CV boots-need mechanical advice please

[Cd]

I'm not sure what these things are called, but from what I understand they are CV joint related.
Can someone in the know explain what these rubber boots are and what they do ?
Do they just seal in the grease, or do they perform some other vital function ?

If they do indeed just seal in the grease, can I just clamp them down using a hose clamp, or must I get them replaced ?

What could happen if I continue driving the car with these things split like this ? Will I lose control of the car and crash, or have my wheels fall off ?

I'd like to just be able to clamp them back into place and forget about them, but I'd rather be safe than cheap.

Thanks for any advice !

(This is on a '93 Civic by the way.)

[thebrad]

They protect that joint from dirt, grime, and other elements that could get in there and ruin the ball bearing. Get them replaced ASAP or the repair will only get more expensive.

Since it's a Civic it might just be cheaper to replace the whole axle (remanufactured/refurbished ones are readily available), especially if you can DIY.

You also got the name right.

[Coyote X]

Is it the cv joint or a tie rod?

Looks like it is on the steering to me

[thebrad]

Originally Posted by Coyote X

Is it the cv joint or a tie rod?

Looks like it is on the steering to me

Haha, looks like you're correct. Didn't really pay attention to the location of it from the first pic.

[digitaldissent]

those are inner tie-rod boots

I would check to make sure there is no "play" in the tie-rod ends before just changing the boot. Maybe be better to just change the joint while your at it.

get an alignment when you are done

[ttoyoda]

You will have to doublecheck cause I do not know your engine/transmission details, but
Here:
http://bkhondaparts.com/billkay/jsp/...itch=&hidIrno=

14 53534-SR3-A52 DUST SEAL, TIE ROD
( No Color ) 1 1993 CIVIC 18.21

15 53534-SR3-N52 DUST SEAL, TIE ROD
( No Color ) 1 1993 CIVIC 12.92

And yes you need to change these asap. The crap that gets on the rod will drag back into the seal on the power steering rack and make the seals there leak. Then you will be unhappy.

Use a caliper to measure how much thread is showing past the lock nut on each tie rod end before you take it apart. Put it back this way for your drive to the alignment shop.

[Cd]

What is a honest charge for doing that sort of work ?

[digitaldissent]

its been so long since I worked as a mechanic, best to call around and get quotes.

I would say no more than 2 hours labor for both sides even though with a lift and an impact gun I can remember doing those way faster than that.

let me now what kinda prices you get

[thebrad]

Originally Posted by .Cd

What is a honest charge for doing that sort of work ?

I can try to get you the flat rate labor charge and OEM price cost from AllData within the next two weeks. I'll try cycling out to school tomorrow, see how far I get though, no promises.

[Cd]

So if these things just seal in the grease, why can't I just clean out the gunk in there, regrease it, and then clamp them down using a hose clamp ?

I know it won't work ( otherwise you guys would have suggested it already ) I was just wondering why it wouldn't work.

thebrad Thanks for the offer, but no stress ... I'll just call around to a few shops.

[digitaldissent]

I think technically it would work, but I don't think it would come out as well as you might imagine. It just wouldn't seal right and the boot would end up being too short and just tear again very soon.

You do need to get that done soon however because you are running the risk of ruining your steering rack. Not sure how mechanical you are but its really not that hard of a job if you wanted to try your self.

[thebrad]

Made it out there today here are the estimates from AllData.

Parts-
Manual steering boot: (r) 20.42, (l) 20.42
Power steering boot: (r) 23.77, (l) 16.85

Labor-
outer tie boot (one side, without toe-in adjustment) - .6
outer tie boot (both sides, without toe-in adjustment) - .9
inner tie boot (one side, without allignment) - 1.1
inner tie boot (both sides, without allignment) - 1.4

[Cd]

Originally Posted by thebrad

Made it out there today here are the estimates from AllData.

Parts-
Manual steering boot: (r) 20.42, (l) 20.42
Power steering boot: (r) 23.77, (l) 16.85

Labor-
outer tie boot (one side, without toe-in adjustment) - .6
outer tie boot (both sides, without toe-in adjustment) - .9
inner tie boot (one side, without allignment) - 1.1
inner tie boot (both sides, without allignment) - 1.4

Thanks ! ( Can you translate it please ? )

[ttoyoda]

Parts is the cost of parts in dollars, for the boots themselves.
Labor is the time in decimal hours to do the work.
.5 would be half an hour or 30 minutes
Multiply the time by the "hourly labor rate" of the shop you are using
to get the total cost. Hourly labor rate might be around $75 per hour.
Then after all this you have to go get the front end aligned.
(This analysis is all a guess on my part by the way)

[thebrad]

Originally Posted by ttoyoda

Parts is the cost of parts in dollars, for the boots themselves.
Labor is the time in decimal hours to do the work.
.5 would be half an hour or 30 minutes
Multiply the time by the "hourly labor rate" of the shop you are using
to get the total cost. Hourly labor rate might be around $75 per hour.
Then after all this you have to go get the front end aligned.
(This analysis is all a guess on my part by the way)

Bingo.

Just call around for estimates in your area to see if those estimates are in line, don't forget to ask what they charge for flat rate.

[ttoyoda]

Bingo.

Thanks.
Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while.
I probably should have clarified that the boot cost in dollars is what the garage bills the owner of the car. It is not the price the garage pays for the boots. There needs to be some markup by the garage to compensate for the fuss of handling (ordering, storing, not-losing, returning-wrong-or-defective, paying the bills on) the parts. So don't use the parts prices you find online to (female dog used for breeding pups^*) at the garage people. Just like you would not insult the chef at a restaurant before you eat, and for the same reasons.

*word filter. I wonder if I can enter the equivalent of "rooster" or "miserly"

[Cd]

I'm currently putting around ... maybe 35 or so miles on the car in a months time ( just to keep the car from falling apart ), so no rush at all to get this done.
Also, I called a shop or two and one fellow stated that I might as well just drive the car as is.
He said that unless I hear 'clicking' sounds when I turn corners , not to worry about it.

Since he made it sound like it was no big deal, I think I might go ahead and clean out the dirty grease ( it's not that dirty really but I want as little grit as possible in there ).
I'll just replace the grease with new grease ( do I need a special type, or is grease ...grease ? )
I'll then try and seal the gaps in the CV boot.

Thanks for the help folks !

[Johnny Mullet]

Um, is this a steering rack we are talking about or an axle joint because there should not be grease packed in a steering rack boot. Any fluid leaking from there would mean the rack is leaking power steering fluid.

[Tooelecherokee]

Originally Posted by Johnny Mullet

Um, is this a steering rack we are talking about or an axle joint because there should not be grease packed in a steering rack boot. Any fluid leaking from there would mean the rack is leaking power steering fluid.

I concur there shouldn't be that much crap in there.. As you are only putting like 35 miles on it Just get some Zip Ties and suck the boot down to the shaft - Check that they don't interfier with your steering, You don't want to wait for it to start clicking.. that means that more is broken than already is

[MechEngVT]

The boot is there to keep dust/dirt/grime out of the inner tie rod end. Those joints are rather intolerant of gunk and will wear out quickly when dirty. Plus there IS grease there to keep the joint from rusting, as surface rust in the joint is the same as gunk and will wear it out. A worn tie rod end puts slop in the steering and will be difficult to align and won't hold an alignment.

Clamping the boot down will possibly prevent the rack from traveling to full lock in one or both directions without ripping the boot further, so it's mostly a waste of time.

Taking the inner tie rod end off the rack (or tie rod if it's easier) and replacing the boot isn't too difficult. Might be a good time to replace the tie rod end anyway. Measuring its setting with calipers will greatly assist you in putting it back together close enough to drive but a wheel alignment should still be done.

I know these aren't CV boots, but CV boots are the same way. The joints wear out very quickly when in contact with water/dirt. They're very hard to disassemble (they're an interference fit assembly you have to smack *just* right to take apart) and the grease is obnoxiously sticky yet you have to fully clean the contaminated grease to reboot a shaft. You're most likely better off replacing the whole shaft since it's fewer labor hours than rebooting and you have a new shaft/joints/boots.