Lincoln, please take my money.

[jcp123]

Diff'rent strokes. I tried the handling thing (Focus ZTS in high school, where I was near lots of twisty hill roads, later an SVT Focus), it didn't really appeal to me that much. The Echo is more than satisfying enough for me in the corners, and it's not that good at it. Speaking of the Echo, it uses the torsion beam setup which seems to be a decent enough compromise.

IRS does not in and of itself make a sporty handling car though. The spring and shock rates have to work, plus the geometry of the setup, and weight balance plays a big role too. Then there's the centre of gravity, the roll centre...it goes on and on.

[ksa8907]

Never drove anything but irs, my cts handles exceptionally well. I took a corner a c poo uple weeks ago at about 45 and not even a slip. My intrepid would have been in the other lane at 40.

[Xist]

http://i.imgur.com/R2DtqME.gif

[Arragonis]

That ^ is more to do with the engine and right foot being in the wrong places.

[Fat Charlie]

Even in identical cars, different speeds can get you different results.

[UltArc]

Originally Posted by Arragonis

Having IRS vs a solid axle doesn't mean a car becomes less "involved" - just drive a Mk1 MX5 as a worked example. Having a solid axle in the 21st century just seems lazy on the part of the maker though.

But would one rather have the most advanced and developed live rear axle available, or go for this IRS? The reviews I've read haven't been overwhelmingly positive. I guess when they start on the IRS, it should be a model I couldn't care less about. Hopefully the 2018 has lost weight, gained power, and is all tuned up. Especially since the next generation camaro is supposed to be absurdly good. Ford will have to do more than just change the looks.

[ksa8907]

Originally Posted by UltArc

But would one rather have the most advanced and developed live rear axle available, or go for this IRS? The reviews I've read haven't been overwhelmingly positive. I guess when they start on the IRS, it should be a model I couldn't care less about. Hopefully the 2018 has lost weight, gained power, and is all tuned up. Especially since the next generation camaro is supposed to be absurdly good. Ford will have to do more than just change the looks.

Ill go a little off topic here. The camaro is really a toy, not a car to drive every day. I test drove one and would have bought it, but the view from the drivers seat is horrible! I felt like I had blinders on!

[freebeard]

2018? — whoa! I blinked.

Xist -- that Porsche looks pretty well sorted to me. Oversteer rules.

I'm thinking about replacing the swing axles in my 1958 Beetle with a DeDion axle and a Model T Ford hairpin spring.

[War_Wagon]

Freebeard, what about a Corvette semi elliptical setup instead of 100 year old Ford stuff? Not that there's anything wrong with that ha ha My Miami Vice '86 Vette has been the biggest money pit I've ever owned, and I actually hate that car now because it's still broken and I can't get rid of it, but man they had a lot of good ideas for Corvettes. It was the execution that was, er, lackluster to say the least.

[freebeard]

I may not have been competely serious, although I do have a '58 Beetle.

I was trying to paint a picture of regressing a 30s IRS with a 00-20s solid axle, that would arguably improve the handling. The 'Vette monoleaf is from a different era.


http://www.est1946.com/so-calmodela-stylerearspring.aspx

With Teflon buttons between the leaves, they ride as nice as a monoleaf. The DeDion axle would be like in a Rover, with the stock VW axleshafts and a splined section (like a driveshaft) in the axle itself.

I mis-spoke, its called a buggy spring, Hairpins are locating bars halfway between split radius rods and 4-bars. One of which it might need, although I'd incline toward a Superbeetle front sway bar to replace the trailing arms.