EOC seems pretty violent?
 

hi

this week i have been mostly doing EOC. i've noticed you have to pick the right gear to re-start the engine in and you have to remember to put the key back to iii(run) or you have problems.

even when you do it right though it can still seem pretty violent on the engine

-are you sure it is not exsesivly wearing the enging or transmission?

I have found out that for my engine 5th gear always is the best to bump start in and I try not to bump under about 15mph or it gets a little shaky and is alot tougher to do smoothly.

practice makes perfect. make sure to only let out the clutch a bit to "bite" and spin up the engine then push the clutch back in.

my 2 cents

I alway put my key to iii after i turn it off, because otherwise it doesn't keep track of the mileage and therefore i can't compare tanks properly so i like that convenience. I drop it down into overdrive (5th) when i want to pop it in. I then push it back in when i see my gauges move (battery level and heat of engine) If you practice enough then you should feel very little.

I'm getting good with a bump-start technique-- at around 25mph, I start it in fifth, by gently engaging the clutch, then immediately disengaging it, as soon as the engine fires up. It works pretty well, and I'm able to do it pretty smoothly.

It took me a while to figure this out, but there should be nothing violent or abrupt about restarting your engine. I usually do it somewhere in the 30s using 5th gear. Here's the key, you don't let the clutch all the way out and you put it back in before the engine actually starts. It's just a little rub of the clutch plates and nothing more. It needs to be done kinda quickly. I just jerk the pedal back part way and then push it back in. The engine starts half a second later. I can do this almost perfectly and it just feels like I tapped the brakes for a split second. It takes a lot of practice, and quite a bit of skill, so don't be afraid to use ol' sparky to fire up your engine if you need power in a pinch. Obviously the key has to be in the "run" position and I would recommend using extreme caution so as not to engage the steering wheel lock when turning off your engine. Some cars engage the steering lock immediately after turning the key off.

If you put in a kill switch you don 't have to touch the ingnition switch and the odometer continues to total and the lights stay on after dark. I wired mine into the fuel fuse in the engine compartment (each car will be different) and it works great. About $10 for a switch, inline fuse and wire. I put it right beside the gear shift on the consol. I always bump in 5th and do it between 15 and 35. I push the clutch in immeditaely after starting if I'm coming to a stop, otherwise no. The engine starts very smoothly.

homeworkhome53

what about for those of us with automatic transmissions...when I shut off at a light I put it in neutral to restart.

If I mounted a kill switch to the shifter I could put it in neutral and kill the fuel while rolling...but will it restart once I let off the switch because it is an automatic?

Will that cause harm to the transmission puting it back in D while rolling at 25-30mph? or less?

Try it and see if there is any harsh engagement. I go from neutral into gear at 50-55 mph quite often (10 times a day) and if I don't rev match its a little harsh but no different than a 3/4 throttle upshift. The Neons auto is an understressed 3 spd with a good reputation in turbo drag racing applications though.

If I was driving a 90's Dodge minivan I wouldn't play around with coasting in neutral so much although at 25 mph I doubt that would hurt any transmission unless it tries to go to 1st gear or something silly.

Ian

p.s. I just checked out your garage, your car might have an early relative of the Neon tranny, plus if you are able to do tranny swap then I would neutral coast all day with that auto until you swap it out

I read an article about someone building an early 90's Nissan SE-R for road racing using a stock transmission...but he did some research and found that there were several gear ratios offered through out the run of the car...and picked all the individual gears that would give him the best performance.

Now with my car...the research I've done has shown that the 4spd actualy had a bit better economy. (5spd probably was closer ratios) I'm wondering if I can build a frankenstein tranny that would be a 5spd...but be the most economical gears from the 4spd 5spd and a neon 5spd as you mentioned...with the lowest 5th gear/final drive that I can find.

I'll give the neutral coasting a try and let yall know how it goes.

I'd be careful about doing EOC with an auto trans. I've heard that there are many auto transmissions that can be damaged by running without power to the fluid pumps. I'm no expert on this one, but I know that running an automatic Tundra with the engine off is not recommended. At the very least, look in your owner's manual at the section on towing/dinghy towing. If it gives you any warnings about running the driving wheels in neutral with the engine off, you might consider giving up on EOC and pursue other methods of saving fuel.

I will look into that...I actualy tried some EOC going to and from work...and it did fine...but its good to know that there could be an issue...so I will find out.

I actualy did a 4 block eoc right into my drive way :)

PaleMelanesian - thanks for posting that link. I'd forgotten about it.

modmonster -

I am pretty much in agreement with what everyone else has been posting. Here is how I describe a bump-start :

1 - Engine off, coasting at 25+ MPH.
2 - Push clutch all the way in.
3 - Move stick shift to 5th gear position.
4 - Let foot up on clutch just enough to engage engine and then push clutch back in. My non-car knowledge makes me think I am "tapping the flywheel" to turn over the engine. For me this is a pretty quick movement. If the tap goes well, the engine starts very smoothly, almost no bump in the bump-start.
5 - Let foot up on clutch and drive in 5th as normal.

I have experimented with lower gears, but the MPH "soft bump" range is very narrow, so I almost *never* do it.

CarloSW2

I went to the mitsubishi dealership this morning and the mechanic I discused EOC with said there should be no issues doing this with my car.

I may give this a try for a bit.

When I was doing it last night I had no issues with my brakes or my steering. I'm not sure that it counts as a true P&G but omaha has alot of hills...and I can get my car rolling and shut it off in neutral and roll for a very long distance. I crested a hill at about 25 mph and had enough EOC momentum to cover a stretch of about 2 miles.

I have no problem doing a soft bump in second aroun 15 mph. I don't know if it is just my car, but I always use second gear at around 15 mph with the double clutch technique.

I use it so that I can judge lights and coast to them in time to never fully stop along with stop signs. I can coast all the way to 15 mph just before the stop sign using my brakes at the end and never use my ignition to start. Seems pretty seemless and I get great results.

Interesting that they OK it. Most all Autos get their oil pumped from the spinning of the engine. With out the engine on, even in N the gears are rotating inside, but with no oil to lubricate. If you start having any weird transmission action, start the engine up and drive it easy and let the thing cool down some.

Autos are a PITA to have rebuilt.

Try 4rth or 5th gear and see if it works, I think it would be easier on the engine. I used to bump start in the gear that I would normally be driving in at the speed in question, but have found that moving up a gear or two to bump start works better.

I find the double-clutching method strange. I've EOC'd Fords and Metros both, and didn't need to double-clutch either. I just engage and disengage the clutch in the normal fashion. The whole operation is quite smooth. Is it just me???

My car def does not like just engaging the clutch straight up. Even if I "get it right" it doesn't sound "happy." It sounds very smooth and much better doing a double clutch. I'm sure every car is different.

Frank Lee -

I just tried this in 5th gear at 30 MPH and I only felt a "bumplet". So, I would be comfortable at that speed.

I think that when you are "bitten" by the jerky engagement in the lower gears, you become adverse to doing it again. The logical thing would be to "make a map" of where the straight engagements are smooth at speed X + gear Y.

CarloSW2