Project: Rebuilding an '01 Honda Insight as a nonhybrid

[jpstaub]

Originally Posted by Fabio

Hey Jake.

I didn't realize you and your team were on this forum.. but I was definitely jealous when I first heard of your project (and that you completed it in almost no time at all!). The diesel Lupo engine, is vastly better then the diesel smart engine, and probably will still be more fuel efficient even if I managed to modify the engine in a way where it actually gains efficiency from deleting the turbo. You made the right call by going Lupo!

This isn't the only project I'm working on at the moment though.. I have several Insight chassis to work with.. and I'm curious, do you think your Insight would have been more efficient if you would have swapped in the entire Lupo drive and deleted all of Hondas IMA BS?
Does the assist even help that much? I would assume that the 1.2 diesel you have in it already has sufficient torque.. Is there anything else you would have done differently if you were more focused on just FE and less on winning the epic X-Prize (which would mandate also making a great overall car.. which you definitely did..)?

Anyways, good job on that Insight!

Sorry for the delay in response.

I don't know that I'd swap in an entire Lupo drive train. The Lupo 3L transmission was a dog, at least the one that came in the 2000 Lupo 3L that I got hold of. Shifting the transmission yourself takes out the 2s delay between gear changes the 3L had. The transmission was really sophisticated but made it to a car about 10 years too early. Also, using the Insight transmission cut down on the build complexity since we didn't have to deal with mount point changes, custom CV joints, and numerous other details.

Would the Insight be more efficient with just a Diesel engine? Maybe. The best way to get an idea without building a car would be to use the ADVISOR program (unfortunately the program cost $5k and my temporary license ran out) which has a Honda Insight model and the ability to substitute engine types and mass values. I have a feeling a Diesel only car would do better than the Lupo 3L since you could get the car well below 1900lbs. I don't know if it would be better than the diesel-hybrid car. After I put a set of low rolling resistance tires from Europe on and get some miles on the car I'll be able to say one way or the other.

The hybrid system really does make quite a difference in the drivability of the car. With the 1.2L tuned for max fuel efficiency the turbo stays out of the equation until 2000 RPM. The IMA fills that hole and allows for really early shifts which keeps the revs below 2000 RPM most of the time. IMA also helps when climbing hills. And there's Auto Stop when driving in the city. It's a pretty slick system overall. The Honda guys worked really hard on that part of the car.

Best wishes,
Jake

[eco_generator]

Updates? Any extra ambitiousness added?

[100MPGUS]

popcorn.gif

I can't post pictures or it would be the smilie with the guy eating popcorn.

[ShadeTreeMech]

I wouldn't delete the turbo from a diesel engine designed with a turbo and expect higher MPG. You'd end up with a smoky tailpipe due to lower amounts of air.

[payne171]

Probably not what you're looking for, but there is a company in Michigan that makes swap kits for the Honda K20 200 hp engines. The designers say that it has so much more power than it needs that their ECU tuning lets it spend a long time in lean burn. I would personally REALLY like to own a 48 mpg (their #) car that has the power to weight ratio of a Corvette. Still, Honda drivetrains are pretty modular. You could put a lower flowing head on it, higher gears, or just stay out of VTEC (good luck with that) for better results.

[bengry]

why not fab a mounting plate to get any old civic trans onto the engine directly kicking out the ima and then bolt a flywheel and clutch directly to the output of the motor.

You see plates like this from bisimoto to mount a h or b series motor to the easily available d series transmission.

I am not sure if the engine management will run the engine with out the ima bits.

Perhaps a stand alone engine management that would be tunable for lean burn and to possibly supplement a small turbo to help out with acceleration.

[100MPGUS]

Is the OP still around? Wondering how he made out with the project.

[AntiochOG]

What happened to this project?

[100MPGUS]

Originally Posted by AntiochOG

What happened to this project?

I would love to know also.

[discovery]

I think the guy is selling parts for Honda Insight on ebay.com. He got over 20 Insight's or something like this. I might be wrong, don't take my word.

Flamboyant Auto Parts items - Get great deals on Gen 1 Honda Insight Parts items on eBay Stores!