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Lazarus 02-19-2010 04:24 PM

Air car (video of compressed air powered vehicle)
 
This is old news but I not seen this commercial/info. Don't know if this has been posted but there some good video of the air car. 200 miles on a charge top speed of 60 and around 15k to buy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztFDq...layer_embedded

captainslug 02-19-2010 04:43 PM

We've discussed this at length here before.
Their business model is very shady, and the efficiency is just not there.
Too much of the power inputted is wasted as heat.

Costs nothing? Of course it cost money. Money in electricity to compress the air into the tanks. An air tank is just like a battery, but it's energy per weight and volume is meager and they're more dramatically affected by temperature.

Complete bull****.

NiHaoMike 02-19-2010 07:36 PM

Compressed air is capable of much higher power flow than batteries and much cheaper than large capacitors, which is especially useful for braking. As such, it is really useful to complement batteries rather than replace them.

Also note that it might be possible to build a mild hybrid with compressed air for much cheaper than by adding batteries.
Air start system - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

rmay635703 02-21-2010 09:49 AM

Actually it is possible to compress air using an "open" water/hydraulic system that is nearly 100% efficient, no different than using the ocean's pressure to compress air. Also the water/oil can be cycled and cooled taking advantage of environmental temperature.

Also temperature provides a unique opportunity to compress in cold hi pressure environments and use in lower pressure warmer environments.

I think compressed air cars could have a usage much the same as a short distance AC powered EV but likely at less cost.

Since we consider things like hydrogen, which are much more infrastructure intensive and also not efficient, I don't think this should be completely dismissed, just needs time to be developed like anything else.

And obviously its limitations must be acceptable to the person using the tech.

I remember an individual on AM550 radio that was running his dodge V8 off a compressed air system he developed and it was a hybred in that he could shut off all the valves and run as gas after the conversion.

He had a large tank in the bed that he filled at gas stations. He range was 25 miles at 25MPH.

Interesting fringe item, older guy if I remember, I have been trying to find him listed on the internet but couldn't find anything, the guys on the radio who drove with him thought it was dumb and ridiculed him, I would like to see how he did it and controlled it.

Another mention of using air has been on cave systems which almost always are blowing or sucking air, an ambient system could be used to take advantage of day to day variations in pressure to produce energy.

Interesting stuff but likely a long way off.

Cheers
Ryan

thatguitarguy 02-21-2010 11:27 AM

You'd have to have a thick skin. I see plenty of ridicule, even on this site, for people with different ideas. People will definitely say that 25MPH for 25 miles is not feasible for any practical usage, but I know it's faster than I can pedal for that far, and I'm damn sure not pedaling a Dodge V8.

Ryland 02-21-2010 12:18 PM

I would think using compressed air with a gas engine could work ok, as one produces heat as a waste product and the other produces cold.
Another option would be a good size venturi with a compressed air tank to replace a turbo.

captainslug 02-21-2010 01:29 PM

There's a great deal of information on this subject crammed into this one page.
Quote:

The environmental and cost claims by Air Car advocates are even more exaggerated. Air compressors, even up to 100 times the size that any local station would consider purchasing, are extremely inefficient. In principle, it may be possible to compress air to 260 bar at about 75% efficiency, but 12% to 30% is more typical. The small (5.5 hp) compressors that individuals might purchase for charging their tanks overnight at home will consume about 60 kWhr of energy to fill the tanks with about 9 kWhr of (gross) energy. Thatís about 15% efficiency. At $0.12/kWhr (expected US mean price in 2010), consumers would be paying $7.20 to fill their tanks. Thatís like paying $13/gal to fill a Prius.
Compressed Air Energy Storage (CAES)

There's simply nothing inherently efficient or cheap about a compressed air drive system. Even the most anemic and cheap electric drive setups will outperform compressed air in both price and practicality.

Bicycle Bob 02-21-2010 01:51 PM

If you can use the heat of compression for home heating, and re-warm the air with huge heat exchangers on the vehicle, between expansion stages, you can get some of the same over-unity efficiencies we see with heat pumps. However, the Air Car people ignore the danger of air tanks. Needing no oxygen mixing to release their full energy, they are like high explosive. Historically, air-powered vehicles in mines have had a short range, despite steam-boiler sized tanks.

rmay635703 02-22-2010 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thatguitarguy (Post 162172)
You'd have to have a thick skin. I see plenty of ridicule, even on this site, for people with different ideas. People will definitely say that 25MPH for 25 miles is not feasible for any practical usage, but I know it's faster than I can pedal for that far, and I'm damn sure not pedaling a Dodge V8.

My folks own an NEV that goes roughly 25mph at 25miles at the moment, there are many circumstances where such vehicles are feasable, just like a bicycle is feasible more often than people guess.


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