HX timing belt
 

I received my paycheck yesterday and can finally afford to replace the timing belt. The car is at 182,000 miles. As I understand it, you are supposed to replace it every hundred thousand under normal conditions, or sixty thousand if you frequently drive in temperatures of a hundred and ten degrees or warmer.

I do not know how often I drive the car when it is that warm, but it definitely happens, and it does not help that my car is black.

I also do not know if the timing belt was changed previously, just that I do not want to destroy the engine.

Before purchasing the car, I was told that I had some oil leaks, which I could fix by replacing gaskets when I change the timing belt.

Can someone please tell me which gaskets? I was told there was simply a larger kit containing the additional seals, for a negligible additional cost. Where could I find one?

John bought "a Gates timing belt kit, Felpro valve gasket kit, Beck Arnley 192 thermostat and gasket" http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...nes-29186.html

This DIY says to replace:
DIY: Timing belt 96-00 - Honda Civic Forum

Although I removed the power steering...

It also says that I need the following tools (which I do not own--yet):
Another breaker bar, preferably a 24" 1/2" one.
A 4 foot pipe that fits over [breaker] bar nicely.
Honda pulley bolt removal tool.
An extra jack stand [to] support for your breaker bar when you remove the pulley bolt.
Torque wrench in inch pounds
17mm deepwell socket.
New radiator fluid. Match the color.
About 14 inches of socket extensions to reach pulley bolt.
Permatex black liquid gasket from autozone.

Automd.com claims that Mobile Car Dr will do this for me for $678.03, although there was not any option to include additional gaskets. That includes an AC Delco Engine Timing Belt, Cloyes Engine Timing Belt Tensioner, and Gates Engine Water Pump. The parts total is $124.03, shop fees are ten dollars, and labor is $544 for 6.4 hours. If nothing else, I would expect them to round to the nearest full hour, so $595 for seven hours. Then it would be 729.03 and $789.54 after taxes, but of course, again, this is without the additional gaskets.

Today is my day off and I would want to replace it now, but I cannot imagine gathering everything in-time!

Amy I missing anything? Are there any tricks here or common problems?

Thank you very much for your feedback!

Crankshaft and camshaft seals.

Not the kind of job you tackle yourself, lots of ways for things to go wrong.

Pully removal can be a real PIA, crank and cam positioning is critical.

Compared to an oil pan gasket exponentially more chances to fail.

Getting the crank pully bolt off on my brothers Integra required borrowing a half inch drive impact and every ounce of power it could provide.

regards
mech

Who are you to tell me what I can and cannot do?! I will show you! I will show all of you!

Does $789.54 sound reasonable?

Thanks!

No prices sound reasonable to me and I am seldom satisfied with any work I pay someone else to do. Had my neighbor do the font struts on the Sentra after I removed them. He did not align the rubber insulators up correctly and now I have a terrible creaking noise when I turn the front wheels, so I did the rears myself and eventually I will fix the fronts. Might cut half a coil out of the springs at the same time.

$789.54 is 2.5 Sentras + a little more ($39.54), nice not to have a timing belt, about 350 gallons of gas at todays prices.

regards
mech

I found it!
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...tml#post370638

Well, I would need at least nine additional tools...

Well, once again, I am doomed.

The other "estimates" range up to $1,050.

My sentiments too.

Ah, 3rd world cost cutting measures that end up costing the owners of the vehicle more than they should.

As long as it's not leaking oil onto the timing belt or any of the pulleys, I'd just do the belt.

Those Civics are pretty easy to work on... but first time through I would wait for a two-day weekend unless you have some alternate mode of transportation. Inevitably, you will find something else that needs repair or find that you forgot to buy some tool and it will take longer than expected. I would spend this day collecting parts and tools, and perform the service at a later date.

Do you regularly tackle other projects on your own? Timing belt probably isn't the best thing to get your feet wet on, as you can severely damage your engine if you mess it up. If you are careful, handy, and have good service instructions, you can likely manage it just fine. A Factory Service Manual is highly recommended.

I've never paid for a timing belt replacement as I do them myself, but I understand the typical rates are in the range you are quoting.

I like to fix things, but I have not done anything remotely near the complexity of changing a timing belt, plus the other gaskets. I have my Forester and considered doing this at the O'Reilly across the street from work, where I have my other car parked, so if I need another tool, I can purchase or rent it, if I need something else, I can use my Subaru, and if I need help, hopefully they could put me in contact with a mechanic.

I could also go to U-Fix It, where I had considered going to replace the timing belt for my Forester, and they would rent out a bay with tools, with a mechanic that would take over if necessary, although that really seems to be up to him, not me. He told me that I needed new rear brakes. "Oh, okay, let me get my repair manual." He told me the first few steps, but then said that he was going to finish.

Normally, I research work that I will be doing on the car, and try to figure out what I am doing ahead of time.

So, here is a 2,003 Sentra for $2,350 NISSAN SENTRA XE. Instead of my bad black paint, I would have... bad black paint. It has an EPA rating of 32 highway and the EPA says that it costs $1,000 more to fill up than my HX every five years.

So, I break even if I pay a thousand dollars to replace the timing belt, which I would need to do every five years, if I drive twelve thousand miles a year.

The Blue Book for my car is $2,086, although I might need to sell for less, since it needs a new timing belt. Also, I would have an easier time selling it if I reinstalled the power steering, and then they might not like the holes in the bumper from my air dam.

The Sentra also has manual windows and doors, but still no cruise control.

I think the u-fix it might be the best option.

regards
mech

Is this any good: http://www.amazon.com/Timing-Belt-Ho.../dp/B0074C77NA
$123.80
Not Mitsubishi, but Mitsuboshi.

How about:
Dayco Timing Belt Kit
Sale Price:
$50.23
Quantity:

Dayco Timing Belt Kit with Seals
Part Number: 6012-05358381
Includes: Timing Belt, Camshaft Belt Tensioner, 2 Camshaft Seals, Crankshaft Seal, Pre-Assembly Seal Lubricant; Water Pump

Bother...

$41.63
Part Number: 6012-07184726
The same as above, but only one camshaft seal, but neither specifies HX, one just says "2000 Honda Civic 1.6L 4 Cyl" and the other says the same, but also showing C\D\E\LX.

They have two kits by Nitoma that specify the HX, just not what they contain! They are each $102.23.

Should I order through Majestic?

I think Dayco would be fine.

I have had good luck with Rock auto so far.

regards
mech

nothing to it did every one of mine since new no dealers 97 hx 5sp 468,700 miles only replaced head gasket once crank seal,valvecover gasket and oilpan gasket all parts from majestic,I do mine every 125k haven't touched tensioner as of yet. good luck. I'll be boring mine out .025 over compression finally starting to drop and i'll do the clutch at that time already have it waiting.

This?

Dayco $65.79 More Information for DAYCO WP224K1BS

Are your fan belts and valve cover gasket in good shape?

regards
mech

I believe so. I will check tomorrow.

U-Fix it is out of business. I found a place in Scottsdale where people could work on their own cars--three years ago!
It is called We Fix It.
They convinced me to leave my car and I walked home, but I got lost, so I wandered eight miles!
The shop two blocks from me estimated $655--only four hours of labor. AutoMD.com estimates 6.4 hours and shops round up to the nearest hour!

I was pretty grumpy when I walked home. It was not the shop's fault that I got lost, but when I got the estimate from the shop two blocks away, I wanted to have them do it.

I just spent eighteen minutes talking to the salesman from We Fix it. I wanted the other shop to at least look at the estimate, but the main reason that I did not approve the repairs was that when he gave me the total, I said that I needed to take a hard look at my finances and get back to him tomorrow.

Then he started pushing. I honestly did not see why he did.

He said that a basic timing belt replacement is $874, but the super-duper, mint-flavored, jumbo deluxe timing belt replacement was $1,264, but wait! There is more!

He said a few times they warranty all of their work for five years and sixty thousand miles.

The larger total includes the valve cover gasket, all necessary seals, and he said the distributor and oil pan (oops!) were also leaking.

I replaced the oil pan (incorrectly) once, I can replace it (incorrectly) again!

I imagine that I can replace the distributor seal, too.

He also said that if the valve cover gasket or others are still good, they will not replace them.

So, I should ask specifically how much for each of the oil pan and the distributor gasket?

AutoMD shows eight different estimates for the valve cover gasket, although he said the total labor would be 4.3 hours (@$95 hourly). That must be for just the timing belt. A Victor gasket is twenty dollars and should not require additional labor. I forget how much I paid for my oil pan gasket and somehow I cannot find it at Majestic Honda or another dealership, but I do not think that it cost much. However, AutoMD says the labor would be 2.5 hours ($237.5, $254.84 with tax).

So, maybe it would be three hundred extra for the oil pan gasket and ninety for the valve cover gasket?

I think that I will call in the morning and tell them to change the timing belt, but not the oil pan gasket.

AutoMD has estimates varying from $678-$1,018 ($727.49-$1,092.31 with tax), so the price does not seem terrible, and the cheapest estimate, which is probably missing more than tax, has a three-month, three-thousand-mile warranty.

I just got my car back:

$224.59 Timing belt kit with water pump
43.02 Valve cover gasket set
12.78 Camshaft seal
17.38 Front crankshaft seal
Parts total: 297.77 Labor: 413.61 Job total: 711.38
Cooling system service
Coolant: $65.08 Labor: $104.87 Total: $169.95

It required over an hour of labor to connect my car to the machine? Did the car sit on the machine for an hour and they billed for labor? Does coolant really cost sixty-five dollars?! So, they need to flush the coolant system when they replace the water pump? The fifteen places that I pulled up on AutoMD had flat rates between forty and a hundred and twenty.
This place was a hundred and seventy!

Yelp discount: $88.00 Yay

Total parts: $362.85
Total labor: 430.48
Supplies: 39.98
Sales tax: 32.63
Total: $865.94

The discount was supposed to be ten percent, but that does not seem right. I keep wondering if they charged more for the coolant flush to cover the discount.

It seems to sort of be a rule of thumb that a trip to the dealer or mechanic will cost $1000 or thereabouts. Or multiples of that thousand. And they will claim that your car needs repairs that it doesn't. I have caught a local service tech at a local dealership in a lie. Who knows how many times I have been lied to and didn't catch the lie? Stay away from flushes! No cooling system flush! No tranny flush! No engine flush! And thus no water pump replacement, no tranny rebuild, and no engine rebuild. And then no wallet flush and no bank account rebuild.

The important thing is that you got your belt changed.

Further opinions of mine. "Warranteed" work is of little value. If it wasn't done right the first time, what's the likelihood that it will be done right the second time? I think that warranties are just a gimmick to get you back into the service facility so that you can be preyed upon again. Remember, these folks all have dollar quotas to fulfill.

So, I left a three-star review on Yelp. While I was writing this message, he called and apologized for everything. He said that he got busy. So, he spent nineteen minutes apologizing when he could have taken a couple of minutes earlier to communicate properly?

He said that if you do not flush the coolant system, the coolant will start destroying the gaskets and seals. Even with the price, for which they charge more than other shops in the area, the total was similar to other shops.

I do not know about my Civic, but I removed the timing belt in Bacon in order to replace the head gasket.

I did not have time to do that on my Forester, but I wish I had done that on my Civic. I am not sure that I needed many special tools besides a chain wrench.

Firstly here in the UK we tend not to trust timing belts beyond about 40K miles - Vauxhall (aka GM - UK) did and had loads of problems. As they sold to companies mostly they were spanked by those clients deciding to claim back the cost and/or not buy them again.

We like chains now here ;)

Secondly I think the idea of replacing other items affected by the belt is that doing this means you (should) not have to replace the belt again. e.g. if you replace your belt and then the water pump goes you have to replace water pump AND the belt again. So replacing a secondary pulley, and a water pump and maybe something else makes sense whilst everything is apart.

It does mean a lot of spend but if you plan to keep it then the investment is returned in having newer crucial components IMHO but I understand about the additional spend.

When I did my civic timing belt last summer it was a PITA! ...because the crank pulley ended up needing 1300+ foot pounds torque to come off. Impacts were useless. In the end I had a 12' steel pipe on the end of my breaker bar IIRC and was lightly bounding on it until it popper loose. I also stripped a bolt that HAD to come off but was corroded on and in an awkward place. So i needed a bolt removal tool. Total final costs were a lot less than you paid, parts and a couple tools for a few hundred bucks total, IIRC. But did I mention it was a PITA? I'm glad I did it myself, but the car was off the road for like a week because i am new to this job and because of the stripped bolt and the crank pulley difficulties. Sounds like you had yours back in a day. I saved cash, you saved time. How much is your time worth to you?

Enjoy the ride!

I had more time than money. On the Forester, the timing belt is right in front. It is on the side on the Civic? How accessible is that?

The belt is accessible behind the driver side front wheel. To change the belt it is a bit of a job. To check it is less involved.