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Old 12-23-2012, 11:45 AM   #11 (permalink)
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I seriously doubt the working class feel China is getting rich. I might be struggling but at least I get a paycheck and go home instead of getting paid $60 a month a bed (at work) and mystery meat soup everyday. I know this because unfortunately my company brokers the making of injection molds for our customers because we can't compete with the prices anymore. The Chinese people are willing to live in conditions we aren't. They eat parts of animals we throw away. America is fat and lazy and we can't compete with them.

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Old 12-23-2012, 12:17 PM   #12 (permalink)
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The decline and fall of Empires... the trejectory is sooo similar. Ask yourself this question, "How did The Roman Empire manage to last as long as it did?"
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Old 12-23-2012, 01:40 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by suspectnumber961 View Post
China has a history of going bonkers socially....but who knows? I hear a lot of wealthy Chinese are buying property outside the country...when it hits the fan...they leave?
...I've heard sinking Chinese 'ships' have deserting rats just like ships elsewhere in the world.
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Old 12-23-2012, 03:22 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Aren't the rich leaving France?

Is it wrong that I find the idea of a Chinese bubble collapse to be intellectually stimulating? Somehow I see other countries benefiting more from that than the US.
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Old 12-23-2012, 07:49 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Where do the rich like to vacation?
Where ever it is safe to be rich...
Where is it safe to be rich?
In countries that have low levels of inequality...
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Old 12-23-2012, 10:50 PM   #16 (permalink)
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redyaris -

Quote:
Originally Posted by redyaris View Post
The decline and fall of Empires... the trejectory is sooo similar. Ask yourself this question, "How did The Roman Empire manage to last as long as it did?"
I'm not sure what *the* reason was but here is one nice one :

Ancient Digger Archaeology: Monday Ground Up: Why was the Roman Empire so long-lived?
Quote:
In a five hundred year span, the Roman Empire managed to rise and fall in tandem, yet with the advent of highly credentialed political leaders and a vision to see the straighter path, the empire grew larger, and the people with it. Never had the western world been more organized and more united. In 100 A.D. you could travel on paved roads from Egypt to France using one currency and only a passport and by 200 A.D. there were over 50,000 miles of roads constructed by the Romans [6]. The vast Roman Empire mustered up the largest army the world had ever seen and its political exploits lay the platform for our founding fathers.

The Rise of the Roman Empire (Penguin Classics)In my opinion, Rome’s geographic location and the success of its military encouraged a concentration of politics in the capital, and many experts agree. The “practical engineering skill of the Romans furnished the Empire with the necessary arteries, the famous Roman roads, all radiating from the heart, carrying Roman civilization and life to the farthest limits of Europe” [8]. A combination of law and engineering, military force, and social legislation to combat political fragmentation along with exceptional leaders, allowed the long lived Roman Empire to become one of the greatest superpowers the world has ever seen.
With that said, I think a modern Roman Empire would only last 100 or 200 years max in our current era. I say that because I don't think any ancient society can be directly compared to post-Industrial revolution based societies. The rules have changed.

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Old 12-24-2012, 01:40 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by cfg83 View Post
redyaris -

I'm not sure what *the* reason was but here is one nice one :

Ancient Digger Archaeology: Monday Ground Up: Why was the Roman Empire so long-lived?


With that said, I think a modern Roman Empire would only last 100 or 200 years max in our current era. I say that because I don't think any ancient society can be directly compared to post-Industrial revolution based societies. The rules have changed.

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...I'd add that both the rules as well as the playing field(s) have changed.
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Old 12-24-2012, 01:53 PM   #18 (permalink)
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Where do the rich like to vacation?
Where ever it is safe to be rich...
Where is it safe to be rich?
In countries that have low levels of inequality...
I don't know exactly who you are counting as "rich", but I don't think your argument is supported by facts.

First, I don't think the really rich ever actually vacation, they just buy homes in different places.

Second, for the prosperous to moderately rich, vacation location choices are far more likely to be based on climate & scenery than economics. If you want to go on a ski vacation, for instance, you go to places like Aspen, Whistler, or Gstaad - and the local economy in such places has very high levels of income inequality. Very few people, rich or not, take ski vacations in say Norway or Sweden.

Same for tropical vacations: most people head off to places which have a very high degree of income inequality - the West Indies, Mexico, Thailand,etc.
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Old 12-24-2012, 02:01 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by cfg83 View Post
I'm not sure what *the* reason was but here is one nice one :

Ancient Digger Archaeology: Monday Ground Up: Why was the Roman Empire so long-lived?
Simplistic, and wrong about a lot of things. Most importantly, the Roman Empire actually endured for closer to 1500 years, finally ending with the fall of Constantople to Islamic invaders in 1453. Add in the Republic, and that's close to 2000 years of Roman civilization.
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Old 12-24-2012, 02:43 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Where we have deployed troops at ruinous expense, China has deployed dealmakers.
And has exported arms to anyone the USA or Europe (maybe even the Russians) wouldn't supply ...

Quote:
With more than $14.4 trillion in capital reserves, China — an economy that was once devastated by collectivist government policies — has become the world's No. 1 lender.
There's only one slight issue with the Chinese economy : it relies very much on export, and they do feel the economic crises in the US or EU as reduced exports.

Their internal market, huge as it is, simply can't take their massive production.
They must export.

Quote:
But here in America, the principles of the U.S. Constitution ... the rule of law ... the individual's rights to his own property ... are being systematically destroyed.
And non-existant in China ...

But everyone and anyone will happily deal with the Chinese as prices are so good - easy peasy, when by any standards, you employ slave labour.


They don't give $h!t about the environment, nor the individual Chinese .

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