VW ID.4 Revealed - Reservations Open

[Hersbird]

The #1 cost in owning a Tesla at least will be the insurance. The next highest cost will probably be the tires especially if you enjoy that acceleration all the time, and replace with factory similar spec tires. Hopefully on the VW ID4 insurance will be better, and the less weight and power maybe keep tires around longer. I know the higher trim ID4 get 20" wheels, anybody know what the base gets? Hopefully not 19, that is the worst decision any car company can make for a wheel size that basically doubles replacement costs. You are better off paying more for the 20s initially. 18s or even better yet 17s or 16s are the best for long term lowered costs.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by Hersbird

Electricity costs are not a tiny fraction of fuel costs. They may be lower, but not insignificant. Even if it was free, at 10,000 miles a year you only spend about $3600 in gas and I don't even drive that much. It would take me 10 years probably to recover a $5000 difference and we don't get any state credits, nor do I qualify for a full $7500 federal credit so it would be more like a $10,000 difference and take me more like 30 years to break even considering electricity isn't actually free.

My actual numbers for fuel costs / mile:

$0.027 = 2016 Spark EV
$0.069 = 2009 Toyota Prius
$0.082 = 2014 VW Sportwagen TDI

The cost for the EV is the electrical usage multiplied by my electric rate because about 90% of my charging was done at work for free

Fueleconomy*gov calculates the FWD Tiguan at $0.087 / mile

If you donÂ’t make enough to qualify for the full federal tax credit you can lease the vehicle and the leasing company will get the full credit. You then negotiate for them to roll the full credit value into the deal. They donÂ’t have to do it but most will. In general manufacturers are throwing more cash on the hood in addition to the credit.

The numbers may not work for you but they do for me.

EDIT: At 3 cents per mile x 10,000 miles per year = $300 a year for fuel costs / $25 per month / $0.82 per day.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by Piotrsko

Anymore, who here besides me buys a this year new model car in cash*? Not being disrespectful, but pretty much everybody does easy monthly payments, so perhaps those need to reflect the average operating costs instead. This would mean a different cost /mile parameter that would actually reference what the public is doing.

*Actually check, that much cash is apparently illegal now.

I buy 3 year old vehicles with cash. Actual cash not a check. It isn’t illegal to pay for a vehicle with cash and it happens more often then you think. If you pay more than $10k in cash the dealer has to fill out a form and send it to the feds.

When I bought my 2009 Prius I was chatting while the finance person was doing the paperwork and asked how many cash sales they get. He said about a dozen a week including a guy that day who purchased a $60k truck with cash.

[redpoint5]

Originally Posted by Hersbird

The #1 cost in owning a Tesla at least will be the insurance.

Not even close. Open my spreadsheet and plug some numbers in there. The #1 cost of owning any vehicle by far is depreciation. The only people with higher expenses than depreciation are purchasing 10+ year old vehicles.

Besides all that, I've gotten quotes for Tesla vehicles before and found them to be less than other lower cost vehicles such as the Chevy Bolt. It all depends on what kind of insurance you're shopping for and other demographic information.

Of course your underlining point that you don't purchase a Tesla for financial reasons is absolutely right.

Originally Posted by JSH

I buy 3 year old vehicles with cash. Actual cash not a check. It isn’t illegal to pay for a vehicle with cash and it happens more often then you think.

I bought my truck from an Ebay auction and paid ODOT in person with $6,300 in cash. I bought my 2 year old (at the time) motorcycle for $5,000 in cash from an Ebay auction. I bought my reconstructed title Prius plug-in from an ad in Craigslist with $13k in cash. I bought a 2014 top trim Ford C-max (OfferUp) for a friend with $7k cash. Cash is a bargaining strategy because it shows the person you're serious about purchasing, and they won't have to visit a bank with you, and they don't have to worry about any fraudulent checks or anything.

[NeilBlanchard]

We have been emailing with the salesperson at our VW dealer, and we now now that the ID.4 1st Edition will not have a heat pump (in the US) and will not have a direct heating windshield defroster, and it won't have a heated rear seat.

It will have a trailer hitch, heated front seats and steering wheel.

It will coast by default in D, and has a B mode with lots of regen integrated onto the accelerator pedal.

[freebeard]

https://www.tesla.com/blog/introducing-tesla-insurance

Starting today, we’re launching Tesla Insurance, a competitively priced insurance offering designed to provide Tesla owners with up to 20% lower rates, and in some cases as much as 30%. Tesla Insurance offers comprehensive coverage and claims management to support our customers in California, and it will expand to additional U.S. states in the future.

[redpoint5]

Yeah, very interesting. If Tesla thinks their cars are capable of avoiding liability more than others, this is their opportunity to put their money where their mouth is.

[JSH]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

We have been emailing with the salesperson at our VW dealer, and we now now that the ID.4 1st Edition will not have a heat pump (in the US) and will not have a direct heating windshield defroster, and it won't have a heated rear seat.

It will have a trailer hitch, heated front seats and steering wheel.

It will coast by default in D, and has a B mode with lots of regen integrated onto the accelerator pedal.

That is very disappointing. In the winter 1/3 to 1/2 of my energy consumption was from running resistance heater in my Spark EV.

[Piotrsko]

Originally Posted by redpoint5

Yeah, very interesting. If Tesla thinks their cars are capable of avoiding liability more than others, this is their opportunity to put their money where their mouth is.

Insurance companies are a noted source of huge amounts of cash with risk spread out all over the place to buffer that cash. Has Elon found a new cashflow problem?

[redpoint5]

Elon likes to be vertically integrated. Boring company will own the roads, battery factory to own the battery tech, they own their chargers, now insurance...

If you need your Roadster moved to space, they've got a rocket to do that too.