Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Hypermiling / EcoDriver's Ed
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-28-2009, 09:42 AM   #11 (permalink)
Administrator
 
Daox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Germantown, WI
Posts: 11,203

CM400E - '81 Honda CM400E
90 day: 51.49 mpg (US)

Daox's Grey Prius - '04 Toyota Prius
Team Toyota
90 day: 49.53 mpg (US)

Daox's Insight - '00 Honda Insight
90 day: 64.33 mpg (US)

Swarthy - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage DE
Mitsubishi
90 day: 56.69 mpg (US)

Daox's Volt - '13 Chevrolet Volt
Thanks: 2,501
Thanked 2,585 Times in 1,553 Posts
At 44 mpg you're already at 137.5% EPA rating for the car. Thats really pretty good. If you want to hit the really high numbers, you have to either look at going slower, serious aeromods, or pulse and glide. Sounds like you weren't a bad driver to begin with.

You can also try accelerating a bit harder. I use the "LOD" function on the scangauge and keep it around 80 while accelerating. Do that, and keep your rpm under 2000.

It also just takes time too. Look at my fuel log in the Paseo for instance. Its just a gradual incline as I learn how to better use all the techniques available.

__________________
Current project: A better alternator delete

Last edited by Daox; 12-28-2009 at 09:53 AM..
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 12-28-2009, 09:52 AM   #12 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Leadville, CO
Posts: 509

Maroon Ballon - '98 Chrysler Town & Country LXI
90 day: 26.42 mpg (US)

MaEsTRO - '95 Geo Metro 5spd hatch, 3 cyl
Thanks: 47
Thanked 54 Times in 38 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lazarus View Post

Most of all just keep at it. It takes time to figure it all out. Small will eventually turn into big numbers.
Agreed. It's not alchemy, but there is a lot of art as well as science in maximizing F/E.

I don't EOC, but I still get good F/E for my vehicle. "Staying under 65 mph most of the time", might not be enough. Try for all of the time. I found this to be a really big part of my overall F/E. People really underestimate how much fuel is used above 60 mph, and also creeping around in parking lots, and stopping and starting in traffic. If you have to use your brake in traffic, you're probably going too fast. Let the other cars accelerate past you and then wait at the light, and as you coast up behind them and keep going without hitting your brake or jamming on the accelerator, most times you find it's the same cars at every light. They're getting horrible F/E, and not making any faster progress than you are. This is a lot of where the artistry comes in.

Don't make any final conclusions after 2 tanks. You can't do 10 push-ups a day for a week and expect to look like Arnold Schwarzenegger.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2009, 12:40 PM   #13 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,209
Thanks: 225
Thanked 811 Times in 594 Posts
If I understood the post rightly, one problem might be trying to drive by the ScanGauge fuel consumption indicator. I've had one in the Insight for several years, and my experience has been that the SG fuel consumption indication is very slow to respond at best (so you'd often be "behind the curve" if you try to follow it), and sometimes just plain wrong.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2009, 05:53 PM   #14 (permalink)
Pishtaco
 
SentraSE-R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Bay Area, California
Posts: 1,485

Mean Green Toaster Machine - '06 Scion xB
Team Toyota
90 day: 48.92 mpg (US)
Thanks: 56
Thanked 286 Times in 181 Posts
50 mpg is certainly possible in an MT Echo. Keep your speeds to 55 mph or lower, and you may have to P&G.
__________________
Darrell

Boycotting Exxon since 1989, BP since 2010
Have you ever noticed that anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac? George Carlin
Mean Green Toaster Machine
49.5 mpg avg over 53,000 miles. 176% of '08 EPA
Best flat drive 94.5 mpg for 10.1 mi
Longest tank 1033 km (642 mi) on 10.56 gal = 60.8 mpg
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2009, 08:00 PM   #15 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Russellville, KY
Posts: 540
Thanks: 8
Thanked 33 Times in 27 Posts
I've tried EOC in my '88 Escort a few times, but since it has DFCO I've never seen any increase in FE. As some others said this is not the time of year to be looking for great FE since winter blend gas isn't as good and cars simply don't get as good mileage during the winter.
__________________



  Reply With Quote
Old 12-28-2009, 08:23 PM   #16 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,513

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.71 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 60.16 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,058
Thanked 6,957 Times in 3,602 Posts
Ford Man: Engine Off Coasting isn't strictly a replacement for Deceleration Fuel Cut Off.

Coasting to a stop with the engine off is definitely more efficient than DCFO to a stop (because the coast is longer).

Quote:
Originally Posted by jamesqf View Post
one problem might be trying to drive by the ScanGauge fuel consumption indicator. I've had one in the Insight for several years, and my experience has been that the SG fuel consumption indication is very slow to respond at best
I guess whether it's slow or not depends which gauge you're using . Tank average? Slow to change (unless you just filled & reset). Trip average? Depends on trip length. Instant? Not slow, by definition!

Like Robert: I have the TRIP mpg up as one of my gauges, along with instant MPG - because I drive with load (DWL) a lot, and use instant to stick to a target MPG on the open road.

As Daox says, you're already doing decently. Without seeing your driving first hand, I'd guess the remaining big gains are to be found on the freeway portion (by slowing down, or taking an alternate slower route), and in the "light traffic and 10 stoplights" portion where your anticipation, momentum preservation and EOC opportunities come up, and a bunch of unavoidable hard stops can flush 50 mpg pretty quickly. (Pulse and glide is a potential tool too, if you're comfortable/skilled enough to do it safely in a way that doesn't negatively affect other drivers.)
__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-2009, 04:07 PM   #17 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Earth
Posts: 5,209
Thanks: 225
Thanked 811 Times in 594 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MetroMPG View Post
I guess whether it's slow or not depends which gauge you're using . Tank average? Slow to change (unless you just filled & reset). Trip average? Depends on trip length. Instant? Not slow, by definition!
Bad definition :-) It's the SG's "instant" mpg display (or the gallons per hour variety). Compare it to the instant display of the Insight (and I suppose any other car that has one), and you'll see that its response is far from instant. A good example is when you're driving down a level road in conditionw where the Insight spends most of its time in lean burn mode, but drops out every couple of minutes to do the purge of the secondary catalyst. You'll feel it happening, and see the Insight's display drop from around 75-100 mpg to 50-60 mpg. The SG won't even notice. You can also be getting 75+ mpg per Insight display with 50 mpg showing on the SG. (The Insight figures are backed up by trip miles & fillups.)

The SG's a neat piece of work, but in my experience all the fuel consumption-related displays are more like wild guesses than actual measurements. IIRC, the SG makers even admit this: they don't measure fuel consumption directly, but infer it from other OBDII measurements.
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-2009, 05:31 PM   #18 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Helena Mt
Posts: 37

01 Insight - '01 Honda Insight DX
Team Honda
90 day: 67.82 mpg (US)
Thanks: 2
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
The reason the numbers between the insights FCD and the Scangauge don't match up is because of the lean burn.

The scan gauge doesn't monitor weather you are in lean burn or not. so it bases its calculations on a air/fuel ratio of 14.7:1 and assumes that this number does not change.

Last edited by mtgeekman; 12-29-2009 at 06:26 PM..
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-29-2009, 06:04 PM   #19 (permalink)
Pokémoderator
 
cfg83's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southern California
Posts: 5,864

1999 Saturn SW2 - '99 Saturn SW2 Wagon
Team Saturn
90 day: 40.49 mpg (US)
Thanks: 439
Thanked 530 Times in 356 Posts
mtgeekman -

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtgeekman View Post
The reason the numbers between the insights FCD and the Scangauge done match up is because of the lean burn.

The scan gauge doesn't monitor weather you are in lean burn or not. so it bases its calculations on a air/fuel ratio of 14.7:1 and assumes that this number does not change.
That's what I was thinking. The SG is a (very good) Jack-Of-All-Trades, so it doesn't do as well with cars that employ special MPG strategies like lean-burn.

If the OBDII protocol had specified some kind of (averaged?) fuel injector pulse-width, or just a plain instant-MPG parameter, then the SG would be more accurate. However, that would have made cheaper copy-cats more accurate too, so the "luster" of the SG would not be as great.

CarloSW2
__________________

What's your EPA MPG? Go Here and find out!
American Solar Energy Society
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-30-2009, 11:23 AM   #20 (permalink)
Batman Junior
 
MetroMPG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: 1000 Islands, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 22,513

Blackfly - '98 Geo Metro
Team Metro
Last 3: 70.09 mpg (US)

MPGiata - '90 Mazda Miata
90 day: 52.71 mpg (US)

Even Fancier Metro - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage top spec
90 day: 70.75 mpg (US)

Appliance car - '14 Mitsubishi Mirage ES (base)
90 day: 60.16 mpg (US)
Thanks: 4,058
Thanked 6,957 Times in 3,602 Posts
True. The SG doesn't speak "lean burn" in its MPG calcs. MPGuino does, however.

__________________
Project MPGiata! Mods for getting 50+ MPG from a 1990 Miata
Honda mods: Ecomodding my $800 Honda Fit 5-speed beater
Mitsu mods: 70 MPG in my ecomodded, dirt cheap, 3-cylinder Mirage.
Ecodriving test: Manual vs. automatic transmission MPG showdown



EcoModder
has launched a forum for the efficient new Mitsubishi Mirage
www.MetroMPG.com - fuel efficiency info for Geo Metro owners
www.ForkenSwift.com - electric car conversion on a beer budget
  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
I am not the only nut on the tree. Thunder Introductions 5 10-18-2010 12:02 PM
Cost for adjusting valves ? Cd Off-Topic Tech 3 11-30-2009 07:02 PM
61 Old car nut racprops Introductions 2 10-06-2009 07:33 PM
Another FNG Gas Saving Nut bnmorgan Introductions 11 08-02-2009 04:20 PM
Scooter and Citroen Nut in New Zealand scissorhands Introductions 2 07-11-2008 04:18 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com