Hybrid Diesels
 

I know many of us fantasize about owning one, but has anyone done a swap to see this through?

Any relevant information is greatly appreciated.

Peugeot did the first OEM available unit.

Peugeot to Debut Diesel Hybrid Crossover at Paris Auto Show | Automobile Box

As far as someone doing a homemade unit, I have a feeling it's been done, just have to dig it up.:thumbup:

Isn't it ridiculous that it had to be a "crossover"? Why couldn't they make a golf or a fiat or something? They always get it wrong.

I think the implications have been discussed in another thread concerning this particular car, but I'll put a link to a homemade hybrid that can be dieselized.

This was in one the other forum sections.

Electric Car Conversion: The Amazing 75-MPG Hybrid Car

I'm noodling this myself, using a small, low power electric motor, mounted between the diesel engine and transmission.

The idea is to disable idling on the injection pump, and run a controller on a micro switch at the fuel pedal, so that the first inch of pedal travel would activate the electric motor at full power, which would start the car moving. At the top speed of the e motor, engage a clutch between the e motor and banger, effectively "bump starting" the diesel.

The setup would allow one to use either motor. Haven't worked out charging or the like, or any type of adopted deactivation of the e motor circuit, etc.

I'm thinking some sensor to determine if the banger is running could cut the circuit to the e motor drive side, and a circuit to determine state of charge and throttle position could be used to engage regenerative engine braking.

Most gov't subsidizing schemes in the EU are based on CO2 output.
Making more cars with lower CO2 output and have them subsidized by the gov't = more profit.

Fiat especially is playing that game to its advantage.
The 500 models that get our 15% gov't bonus are prized higher accordingly ...

That happened alot with cash for clunkers here... Dealers would keep the incentive via some tricky salesmanship.

Ya know, with that cheap killer controller, I can see a plug in / diesel hybrid being built. Maybe Ecomodder will do what the OEMs refuse to do.

But CO2 output = mpg, no?

On my hybrid idea: I start the engine with the clutch engaged at times, in first gear. The starter has a life time warranty, so I'm not worried about damaging it.

Point is, the starter had no trouble starting my 2500lb (car, me, crap inside, full fuel tank, etc) moving at all. Within one full crank, the pedal is functional, and I can let off the key and start accelerating.

Because this, I believe a 3-5hp motor would actually be overkill for my intended application, but it could also work as a failsafe device, I.e. if the banger don't bang anymore, it could stol get you somewhere off the road, or home, within reason.

5hp is enough to get a small car going pretty quick, too... I could see something like this used for in town trips with a plug in option.

How about, let's say for a front drive auto, make an electrically driven rear axle, battery pack and controller. Integrate generator into ICE at front that will cycle on and off as needed to keep batteries topped off ( ala Volt ), and drive the car primarily on electricity.

If problems arise with the electric side, use existing drivetrain as limp home or for long distances, electric side for running around town.

As a third level of redundancy, the big hp / torque starter motor, just in case.

The idea I have in mind is more of a mild hybrid, basically intended to allow things like FAS to become more natural, and less operator based. Many feel that keying off takes too much attention from driving, and can become dangerous. I don't necessarily disagree.

Its said that the best way to get high FE from a hybrid is to simply not use the hybrid part. The 100+ mpg pulse and glide run in a Prius comes to mind. Its really inefficient to use an alternator or even a genny to charge the battery pack when that power could be used for motion. Too many energy conversions, which is why plug in fuel/electric cars are the only real hybrids in my mind.

Locomotives use electric drive with giant fuel generators for a few reasons, one being that the generators ONLY run at their most efficient load, eliminating a good bit of the problem with fuel engines right from the start. Similar tech could be applied to a car, but again, better efficiency would be had by building a more efficient CVT and allowing the fuel engine to drive the car at its most efficient load all the time. Another reason that locomotives use the hybrid power arrangement is that of power delivery... It takes ALOT of power to get a train moving, and the components needed to deliver that power safely can get very large and heavy, and at power levels in access of 10,000hp in some cases, power delivery parts tend to be a bit unreliable.

What do you think about a dieselized Mother Earth hybrid? I think it falls closer to what a train does.

I mentioned the power requirements for a train because of that...

Alot of people think it would be more efficient to convert the power from an engine through a generator to run an electric motor, as long as it were done at the engine's peak efficiency.

The problem with this, is that when it was designed for locomotives, the design HAD TO compensate for power requirements, as well as efficiency (as a close second, unfortunately).

This means that, for our purposes, there really is no reason to take power from an engine (50% efficiency at best), to power a generator (70%?) to power a car via electric motor/batt/
capacitor bank (heat losses, transmission losses, weight and complexity) when the same power could
be used to propel the vehicle, even via a CVT at 80% efficiency, and still have better end efficiency at the wheels.

Unless a hybrid system is used to specifically address the inefficiencies of the current system, such as idling, low load operation, etc... it's only added, weight, complexity, maintenance charges, trouble, and indeed, pollution, IMO. I've yet to see much in the line of fact to sway that opinion, in truth.

There is a guy who put a 3 cylinder diesel engine from a VW lupo in a Honda Insight mated to the hybrid's motor.
Thing is, Diesel engines tend to cost a bit more because of how much more stress diesels are under and add to that the cost of a hybrid and you end up with a really expensive vehicle.

At least officially.

In the real world, you won't get near the official EU rating all that easily - compare them to the old EPA rating.

Consumer organisations tested the vehicles that can get a 15% Gov't discount, none of them achieved their rating in normal driving, i.e. how most people drive.

It takes some serious hypermiling to get at and go beyond the official numers :(

Where can I find this?

This is basically what I'm talking about.

This is really the only way to get it done, because the auto manufacturers don't get it. It's like they realize that if they come out with the ultimate vehicle today, there won't be anything for their market to look forward to.

You just want me to work today, don'tya?

Here ya go,

Red Light Racing builds the worlds first Diesel Insight - MIMA Honda Insight Modified Integrated Motor Assist

You rock.

If we ever meet at an event you owe me a Jamba Juice!:thumbup: