Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 06-14-2012, 08:14 AM   #21 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,891

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,423
Thanked 2,914 Times in 1,827 Posts
Another point is that the same frontal area can be configured in many ways (tall & narrow ranging to low & wide) but the interior *volume* is not the same for these. A square (or round) frontal area of a given size will, by definition provide more interior volume than a narrow rectangle.

If you consider the passenger space above the floor on the Murray cars, they are nearly square, which means they have more interior space than a low and wide design with the same frontal area.

__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 06-14-2012, 10:31 AM   #22 (permalink)
EcoModding Lurker
 
tortoise's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Sequim, WA
Posts: 71

number 9 - '89 Geo Metro LSi
90 day: 49.25 mpg (US)
Thanks: 1
Thanked 8 Times in 8 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard View Post
Another point is that the same frontal area can be configured in many ways (tall & narrow ranging to low & wide).
Low and narrow beats both. I like a 2 seater with the passenger seat beside, but slightly rear of the front, for shoulder room, like many '20s race cars. Guess I'll have to build it.
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-14-2012, 11:22 PM   #23 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,891

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,423
Thanked 2,914 Times in 1,827 Posts
Low and narrow has less frontal area, sure, but the volume also varies with the proportions of the width and height; and the length too, of course.

The newest VW XL-1 has a staggered tandem seating arrangement; as did the tandem version of the Edison2 VLC. The passenger seat can be moved closer to the driver's seat, because the legs are narrower than the hips...
__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2012, 09:25 AM   #24 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philippines
Posts: 2,173
Thanks: 1,739
Thanked 589 Times in 401 Posts
Tall and narrow is how they fit three people within a smaller footprint than a SMART ForTwo. Granted, they could get more aerodynamic with a longer design with a proper tail, but the whole point is to give it the smallest footprint both in terms of wind resistance and road usage, while giving it usable interior space.

Granted, it's possible to design something more fuel efficient and more aerodynamic, but difficult while meeting the same safety and space targets.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2013, 01:15 PM   #25 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
NeilBlanchard's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maynard, MA Eaarth
Posts: 7,891

Mica Blue - '05 Scion xA RS 2.0
Team Toyota
90 day: 42.48 mpg (US)

Forest - '15 Nissan Leaf S
Team Nissan
90 day: 156.46 mpg (US)

Number 7 - '15 VW e-Golf SEL
TEAM VW AUDI Group
90 day: 155.81 mpg (US)
Thanks: 3,423
Thanked 2,914 Times in 1,827 Posts
Gordon Murray's T.25 and T.27 microcars headed for production - Autoblog
__________________
Sincerely, Neil

http://neilblanchard.blogspot.com/
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2013, 08:38 PM   #26 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 10,118
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1,203 Times in 1,064 Posts
Apart from the not-so-practical canopy, its concept seems to be overall better than the Smart, not just due to its design being more efficient but also more sporty-looking which seems to attract people who see the current eco-cars as not manly enought.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2013, 09:16 PM   #27 (permalink)
.
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: The Berkshires, Massachussetts
Posts: 886

Ruby Sparks - '01 Honda Insight
Team Honda
90 day: 64.27 mpg (US)
Thanks: 111
Thanked 365 Times in 203 Posts
The Smart fortwo has the same horrible drag coeficient as the VW Beetle, 0.38. Which is why the 1 litre Smarts have lower highway mpg then a 4 person sedan. The T-25 has a smaller frontal area, but i doubt it's CD isn't far off. All that engineering, and little thought to aerodynamics. Thats the only bad thing i have to say about it.

I'm sure it's a fantastic city car.
__________________
I try to be helpful. I'm not an expert.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2013, 09:23 PM   #28 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 10,118
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1,203 Times in 1,064 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheepdog 44 View Post
The Smart fortwo has the same horrible drag coeficient as the VW Beetle, 0.38. Which is why the 1 litre Smarts have lower highway mpg then a 4 person sedan. The T-25 has a smaller frontal area, but i doubt it's CD isn't far off. All that engineering, and little thought to aerodynamics.
Aerodynamics in a shorter vehicle are a higher challenge than it might appear initially, but the T25/T27 seems to be actually better than the Smart regarding this matter.


Quote:
I'm sure it's a fantastic city car.
Eventually it might still be also not bad in short-to-medium road trips.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2013, 11:31 PM   #29 (permalink)
Master EcoModder
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Philippines
Posts: 2,173
Thanks: 1,739
Thanked 589 Times in 401 Posts
The Twizy's cd is worse than a Jeep's.

This one might be at around 0.40 or 0.45... they're remarkably coy about it...
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-17-2013, 10:00 PM   #30 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 10,118
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1,203 Times in 1,064 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by niky View Post
The Twizy's cd is worse than a Jeep's.
Wasn't its hamster exercise ball shape supposed to improve the aerodynamics?


Quote:
This one might be at around 0.40 or 0.45... they're remarkably coy about it...
At least in the pictures its cd seems to be lower than the Smart.

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Thread Tools


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Yet Another EV Project - 1975 EVA Metro (Renault 12) Restomod mcmahon.craig Fossil Fuel Free 13 07-01-2016 07:21 AM
Electric car conversion: Project ForkenSwift MetroMPG Fossil Fuel Free 1041 07-28-2014 09:19 AM
New open source EV website - could use your help revoltev Introductions 1 08-02-2009 10:35 PM
Anybody have an EV info I was looking at a 99 Ford ranger EV or s10 GM EV? 95CHERJUST EcoModding Central 2 06-26-2009 04:17 PM
Chrysler's New EV Unveiled On CNBC This Morning! rgathright Alternative Transportation 5 02-09-2009 06:54 PM



Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com