Watkins Glen, NY, "Green Grand Prix" Sat May 2, 2009; fuel economy competition & show

[Daox]

Very cool guys. Wish I coulda been there.

[MetroMPG]

The organization was great too. Head honcho Bob Gillespie seems like a very cool guy - laid back, yet everything went off without a hitch. A crack team of volunteers & marshalls to get the two driving events started and finished with a minimum of fuss. No small feat considering how many noobs they had to deal with.

And I thought it was especially cool how they involved students in things, from grade school kids to high school to university level. I liked the art competition for grade school students to come up with new vehicles with creative fuels & drivetrains. I think there were more awards given for plans/drawings of "used diaper-powered" and "cockroach-powered" cars than there were awards for the big kids in the rally and fuel economy events!

Oh yeah - both ends of the motorcycle spectrum were represented: a Suzuki Hayabusa and a pair of Vespas in the mpg run. The zucchini managed something like 58 mpg (I think)! Both Will & I saw him ride past, tucked down low for better aero.

For me the only downside to the event wasn't at the event itself, it was on the way home! A minivan driver crossed the highway from a side road RIGHT in front of me. I had to emergency brake from 50 mph / 80 km/h to avoid stuffing my car into her sliding door. The driver looked right at me as she crossed my lane - fear in her face when she realized what she'd done. I'm just glad she stayed on the go pedal so I could slip by her back end. It was serious enough that my first thought when I went for the brakes was NOT "oh, crap - it's going to take me a while to make up for that wasted energy."

[blownb310]

Guys,

The overall winner [71 mpg] of our AMEC Economy Run II [Jonathan Bartlett], was there in a TDI VW. I'm not sure if he brought his wife's Passat wagon or his own TDI this time around, but he said [on our AMEC message board] that he ended up with a triple digit mpg and his score was not recognized at the awards.

Perhaps it was thrown out due to error? Anyone talk to him or hear anything?

Mike

[SVOboy]

We met him beforehand, didn't hear anything afterwards. I heard some of the prius numbers got thrown out for cheating, though I don't know about the TDI. It might be due to some horrible pump error. I know someone with a plymouth breeze had their numbers tossed out because he got like 160 mpg

[MetroMPG]

Was that "Lugnut"?

I talked to him a little before the event, but I didn't know his results didn't get counted in the end. I had heard that a few fills were messed up and/or rejected (at least one Prius as well), but I don't know the details.

I imagine the measurement method will always be a contentious issue at these kinds of events. EG: the Prius people were at a disadvantage - as their fuel bladder warmed up, it would become more flexible and permit a larger fill, so lowering their MPG results.

[blownb310]

Originally Posted by MetroMPG

Was that "Lugnut"?

Yup. Thanks for the explanation. On our first AMEC Economy Run last August, we did the "stop after one click" deal and I was not happy with it. So for the second event in October I went with the "fill to the rim" deal. It was much more accurate. We did not use that for Hobbit's Prius though, because of the bladder. None of the other 14 vehicles had any check engine lights or any problems at all from filling to the rim. It takes a steady hand, some extra time, and patience to do it right though. Mistakes/overfills/spills will happen if you're in a hurry.

I know ther are some cars that can be damaged from overfilling. I've read that some Lexus products are effected. Are there any other's that are known to be sensitive?


Mike

[McTimson]

'98-'02 Corolla's have that problem. It's something with the charcoal canister, it can get messed up if you overfill the tank, so Toyota recommends filling it to the first click. The canister has a pretty good chance of throwing a CEL if you overfill it, but it doesn't really affect performance. And, overfilling it won't instantly throw the CEL, sometimes it takes a while, or even a few overfills to do it. It's a weird system, and very annoying, as Toyota pretty much refuses to offer an easy way of fixing the CEL besides replacing the charcoal canister (~$400).

I guess the only way to get a more accurate result would be to just make the run longer. But then, there would probably be a lot less competitors, because there's probably not too many people who would want to drive 2-300 miles in one day at low speeds.

There was a Passat TDI wagon who started right in front of me, that was probably him. I never caught up to him though, I stayed behind the pair of Vespa's doing 45 for the first half.

[MetroMPG]

Potential problems to evaporative emissions systems was mentioned as the reason for going with the 1-click fill method.

(My personal method has always been "fill to the brim". My car has evap, and it's had no problems, according to the ECU.)

Another option would be to just weigh the vehicles before/after. You'd need a pretty accurate scale though. (And would have to trust the competitors not to scoop up a handful of gravel or something, part way through!)

[bryn]

good show guys

it was good to see your cars closeup/meet you. etc.
i will definitely have to compete next time around

i would love to have seen that solar car in full racing dress. the $26,000 hub motor and high voltage controller sounded very cool.

my favorites were the little tadpole electrathon trikes, from a couple of area highschools. the simple design and price seem perfect for almost any school project. would make a great little commuter as well.

more projects to think about i suppose

[Matt Herring]

Anywhere to find the results from the economy run? website is not updated