering 50-250cc scooters as scooters, and sub 50cc scooters as motorcycles, so there's a lot of leeway.
They should be registered as motorcycles or scooters, technically...
Nope, if it is electric and has three or less wheels they are in a seperate class, many can be used on bike trails. Some places put a weight limit on them and/or a top speed limit.
I talked to the detective at the Illinois Secretary of State about the lack of definition for electric bicycles and he said it is basically wide open. So put whatever you want together for an electric bike/trike and take your chances that the officer will see it your way, if not take it up with the legislature.
Nope, if it is electric and has three or less wheels they are in a seperate class, many can be used on bike trails. Some places put a weight limit on them and/or a top speed limit.
I talked to the detective at the Illinois Secretary of State about the lack of definition for electric bicycles and he said it is basically wide open. So put whatever you want together for an electric bike/trike and take your chances that the officer will see it your way, if not take it up with the legislature.
I was talking to Christopher Jordan about CA regs.
It's best to check with your state as to what is allowed, my state allows a motorized bicycle to simply be registered as a bicycle with the city and as long as you can removed the motor or engine to convert it back to a bicycle and it's under 125cc gas engine... altho 50cc if it's integrated in to the vehicle like a moped is.
It makes motorized bicycles a great deal, $3 per year to register it with the city, and a 30mph speed limit (unless the posted speed limit is less) while being powered by the motor or engine, and you have to turn the motor or engine off to use it on sidewalks, bike paths, or other "bike only" areas.
California
Electric Bicycles are defined by the California Vehicle Code [24][25][26]. In Summary, Electric Bicycles are basically, by law, to be operated like conventional bicycles in California. There are several exceptions to this. A person must be at least 16 years old, and anyone riding an electric bicycle must wear a bicycle helmet. The e-bikes must have an electric motor that has a power output less than 1,000 watts, is incapable of propelling the device at a speed of more than 20 miles per hour on level ground, is incapable of further increasing the speed of the device when human power is used to propel the motorized bicycle faster than 20 miles per hour, operates in a manner so that the electric motor is disengaged or ceases to function when the brakes are applied, or operates in a manner such that the motor is engaged through a switch or mechanism that, when released, will cause the electric motor to disengage or cease to function.
Driver's licenses, registration, insurance and license plate requirements do not apply. A motorized bicycle is not a motor vehicle. A motorized bicycle shall only be operated by a person 16 years of age or older. Drinking and driving laws apply. Additional laws or ordinances may apply to the use of electric bicycles by each city or county.
406. (a) A "motorized bicycle" or "moped" is any two-wheeled or three-wheeled device having fully operative pedals for propulsion by human power, or having no pedals if powered solely by electrical energy, and an automatic transmission and a motor which produces less than 2 gross brake horsepower and is capable of propelling the device at a maximum speed of not more than 30 miles per hour on level ground.
(b) A "motorized bicycle" is also a device that has fully operative pedals for propulsion by human power and has an electric motor that meets all of the following requirements:
(1) Has a power output of not more than 1,000 watts.
(2) Is incapable of propelling the device at a speed of more than 20 miles per hour on ground level.
(3) Is incapable of further increasing the speed of the device when human power is used to propel the motorized bicycle faster than 20 miles per hour.
Almost any bicycle with decent gearing is capable of 20+mph under human power on flat ground, so unless there is something that prevents any additional power from the motor at that speed, be it gearing or a cut-out (as in what the bionx kit has) at 20mph, then a bicycle with an electric motor is considered a motorcycle by the CA DMV.
Since Christopher Jordan said their trikes were "below the legal radar" I'm assuming they probably can go over 20mph with electric power. Otherwise they would simply be motorized bicycles and wouldn't be going under the radar based on what I think the term describes.
Edited for errors.
Last edited by roflwaffle; 03-14-2008 at 05:25 PM.
You can get them on craigslist/ebay since they used to be sold in the US back in the 60's/70's. You'll look like a middle-aged thai man bringing his chickens to market, but 50 million sold has to mean something.
Christopher Jordan's TerraTrike is a tadpole (that's two wheels in front) trike that is predominantly powered by pedaling. His has an add-on electric motor. No registration as a motor vehicle is necessary, same as if you were to add an engine to a conventional bicycle.
Which, by the way, is a perfectly good option for you, igo. How much distance are you trying to cover? What kind of speed are you trying to keep up with?
A bike w/ engine can do what no scooter can: turn the engine off and go on the greenway paths, up on the sidewalk, cut across the University Quad, whatever. It is completely below the radar when the engine is off.
If you want to be way stylin', go check out the reintroduced Whizzer. It evokes the style of the original engine, the displacement is, for a bike engine, gigantic, and whatever engine you choose, all the hills are yours to ascend with an engine to give you a push.
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You're not in front of me...
I'm 25,000 miles in front of you.
If you are only using the scooter for under 30mph then they are fine, once you get above that then you should look into a motorcycle. There are some really nice 250cc motorcycles out there. Scooters are not as safe as motorcycles for a lot of reasons, besides they're automatics, motorcycles by definition are manual.
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Goal one= 30mpg on The Monte by changing the nut that connects the steering wheel to the seat.
