6+ Passenger Vehicles
 

Starting a thread to begin thinking about vehicles that seat 6 or more people.

More seats are better, but efficiency and utility are considerations as well, but price is a huge factor as well (prefer to buy used). Hoping people (especially Jason) weigh in as I get closer to actually buying a new vehicle, which is probably at least 1 year away. Would love to get an EV or PHEV, or hybrid at minimum.

On my radar at the moment;

Pacifica PHEV - 7 seat minivan
CyberTruck - 6 seat EV truck
Model S - 7 seat option EV
Model Y - 7 seat option EV
Model X - 7 seat option EV
Sienna - 8 seat hybrid
Carnival - 11 seat minivan

Open to other suggestions. I know there are large SUVs with 7 seats that I'm not so familiar with. Options like the Model X or S are probably off the table due to price, and the fact that 7 seats in the S is a bit of a joke.

No Previa?

https://momentcar.com/images/1991-previa-2.jpg
https://momentcar.com/images/1991-previa-2.jpg

Might as well throw this one on my list;

https://www.topgear.com/sites/defaul...12/1-3-882.jpg

Tell corporate they're the same picture?

For reasonably priced hybrids that get decent fuel economy the only other one I can think of is the Toyota Highlander Hybrid that has 3 rows and can seat up to 8.

The Ford Explorer is also available with 3 rows as a hybrid but it is only rated at 25 mpg vs 35 for the Highlander. Of course the Ford is also 320 hp / 320 lb-ft while the Highlander makes do with 240 hp. The Ford uses the hybrid to add performance while the Highlander is about fuel economy


For an odd-ball choice - my ambulance came with seating for 7 plus one strapped to the gurney. Very roomy as well. :)

I saw an older stretch limo at Silver Falls State Park on Sunday.

I keep thinking it would be nice to confine kid chaos to the back, with the privacy glass up.

Mitsubishi Outlander?

The regular one starts at $28k but only gets 27mpg EPA.

There is a PHEV version, but it does start at $40k.

Of course that's looking at brand new. As far as I can tell, you'll have to look hard for a good deal on any used vehicle still. Hopefully in a year or so used car prices get closer to normal.

I have never seen any Kia other than the Besta and Pregio, AFAIK none of them available stateside, with more than 8 seats. But anyway, even though it could eventually seem overkill, if you could get an 11-seater Kia Carnival, might be worth...

What I like is the rear seats fold under, and the other rows are removable, so the van can be anywhere from 2 seats, to 11. Very versatile.

https://cdn.totallythebomb.com/wp-co...-carnival.jpeg

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/wp-cont...Arrangment.jpg

I like that there's opportunity to fit 2 families in there. Too bad it's not a hybrid.

And too bad it's not available in the USofA. (Please correct me someone!!! Tell me I'm wrong!!!)

AFAIK the US-spec never get more than 8 seats. I guess the 11-seater caters to either some countries in Asia and Africa or to Australia in order to ensure some tax breaks, yet I'm not sure about its availability in Australia.

Screw that then, going with something more fuel efficient.

Too bad the Diesel versions are also not available stateside. Otherwise I guess it would've been a winner.

On a sidenote, I don't know why Hyundai doesn't offer the Staria there, would've been a great option.

20ish years ago we ran into a family in Death Valley driving an old stretch limo. They had 6 kids and said the limo: was cheaper, drove better, and got better fuel economy than the vans they had before.

Diesel is not a winner in the USA. It only made sense when diesel was cheaper than gasoline and diesels had lower emissions standards.

Today:

1. A diesel engine costs thousands more than a gas engine
2. Diesel cost more gasoline. (US national average $3.53 gas / $3.92 diesel)
3. In the USA if anything goes wrong with the emission system of a diesel vehicle it will go into limp mode after about 500 miles.

Diesel still makes sense if you are towing heavy loads or doing a lot of highway driving but diesel does not make sense for a family vehicle. They REALLY don't do well for city driving

A DI turbo gas engine will do as well as a diesel for total cost to own and a hybrid will do better.

This is pretty much the reason I would prefer a station wagon over a crossover. In fact, a three row station wagon would be the perfect family hauler in my opinion.

Ya, I get it. But I am a little nostalgic for diesel cars. Still, it makes sense why they're pretty much gone.

I just wish there were still some manual transmission hybrids. That would be fun to me.

I'd still rather pick the 4-cyl 2.2L turbodiesel over the 3.5L V6 gasser if I had a chance. Well, had some amendment to the driver licensing in my country been implemented to allow holders of a regular driver license to drive anything with more than 9 seats, that 11-seater version of the Carnival with a turbodiesel would've been more appealing here just like it is in some Asian countries.

After watching some Alex Dikes videos on minivans, I'm leaning towards the 8-seat Sienna hybrid. Now for used pricing to back away from the absurd.

Maybe something not sucky will appear on the list of available options from my company fleet list. Last time I checked, they had 3 options, 2 of which were unavailable, leaving a Ford F150 as the only choice. Makes me miss the 2014 Grand Caravan I was initially issued, which shifted rough and wasn't fuel efficient. I don't pay for fuel though, so it's not a big factor in my selection criteria.

Both the Toyota and the F-150 are the most conservative choices, even though the hybrid setup of the Sienna may be seen by some as not so conservative at all... But anyway, does the F-150 still have a front bench seat or other accomodation for a 2nd passenger in the front row? I believed only Chevy still had such option nowadays.

I'm quite the liberal person; more liberal that most.

That said, I am leaning towards the Sienna due to assumed reliability, fuel efficiency, and 8-seat option. It's $40k though, and used examples are still expensive.

The Sienna seats aren't removable, so that limits utility. The Pacifica seats are removable, but reliability is assumed to be worse. It's more expensive, but subsidies bring it around where the expensive Sienna is.

Maybe I'll get a CyberTruck.

My Dodge truck has 3 passengers up front. Unfortunately (or fortunately) all the rest have to sit in the bed.

The seats in the bed aren't so bad. My buddy Tom on our trip to Silver Lake.
https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1683960196

(wife disapproves of children riding back there, and the beer)

Without seat belts and roll protection, chair restraints it's also mildly illegal for highway use

Not in Oregon. If all seat belts are in use, extra passengers can ride in the bed.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_BRAT

IIRC it was illegal to remove those seats while the vehicle was under warranty.

No it wasn't illegal, it just voided the warranty unless the dealership removed them. Also made a vendor of mine have to buy commercial truck plates because they were registered as cars in Cali. Without the seats, Cali decided they were trucks

When I said conservative, it was from a technical standpoint, not political. You know, Toyota became a safe/conservative choice for most.

I know, just shaking the box a little.

OK. Back on topic: would anything like that, to be implemented in a Tacoma, be at least barely legal there?
https://carryboyminibus.com/

Last time I purchased a vehicle was the 2012 Prius plug-in in 2015. Sold that to a friend, so the next newest purchase is my 2006 Acura TSX purchased in 2010...

Well I'm getting pressured now to either pick a vehicle on the company menu, or purchase my own vehicle and be reimbursed $500/mo.

The menu has delivered something I want;

Chrysler Pacifica Hybrid
Tesla Model 3 Long Range AWD
Toyota bZ4X
Toyota Venza LE AWD

I'd be fine with the Pacifica or the Tesla (would still have to buy a minivan in that case).

Leaning towards buying my own vehicle and letting the company pay for it. Haven't finished the spreadsheet yet, but this is what's on the radar at the moment.

Kia EV9 $56,395
Sienna LE $38,580
Model X $83,500
Cybertruck $69,000
Pacifica Hybrid $51,000
R1S
Kia Sorento PHEV $51,315
Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV

I'm probably going to be deciding between Pacifica plug-in, or Sienna. Thoughts?

Which one?

You didn't read my mind where I assumed I had sufficiently explained internal thoughts? :p

I meant to say that I could get the Model 3 "on menu" as my vehicle, and then separately buy a minivan for kid hauling.

Here's the rub, the company doesn't reimburse electricity costs for any vehicle "on menu", so there's no incentive to plug in (gas is paid for on the company gas card). For me to have any incentive to plug in, I need to own the vehicle and be responsible for fuel (electricity) costs.

All signs point to me purchasing a vehicle and accepting the ~$500/mo company financial assistance.

I can't see you paying $60,000 - $80,000 for a vehicle even if your company is going to pitch in $500 a month. ($80K is a $1,100 a month payment)

You won't actually get a Cybertruck, R1S, or EV9 this year.

Personally I would take the $500 a month if you expect to be working for this company for a few years - let them buy you a car that you keep after you quit.

If you want an EV:

Hyundai is leasing the Ioniq 6 for $349 a month with $5000 down. (So really $430 a month.) The SEL is $14 more a month. You will have to carry an adapter to use superchargers.

https://www.hyundaiusa.com/us/en/veh...c=aw.ds#offers

A Model 3 2WD is $40K but doesn't get the $7500 tax credit if you buy. Tesla says you can lease it for $329 a month with $4500 down ($455 a month)

A Model 3 LR AWD is $40K right now after the $7500 tax credit taken as a point of sale rebate. That is a $585 a month car payment.

Dollars and cents

You want a minivan and $500 a month will just about pay for the Sienna. Why not let your company buy you a minivan. (Of course that assumes you are going to be working for this company and getting a car stipend for 8 years - I'm assuming you are going to max the loan term as you like using other people's money) Also - as I understand it gas is free but you pay for electricity out of pocket even when travelling for work.

I need to clarify further; if I choose "on menu", I pay $100/mo to allow myself and wife to drive the vehicle for personal travel. It includes a gas card for unlimited fuel on the company dime. Nobody else is permitted to drive the vehicle, including baby sitters or parents.

If I choose to purchase my own vehicle, I get reimbursed ~$500/mo for whatever I choose. Must not be more than 4 years old. No gas card, but business miles are reimbursed at 25 cents/mile. I'm responsible for all expenses, but that means others can drive the vehicle.

Extra info; if I buy an EV "on menu", home charging is not reimbursed, but business travel would be on the corporate credit card when using DCFC. Getting the stipend provides me the incentive to choose efficiency since I pocket the savings.

The questions then is, Toyota Sienna or Pacifica hybrid?

Ah - so $500 a month is really $600 a month when taking into account the $100 you aren't paying the company to use the company car. Most definitely buy and take the $500 then.

Sienna vs Pacifica? Personal preference - they cost about the same after the $7,500 Fed and $2,500 State credits. (Note the Oregon tax credit has not been reauthorized yet - it ran out of money last year and hasn't received the 2024 pot of money yet)

Do you drive more highway or city miles? Pacifica has a clear advantage in the city but on highway it is only rated at 30 mpg vs 35 for the Sienna. Do you care about AWD - Sienna has it / Pacifica doesn't. Do you trust a Chrysler product?

It seems clear that taking the stipend is the better financial move, but for those who don't want to bother maintaining a vehicle, insurance, etc, getting on menu is the way to go. It covers absolutely everything. I would also have to log every business trip I take if I go the stipend route, which is annoying.

Daily my wife drives 5 minutes to school, then 5 minutes to her work, then 5 minutes back home at the end of the day.

That said, I'm thinking to give the vehicle to the baby sitter so she's not having to drive her car (and leave child seats in it) when she takes the kids places.

The only out of town driving is occasional camping trips, but when we have 3 kids I'm considering driving to Colorado (20hrs) instead of flying. Undecided on that considering winter driving can be a poor choice.

I don't trust Chrysler products. The Town and Country I drove for a year didn't have a smooth transmission that inspired long term confidence. Nothing on my Dodge Ram 2500 is reliable except the Cummins motor. I was hoping you had more input on the reliability/repair front.

The other thing is the Sienna came out in 2020, but the Pacifica is getting long in the tooth at 2017, we're into the 7th year of that design. The new model has to drop any moment.

I don't have any insider info on Chrysler reliability. My personal experience was poor but that was in the 90's so is irrelevant today. On the other hand they rate poor on pretty much every industrial rating.

The Pacifica Hybrid has been recalled multiple times for the battery. Somebody here on Ecomodder has or had one.

Below in the JD Power dependability ratings which are based on the first 3 years of ownership. It is a general indicator but I don't find it very useful because it only record complaints not real problems and all complaints are rated the same. Somebody that complains they can't figure out how to pair their phone is waited the same as an engine failure.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...5&d=1706136983

The Kia EV9 looks interesting and is in the same price neighborhood as the Pacifica... but I simply can't justify spending $50k on a vehicle that's going to get trashed by kids.

I'm seeing a couple 2021 Pacifica hybrids listed for ~$24k, which seems too good to be true considering these are $50k new. $24k sounds reasonable to me. I set 2021 as the oldest I would consider because I can't get anything more than 4 years old, and the Pacifica got some updates in that year.

or - don't let your kids trash the car. My parents had a no eating / no drinking in the car rule until we were in our teens. How else do kids trash cars besides spilling crap all over? I guess if you have kids with motion sickness issues that could be a problem.

They aren't $50K new - they are $40K after credits and rebates. 40% depreciation in 3 years sounds right.

During summer I see a reasonable amount of 7-seater and 8-seater JDM Toyota minivans with Paraguayan plates. Their size is often more convenient than a stereotypical American minivan.

If you could smuggle a beauty like this from Mexico...
https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...ro-direito.jpg
https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...o-esquerdo.jpg
Or at least a bodyshell to adapt to a Tacoma frame, just like some folks did with Brazilian Toyota Bandeirante bodyshells some years ago...

I failed to update this thread. Ended up buying a 2021 Pacifica plug-in hybrid July 2024 for $22,000 and the federal tax credit made the out the door price $18,000.

In the summer, it gets 30 miles of EV range, and 30 MPG when running as a hybrid.
https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1740641280

First adventure was picking up 5 Hood to Coast teammates I had never met before, and then running the relay.
https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1740642199

Full team
https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1740641280

Took the van into the mountains in November to hunt a couple of Christmas trees.
https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1740641280