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Old 08-03-2017, 09:17 PM   #51 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by oldtamiyaphile View Post
You won't find many people running 50+% over EPA without EOC or extensive mods.
True. However, EPA fuel efficiencies have risen of 50% for many types of vehicles over the last 15 years, but not all.

The jump in the number of gears from the typical 4 in the '90s to 6/7/8 that you get now also make it harder for the comeback of the Manual.

Anyway, I give up. I concede the debate. I could go on but it would serve no purpose other than depress people that really like Manuals and I'm in no way against them. Have a nice day

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Old 08-03-2017, 09:47 PM   #52 (permalink)
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Multi-speed gearboxes are a con. The reason for them is so that if the computer makes a bad call on gear selection, it's less obvious the more gears you have.

I only use 1-3-5 in my NA cars, and the Corvette forces you to shift 1-4-5-6 in the interests of economy. Ideally, I'd gut my gearbox so the extra gears aren't adding rotational inertia and friction.
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Old 08-03-2017, 11:56 PM   #53 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar5boosted View Post
The jump in the number of gears from the typical 4 in the '90s to 6/7/8 that you get now also make it harder for the comeback of the Manual.
Even in countries where manuals outnumber automatics on new car sales, sometimes it seems like a 4-speed with a wider ratio would actually fare better than the 5-speed and 6-speed ones that became prevalent. And even though the decrease on weight and internal frictions could seem negligible at first, every little effort sums up for better fuel-efficiency (and lower purchase cost )
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Old 08-04-2017, 11:56 AM   #54 (permalink)
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Two-speed 'slush-o-matics' and 3-speed manuals!!!
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Old 08-04-2017, 12:29 PM   #55 (permalink)
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When I first started driving, proper, it was all 3 speed column changes. I then had a 4 speed column change. That was followed by three on the floor. I had been driving for about 10 years before I ever had 4 on the floor. With my spell driving automatics my Jazz, purchased just a year ago, is the first car I have owned with more than 4 gears!
My brother's BMW has 7 gears!!
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Old 08-04-2017, 01:31 PM   #56 (permalink)
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I have to note that several manufacturers are making the nice little stab of equipping the autos with longer gear ratios so they beat the manuals on the highway. Examples 2017 Mazda mx5 2 mpg more for auto. 2017 Ford focus S 4 mpg for the auto. 2017 Subaru brz 4 mpg more for the auto. The list is long and it's ridiculous to me.

Last edited by 14'ecocruze; 08-04-2017 at 01:47 PM..
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Old 08-04-2017, 02:43 PM   #57 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 14'ecocruze View Post
I have to note that several manufacturers are making the nice little stab of equipping the autos with longer gear ratios so they beat the manuals on the highway. Examples 2017 Mazda mx5 2 mpg more for auto. 2017 Ford focus S 4 mpg for the auto. 2017 Subaru brz 4 mpg more for the auto. The list is long and it's ridiculous to me.
But, the really ecomodder question is: Which is cheaper to produce and therefore lower cost to the buyer? I'm quite sure a 3-speed paired with a properly selected axle-ratio would get equal or better MPG in the long run...and cost less toobutt.
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Old 08-04-2017, 03:12 PM   #58 (permalink)
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And the moment you price one transmission overhaul, the MT is better... to the buyer planning to keep the car past its warranty.

And there's another part of the problem.
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Transmission type Efficiency
Manual neutral engine off.100% @MPG <----- Fun Fact.
Manual 1:1 gear ratio .......98%
CVT belt ............................88%
Automatic .........................86%

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Old 08-05-2017, 06:41 AM   #59 (permalink)
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Quote:
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Two-speed 'slush-o-matics' and 3-speed manuals!!!
For light-duty automatics, either a CVT or a hybrid setup similar to what is used in the Prius might be the way to go, while heavier ones might actually find some benefit in a larger amount of gears even though the exact amount of them might be arguable. I remember seeing people complaining that the 6-speed automatic transmissions fitted to some GM trucks were quite dumb and had a harsher shifting compared to the 4-speed ones they were meant to replace.

When it comes to manuals, eventually some 4-speed with a wider ratio might still be enough in a small car like a Toyota Etios. Now they're fitted with a 6-speed manual, but my mom has a pre-facelift one (like those in the picture, but my mom has a grey hatchback) with a 5-speed which gear spread sometimes feels quite too short. Surprisingly, automatic versions recently introduced resort to a good old 4-speed instead of a CVT, but it's still smoothier than some 5-speed AMTs fitted to other Brazilian-made econoboxes.


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