Bike that can tow a trailer?
 

I'm trying to find the most efficient way to tow a small trailer (perhaps up to a 4x4 size if doable?) with the highest MPG motorcycle available to do the job. This seems to have the potential to be more efficient than even a Geo Metro with a little trailer combination and should be fine for puttering around town and buying alot of groceries for instance now and then.

Two recommendations fine - one for city only (say up to 35mph) and one for highway legal. (highway legal doesn't have to be 70mph under load, just "dont arrest me" speed, maybe 55)


The problem is I have no clue how you even add a hitch to a motorcycle, which ones can take them (all standards? any 650cc v-twin sportbikes by chance for few/infrequent pulling??), and how it affects performance. If it were up to me i'd putter around on a Kawasaki Eliminator 125cc - I know towing a load is alot less stressful than carrying it on the back, i've seen 500lbs moved by a bicycle before on flat ground, but i'm not sure at what point it unsettles the bike, can't pull even a minor hill at city speeds, gets unsafe, or whatever. Any recommendations?

I know my dad had dreams of pulling a teardrop trailer with his Harley Elctraglide classic. (about 100 cubic inches) Far away from efficient but, I think getting a good top case and incorporating that into some streamlined bodywork would be best. I have a Buell Ulysses (1203cc) with a topcase, I used to play "what will fit in my bike today?"

So the big question is how many groceries are you grabbing at once?

This is definitely the question. the most efficient way to carry a large , and heavy load might be a trailer, but if you are going to carry 5 or less paper bags worth of groceries at a time, you might want to consider a Vetter style tail. I am currently working on making tooling so that I can make mine easily repeatable, and it will carry five full paper grocery bags. that is almost a full standard grocery cart load. it also seems to be more than enough for all the gear necessary for a camping trip. if you only need to be able to go 55mph, you could pair a 150cc scooter with a tail like mine, and it would be no problem. My SR185 does 85mph in the streamlined bodywork, and I get around 100mpg.

Just my $.02.

The pulling vehicle needs to be a fair bit heavier than the loaded trailer, otherwise handling can suffer badly and what can be a problem with a car can kill you on a motorbike.

Also, bikes already suffer from a lot of weight transfer when braking hard, if you add to this the kinetic energy of the loaded trailer, that's a recipe for disaster.

So the question remains : what do you need to carry ?

People all over the world tow with all sorts of vehicles. Heck you already know that a bicycle will tow two small children in a trailer. Some people even put bicycle trailers on minibikes and small motorcycles.

Scaling this idea up is pretty much a trial and error affair. Learning a little from those who have done it I probably woudn't want to trailer more than about 75% of the weight of the bike and rider combination. Maybe 50% to be safe.

Pick your bike and go from there. Keep the trailer as light as possible to maximize the useful load capacity.

For small motorcycle trailers, the hitch is usually mounted on the swingarm - I've seen them one-sided (with a small ball joint) and two-sided (with a EU standard ball-hitch).

Goldwings are used to tow cars in Japan and the UK - they can easily get through congestion to get to the stranded vehicle. That means they tow up to about 4 times their weight.

Okay I guess i'll do this more in depth. :) Please keep in mind my interest is on the MOTORCYCLE not the trailer, i'm solely interested in how to put a hitch on when literally every motorcycle manufacturer I talked to says its not recommended yet people clearly do it.


If building my own trailer I will probably use or start with one of those "CarGo" type rooftop carriers on a frame for the majority (not all) of use. They start already streamlined, are light, are lockable, and do the job. I'd have it removable for if I need to haul something bigger or less aerodynamic - i'd actually like to extend the frame or something to haul a couple of sheet goods (4x8 feet) on top of it. Not superheavy, and not fast - more like things like 4x8 sheets of 4 inch thick styrofoam insulation taken out of freezers for other projects, which are bad enough aero stacked up I wouldn't exceed 35mph anyways. Or the occasional couple sheets of plywood for a project when it doesn't justify using the minivan or car trailer. The latter would be unlikely to exceed 150lbs normally, more than 3 sheets and i'm likely to borrow the minivan.

How much groceries at once? Well technically alot more than groceries thats just a figure of speech, I buy and reuse alot of stuff so pick up all kinds of things from Rock Band drumkits to repair and resell (which are real bulky but light) to scrap windows i'm saving for a greenhouse project to anything else imaginable including weightlifting plates when cheap, and I normally pick up multiple things on a single trip to save more gas - better one zigzagging 4 hour trip around town and a full trailer, than going all the way out and back home one load at a time. It's fully possible that a geo metro with a little 4x6 trailer will do a better job but I want to research all possibilities first plus I kinda want a bike anyway just for when i'm not hauling the trailer. :)

My max load goal is 500lbs - Even 500lbs of trailer will be less than me + the bike and even 500lbs at 35mph should be less brake load than unladen at 70mph - the sole questions are balance and a properly mounted hitch that wont tear the frame when you hit the brakes or unbalance the bike unnecessarily. The request for highway speed as an option would not be combined with a "full weight" of up to 500lbs ever, it would be one or the other - it's just there are legs of traveling around the twin cities in MN that REQUIRE you to be on the highway for a brief period - so the ability to pull up to 55mph for up to a few miles to cross one of our stupid rivers before I can pull back into town is vastly preferred. Sometimes there is a "through town" way to do it that's 10 miles out of the way, and since that's crossed nearly every time I go shopping that kills a few extra mpg savings.


My problem is I cant even search stupid google for "motorcycle trailer" without getting 100% trailers that haul motorcycles, rather than trailers hauled BY motorcycles... there is zero way to differentiate to the search engine what I want and mean so I can't even find if there are good forums for this. Plus most people haul with big stupid 900cc cruisers too but there's no point to a 900lb motorcycle getting 35mpg, my sole focus is on efficiency of moving the loads. If a 125cc can do it (they can reach 55-60mph on flat roads normally) around town on the flat i'm happy, if that fails 250cc is fine too. Much bigger than that and I fear a Geo Metro makes more sense because the "huge mileage benefit" rapidly slides. I might even rig up some kind of electric or surge brake for the trailer, we'll see.

It sounds stupid but i'd actually like to stick a hitch on a Ninja 250 if possible - i'm aware that is a sportbike, but it's what people are getting 100mpg with here. I don't know why it should be any stronger or weaker framewise than a 250cc standard like a Rebel or something so I figure why not. The only previous hitch on a standard i've seen up close involved four attachment points to pieces of frame, I don't know if thats standard or not. And a "500 pound trailer" I don't think is insane when i've seen 500lbs moved on mormon handcarts and by bicycles on flat ground, hell I saw two 300lb fat people on a single Ninja 250 that amazingly wasnt complaining and they rode it all day every day with both of them two up forever. What i'm doing is "not what it's designed for" but I think there are worse abuses - the linear loads should not be obscene, it's more likely a question of how the bike handles when it's say stopping and turning at the same time. Which at low speeds is less of a terror.

Worst case if it's too squirrely with 500lbs (which riding it would prove as I test it with added weight plates) I make a point to lower it to 350, or 250 or something unless i'm going 20mph ultra locally. I just want to know how I design or make a hitch that will put the load in the best place it can be, spreading it out for instance, and not upsetting it more than it has to, and mostly to not rip the frame of the bike going over a bump or pothole. :P The sole reason for "pushing limits" is the more I can do on the motorcycle the better the fuel economy vs having to do it with a car or small pickup. It's just i've heard 500lbs trailer on a decent sized standard shouldn't be that big of a deal - it fits within the classic "dont tow more than your tow vehicle weighs" limit, and though a 125/250 is maybe 90lbs lighter than a 650 they still have to have brakes to haul themself down from highway speeds and stuff just as competently. Even 300lbs towing is useful.

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PS to weight transfer on braking, as long as the force were transmitted to the rear of the bike, i'd wonder if it might even brake BETTER since the toungue weight of the trailer would counter the nosediving of the bike under hard braking.

Sure towing with a bike can be done, but thats a totally personal option! those who do pull anything usually arent riding a 250! Mostly cruisers of some sort.

Lower seat height, lower frame height, weight distrobution is favored to the mid/front of the bike(the rider evens that out) when riding. Avaliable hitches are usually mounted on the lowest point of the frame or FIRMLY mounted body fairing as close to the rear of the tire, safely.

Anything that ofsets the load "triangle" will already compromise the bike, unless ballast weight is added to the front, even a passenger of substatial weight disrupts this balance, will surely present unsafe conditions from the get-go.

Like Europe using Goldwings to navigate through traffic, deploy a rolling car skid, and tow the vehicle away. While its practical and economical, the bikes weight is about equal to the front of the car it must support/pull behind it on the skid. The frame and suspension have been beefed up as well to distribute the load as even as possible.

If this is a "just gotta do it" type things, I'd go with a 2cyl for torque with relative hefty weight >400lbs, with a Linked-Braking System of some sort. Buell comes to mind, while still being "sporty". But, for longivity and greater Load bearing design, virtualy anything Shaft Driven would be more suitable

HA, im a spaz and overlooked this paragraph(ghost scrolling), good you know and have the idea:thumbup: my bad

thats great, but i still think the biggest concern would be the "not what its designed for"... The 250 is made for its handling and ease of use "as is". and effectively the braking will suffer in points do to the fact even 300lb cargo x given speed would equal at least 3x the force for that little bike to efficiently stop such a load + the bike itself...

Nosediving is not a BAD thing, as long as its done properly. Your not trying to mash the brakes and stop so hard the bike raises up in the back! You are efficiently loading the suspension while coming to a stop which Aids your braking keeping the bike in your control!

Well look at what they do in vietnam and then what i'm doing seems downright safe. >_>

I'm mostly interested in seeing how far limits can reasonably be pushed, assuming changes in driving technique (if more rear braking required under load due to a different weight balance, that's fine, etc) and experimentation. If it only pulls 200lbs thats all it pulls. If it only pulls 100lbs i'll be surprised because my kid's tricycle pulls 100lbs, but whatever. >_< There has to at least be SOME useful trailering load even on the lower powered bikes and even the sportier bikes, some way to enhance what it will carry without having to go into a backpack (where i'm sure the up high weight will be alot LESS safe in a frame pack even if it's only 50lbs) or strapped over the rear part of the seat behind me. It's possible that a bigger bike is just plain needed to do anything useful - i'm considering anything up to a 650 (for fun as well) after which no mileage improvement is possible. I'd like to know how much I can stretch each size of bike for moving stuff now, before i've gotten a bike, but the backup position is still probably just "get a geo metro" in the end.

650 ninjas are a great all-rounder.. still around 50-60mpg
or even a ninja500, suzuki gs500f, right around 65mpg are top ones i would look for? especially price wise

aha....
 

Sorry about the reply....tablet not friendly with forum..grr

On the swingarm, you can use an extended axle to secure the hitch assembly mounting, then brace it against the swingarm (not unlike a torque link).

Some systems tie into the hollow rear axle, like a motorcycle stand, they clamp onto the rear axle.


Only on the heaviest cruisers have I ever seen a hitch mounted to the rear subframe - with the hitch usually mounted low down on an extender plate.


you could search for lightweight trailers ...

A lightweight motorcycle trailer wouldn't be a bad start to fabricate a stores carrier, either.


If the hitch is too high, the trailer will push up the rear end.
Keep the hitch low - even if you were to mount it on the rear subframe.

The last thing you want behind a bike is a US style trailer with relatively high tongue weights.
Depending on where you mount it, it'll weigh down the rear suspension (subframe mounting), or add to the unsprung weight (swingarm mounting).
Yeah, I know there are bike trailers with the wheels at the very rear - just have a look at their allowed weights ...

What you need is a Euro-style trailer which is more or less balanced, with a small bias towards the front and relatively low tongue weight (like 1/10 or even 1/15 of the loaded trailer weight).

Great option, the suspension rate for the rear could be a little soft when loaded so heavy, but the extra travel could soak up the harshness and calm potential eratic behavior. another that comes to mind is a FZ6 of FZ1 but sacrificing low-end Tq a bit.

for OP, would this be custom mounting hitch or something manufactured already?

It's in French, but this might give you some ideas about mountings.

Les avantages d'une remorque conçue pour la moto

These trailers are quite light though - some 150 to 200 lbs loaded.

Some more Do-It-Yourself ideas on bike trailers :

Ma remorque
La 2eme remorque
La 3eme remorque
La 3eme remorque

As others have said, Goldwings are always towing trailers. I've never used my tow hook, but the previous owner of my Valkyrie used to tow trailers all the time.

For 250 bikes also consider the Yamaha Virago or VStar 250. They have a very long stroke engine and make good torque at low rpm. The Ninja is nearly torqueless at low rpm. This will be most welcome starting up any sort of incline.

MPG potential for the Virago/Vstar 250 is very similar to the Niinja, and may exceed it with your intended use.

Mounting will be a custom job. I like the swingarm mount idea for it's simplicity but do not like the increased unsprung weight, especially with a loaded trailer. The front of the trailer will be essentially unsuspended. A frame mount should probably be mounted very close to the swingarm pivot on each side and then two more locations higher like under the seat. The mount should consider lateral loads.

Google "Motorcycle trailer hitch" and use the Images option to see several examples.

Good luck with your welding job. I love projects that do more with less using conventional ideas unconventionally.

Something manufactured already would be ideal... if I could find who does such things and for what bikes. :( Like I said googling doesnt even turn up anything, it thinks I want to put motorcycles onto a trailer.

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Euromodder, that looks almost exactly like what I want in a trailer, yes. Something about that size, for mounting a car carrier on, just perhaps with something like a roof rack on top of the carrier (or say four 'postholes' in the corners around it, on which I can add a second frame on top of it to ease hauling sheet goods) and a slightly longer toungue(?) so that if I stick 4x8 sheets of styrofoam on top of the roofrack I can still maneuver well. Toungue weight shouldn't have to be heavier as long as it's balanced to the center of the axle roughly.

But then the trailer idea I sort of already had ideas for, it's the mounting to the bike part that i'm still wanting to figure out. :) I see there are some pictures of it but I don't fully understand "cycle anatomy" so I dont fully understand where it's attaching and why... is there any reason a similar hitch shouldn't work on either a Kawasaki Eliminator 125cc or a Ninja 250 for instance? (despite the fact neither will be highly recommended tow vehicles... duh! :P )

Actually someone else did http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1zZdRvKZG4 for a trailer which is just the harbor freight 4x4 one apparently, but hauling big awkward yet not too heavy things like that with a small bike (or even a scooter) is what I have in mind.

Really ? :D
The Gunco guys want 500-600 euro , just for the mounting hardware .

The "horsecollar"-like frame mounts to the rear subframe (under pillion seat) and the passenger footpeg mounts as far as I can see.

On some bikes the swingarm shaft is hollow (it might have a cap on though) , and depending on the rider's footpeg position, that could also be used to mount something.