Chevy Volt's for sale in all 50 states?
 

I showed up at the local electric auto association meeting last night to find out that one of the members had bought a Chevy Volt about 6 hours earlier! but what surprised everyone is that he was able to go to the Chevy dealership and bought it off the lot, no special ordering it from out of state, no waiting list, just picked one out of the handful that they had.
The reason that this was a bit of a surprise is that there wasn't any advertising saying that you could buy them now in Minnesota, apparently the dealership didn't even have a banner or signage saying that they had these cars, they were instead tucked around back, out of the way where you might find them if you searched around the lot and knew what you were looking for.
So in a room full of EV nuts, everyone was shocked that there was no press release, that it just happened...

My only thought as to why they would do it like this is that the people who really want to own a Chevy Volt are going to seek them out and that the more press that it gets the louder the nay-sayers are going to be, but if the people who really want them buy them they are going to create their own buzz and word of mouth advertising really is the best and that having people who are thrilled with their Volt out there talking it up really is the best way to counter act the bad press that has been put out there so far.

Also, it's a slick car, much nicer inside and more responsive then my boss's Saab 93 Turbo and about the same cost only with better mileage.

Heck, I see them in several MN stealerships... they're in Grand Forks ND too.

Right, but I have yet to see anything on any of the automotive web sites about the volt being available in all states or on any of the EV sites or forums, so while the dealerships have them that seems to be about where it ends, from what I can tell, unless my life is much more sheltered then I thought it was, but driving past a number of Chevy dealerships I saw all kinds of other banners out about other vehicles they are selling but nothing about the volt.

Hello Ryland,
I think this is SOP for new or limited availability cars. The manufacturer could be accused of favoring one dealer over another if they had a regional campaign to sell some vehicle that hadn't been distributed to all the dealers. Perhaps when as all the dealers have a Volt then the ads will go up.

-mort

Ryland -

I'm trying to google a relevant article but this is the best I can come up with :

http://www.autonews.com/apps/pbcs.dl...IL07/301239977 - January 23, 2012
I am guessing that the best place to go is a Volt forum :

GM-Volt: Chevy Volt Forum

CarloSW2

...has GM's "diamond" lost it's marketing 'glamour' already?

Well, people are seeking them out and buying them and the people who own them are thrilled, so I'm not sure, I for one was thrilled to get to go for a ride in one, as was everyone else who got in, but if a company doesn't talk up it's product it's hard for anyone to say anything bad about it and from what I hear and see, the people who want Volt's are seeking them out and buying them, so really, why should they spend money on marketing?

$40k for a "hybrid" that gets 60 MPG? Not only that, taxpayers paid $2.4 BILLION dollars to develop this car. Thats a cost of $260,000 per Volt that has been sold. So what we really have here is a $300,000 car that will catch on fire if you wreck it. And for what, to save a few thousand dollars on gas per year?

They need the marketing to hide how big of a failure this car really is...

Can't be as bad of a failure as the 2012 Civic.

That being said, anything that starts moving U.S. automakers in the direction of economy cars is worth it. If anything, the problem is that they moved too slow with the Volt. Had it been competing against the 1st gen Prius, the market would have been huge. Unfortunately, they are now competing against car companies who have a decade more experience making hybrids. And if gas prices hit $5-6/gal this year (very likely), these cars are going to start getting a lot more attention.

Just because I drive a Civic doesn't mean I was comparing the Volt to a Honda or any other car for that matter, so I really don't see what that has to do with this topic but I will respond.

I don't see the 2012 Civic as a failure and no one should. For $16k you get a car capable of 39 MPG. Its not a hyrbid. You don't have to plug it in. Its got 140 HP. If you buy the $40k Volt over a well-equipped $20k Civic you would need to wait 24 years before you come out ahead with gas savings. And a Volt would never last 24 years. The 2012 Civic does not live up to the Civic reputation, and I agree with you there, but that still hasn't stopped it from being the best selling compact sedan in the month of November 2011. Selling cars is the measure of success, the Volt clearly loses.

The reason I say the Volt is a failure is because what does it prove? What is its purpose? What new technologies or innovations does it bring to the table? Its a hybrid. If you need to drive more than 35 miles or go highway speeds you will need the gasoline engine. GM is trying to market this car as something incredible, like its the comeback of the American auto industry. It is not. Its wasted money trying to develop something that already exists. It failed to create something special. The Nissan Leaf gets better range, better MPG (gasoline equivalent), and is cheaper. It sold over double of what the Volt did in 2011.

Why? If gas hits that price everyone will try to drive less and save money. No one would buy a $40k car to save about half on gas compared to a car like a Civic. I will point you to my previous example. It would take you 24 years to come out ahead on savings if you buy a Volt over a Civic assuming you drive 26000 miles a year (Like I do) and gas costs $3.50 a gallon. You don't save money overall by buying a car with higher MPG if it costs you more money up front.

Both of those statements have already been proven false, even the guy who did the figures that claimed a cost of $260,000 withdrew his figures when he was asked deeper questions, admitting that most of that amount is set to be paid back, some of it already is and his figures covered money loaned to battery research and manufacturing that is being used for more then just the Volt and more then just vehicle batteries too!
As for the "getting hit and catching fire" there are other threads on the topic but it boils down to that yes, before they added an extra plate to protect the seat rail from hitting the battery pack, if the car was T-boned hard enough to crush the seat into the center tunnel, flip the car over, then the battery was left fully connected and the coolant was drained, then you waited two months to see if the car catchs fire... compare that to gasoline cars that sometimes catch fire before you can get out of the drivers seat, no Volt, or other electric car for that matter, has been shown to catch fire while it was on the road, statistically 11 electric cars should have cough fire in 2011 if they were to keep up with the number of gasoline cars that catch fire and 3 cars per year every year before that for the last 10 years or more should have caught fire as well, but that hasn't happened.

GM had record earnings; should be able to pay back the loans in short order.

But not the 20 billion in bonds that got tossed in the garbage.

regards
Mech

Honda did. That's why they discontinued production while they revamp the car (i.e., so that they can be competitive in their market segment again). On one hand, I was criticizing the fact that you often make "fanboi-esque" posts stating, in a nutshell, everything non-Honda is bad. On the other, it is a very good comparison, since the Volt (albiet a "failure") is still on the market with little to no revamping.


People aren't going to drive less. This has been proven over and over again. The emphasis now is finding cars that don't need gas to run. That is why so many people have been moving toward diesel, hybrids, and electrics. And when a car allows an average driver to hit > 1,000 miles on a single, small tank of gas, that's saying something.

I'm also curious about your "24 years" calculations. Does that take into account the $7,500 tax credit? Does it take into account that, depending on the driving, 26,000 miles a year might add up to only a few gallons of gasoline? Also, I'm not sure that $3.50 is a good base to calculate from, since I, currently, can only find a few gas stations selling 87 octane for < $4.00/gal.

Really? I have made 24 posts and I don't see any of them besides this thread that calls out any other car brand. I don't believe that everything non-Honda is bad, I just think the Volt and other particular cars are. The Chevy Cruze is a great car. $20k for a car that gets 42 MPG. This is a much better value than the Volt. And its better than the 2012 Civic.


Really? Thats the logic that car companies "want" you to think. They want you to believe that its much better to get rid of your old car and buy a new car to save money on gas. But you are not saving any money at all. People will do this, but they are idiots if they are trying to save money but buy new cars to do so.

Electrics are not ready for the market yet. The government is trying to force it but using tax incentives and loans to Nissan and GM for the Volt and Leaf. You cannot force a market to pick up by pumping money into it. If its a superior product, it will sell. If its not, in the case of the Volt, it will not sell well. Its the value factor. You do not get a good value in the Volt. If the price was about half, at around $20-$25k, I think we would not be having this discussion.

Thats even worse! Why I am paying people to buy these cars? You need to remember the Volt only has a range of 35 miles on electric only. After that the gasoline engine kicks in to charge the batteries and drive the car until the batteries are at a decent level again. During that time you are getting 37 MPG. So combined, according to the EPA, you get 60 MPG. Sure, if you drive less than 35 miles a day you will not need gas, but even at that rate you get an equivalent 94 MPG according to the EPA. It still costs money to charge the car everyday.

Yet plenty of people do buy $40K cars, and $50K, $60K, and higher ones. As for the argument that no one will buy a pricier car to save gas, a quick search finds these figures:

2012 Civic: MSRP from $16K, combined mpg 32 (varies slightly depending on model)

2012 Prius: MSRP from $26K, combined mpg 50.

So by your logic, no one should ever buy a Prius, right? But have you checked Prius sales figures lately?

People make a big deal about "paying for other people to buy these cars" because of the $7,500 tax credit, the Volt I rode in was bought by someone who doesn't make enough money per year to owe $7,500 in taxes... to get credited... so he ended up paying full price and knew that before buying the car and I suspect that his 11 gallon or whatever it is, tank of gas will only be filled up a few times a year, if even that often, so it will cost 2.5 cents a mile to fuel instead of 10 cents a mile, but if it was really all about fuel costs and vehicle costs we'd all be driving Geo Metro's and yet people still see a need to spend $80,000 or more on a gasoline vehicle but someone spends $40,000 on a plug in hybrid and they get asked what the pay back is! the pay back is that it's extremely quite, it's comfortable it has good performance and they don't have to go out of their way to fill it up with gasoline much more then twice a year, what's the pay back on your big screen TV, home stereo, mowed lawn, or any of the vast numbers of things that people spend extra money on just because they like them.

Then I apologize. I had the wrong impression.

Why am I paying to keep so many gasoline powered cars on the road? The U.S. Government routes far more funding into fossil fuels than any other energy initiatives. The Government makes it a point to subsidize gas so much so that average people can afford to buy and waste it.

So I ask, which is the bigger travesty?

So I would never have to use gas on my daily work commute? Great! About 25% of my coworkers have a similar commute too. Also, you probably don't want to argue the price of gas versus electricity.

Average person drives 27 miles per day giving them an 8 mile buffer before they would have to start burning gasoline and that assuming that they can't charge at work like I can or a lot of EV drivers currently can.
Last study that I read suggested that if we didn't give oil companies tax breaks and didn't subsidize gasoline at all that the price would be closer to $7 per gallon, so why do I have to pay for your gasoline and will keep paying for your gasoline, I don't think that's fair.

I believe it is safe to say that the cost of electric vehicles will decrease over time. Companies need to recoup research and development costs. Once the ROI is achieved, you can be sure the price tag will go down. Every new product needs early adopters.

You all make good points, and I enjoy discussing these things with you. Personally, I don't believe the government should subsidize anything, but I am old fashioned like that I guess. We can only hope that some kind of new technology will develop that takes us away from gasoline for good.

First things first, this is my first post ever. I have my asbestos underware on for the responses...

@ cbaber -- your first post in this thread showed your views, you dont like the Volt.
Thats ok, its your opinion. Oh, and I dont like the goverment "helping" the industry either.

@ Everybody --Every car companies has failures, thats how they get better.

I like Chevy, my first new vehicle was an 1987 S-10.

I like Hondas too, my last new vehicle was a 2011 Honda Cr-Z
(which I dont have now, long story, I miss the mileage / fun)

I personally am interested in the Volt and the Cadillac ELR (good looking in my opinion) and the Leaf, which wont carry me all the way to work and back (dang it), etc etc, etc. They are all making progress though. We are here to help each other get better mileage and eventually better use of wattage or whatever is the next form of energy we use.

I personally see the need to change on a daily basis, I drive a truck for a living, I burn 80 to 100 gallons of fuel a day. Thats approx. 640 TO 800 POUNDS of fuel burned and spent into the atmosphere each day :mad: . I am one truck driver of how many around this planet?

My company uses very new equipment, very clean burning equipment. But we still need to find better ways of delivering everything. And before someone says get another job think about everything around you. It came on a truck. Your breakfast, the eggs, toast, meat.. All delivered by truck as you slept. Your clothes, your desk, everything, anything you touch TODAY.

So as I drive and burn lots of fuel everyday I ponder ways to change the basic world around me. If the ALL trucks stopped right now in just a few days people would be running out of the basics for living, just food would cause life threatening fights. How do we get around this?

So the Volt isnt your cup of tea, ok, but its a step in the right direction for a large company (that should be shot for scrapping the EV-1/eS-10). And its a step we really need to take. Once all of this starts really taking hold in the automotive world I hope it trickles down to the semi trucks.

Sorry to hijack the thread but I feel strongly about this and I hope I shed some perspective on the problem facing the entire world, not just each one of us and our individual likes and dislikes. Thanks for your attention.

Now about the Volt, do you think the Cadillac ELR is a redressed Volt? Who knows anything about it? I just saw it for the first time this morning...

Welcome to the site Marc. Good first post. :)

Marc -

Welcome to EM! I like the ELR looks too. Cadillac had originally planned a Volt-based model and it looks like this is it :

GM Announces The Next Volt, The Cadillac ELR | TechCrunch
CarloSW2

Hello,

I have haunted the forum even before I signed on.

I just came in from the chores and had time to do a search on the ELR. Yup its a Volt under that slick skin. But Cadillac generally does more than just reskin em.

Does the Caddy or the Volt have a better drag coeff. ? Any body find numbers yet.
Still beginning my research and I only have limited time on the web. I wont see a response till saturday this week and its wed. now.

ttyl
Marc

Hello Marc F.,
And welcome!
I don't know anything specific about the ELR, but I'm intrigued by what they've done to the rear view mirrors.

-mort

...I believe the Volts' Cd is 0.29, just slightly better than the Cruze (standard = 0.32, Eco = 0.30).