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California98Civic 04-29-2017 03:02 PM

LIFeMnPO4 batteries?
12 packs of 4 cells each for 144v configuratin with 14.4 kwh and under 350 lbs and $8k. Anyone have experience with LIFeMnPO4 cells?


Just researching...

thingstodo 04-29-2017 06:28 PM


Originally Posted by California98Civic (Post 539650)
Anyone have experience with LIFeMnPO4 cells?

My leaf cells are LiMn2O4, I think. They are about 4.1V when charged. And they kinda REQUIRE a BMS.

I have used LiFePO4, CALB and Thundersky. LiFePO4 has been around for quite a while. It has been run without BMS (I do that) but that's not the discussion topic here.

From a bit of reading, the LiFeMnPO4 seems to be a LiFePO4 with Mn and other things used as an additive. Perhaps it gives more cycles, or prevents dendrite formation, or something like that.

Using EVTV as a comparison, 48 *100 a-h cells * $135 = $6480
straps at $10 each * 48 = $480

That's $6960, so $7990 is a bit higher but I don't know that the CALB cells are a good comparison.

The bms and charger are extra so you can get whatever you like for that part.

California98Civic 04-29-2017 09:18 PM

Seems like the LiFePO4 CALB re a little lighter, though possibly bulkier. A pack of 4 with nominal voltage 12.8 is two pounds lighter but significantly larger, I think. So the LIFeMnPO4 would get the same energy storage into a smaller area, with signficantly more weight, though nothing extreme. Here are the deets on the cell you mention that I used for comparison: CA100FI 100Ah CALB EV, Li-Ion, Lithium, LiFePO4, LiPo, Prismatic Cell Battery

Seems the LIFeMnPO4 at 12 four-packs for 144v would fit--on paper--a space roughly 25" wide by 22" deep and 9" tall.

Not a lotof range in 14.4 kwh but my vision is a fully parallel system to work completely independent of an ICE. It would be used in situations where the ICE is not ideal, not all the time.

Looks like building it would cost like $20k!


Stubby79 04-30-2017 01:36 AM

They're basically "cold weather" lifepo4's.

You can't charge a LiFePO4 below freezing, or you'll "plate" the anode or cathode and loose 20% of your capacity, IIRC. These have a Mn plating on them to prevent that, from what I read. However it works, it allows you to charge/use them down to -20c. You'll see that in the specifications on that web page you listed.

If you want to do winter driving without using a battery warmer, these are the way to go. They're notably heavier, mind you. 20% or so, for the same capacity. If it almost never gets below freezing, there's not much point to spending the extra or carrying the extra weight.

The can take a slightly higher end-charge voltage, otherwise they operate the same as LifePO4. 3.8v instead of 3.65v.

(I looked in to these when someone was selling a used set locally, but they were too damned BIG for my use. And he was asking too much for them).

PS: take this with a grain of salt, as I'm pulling this info out of 3-month old memories and not checking my facts.

vskid3 04-30-2017 03:45 AM


Originally Posted by California98Civic (Post 539666)
Looks like building it would cost like $20k!


I recently had some renewed interest in adding battery capacity/doing a PHEV conversion to my Prius instead of getting a Volt, came to the same "yikes" conclusion. It would probably cost me more to do a PHEV conversion with similar capabilities to the Volt than just buying a Volt. I'll just file that idea into the "neat but impractical" folder.

Used EV batteries are probably the best bang for your buck if you want kwhs of capacity.

California98Civic 04-30-2017 11:05 AM


Originally Posted by vskid3 (Post 539687)
... Used EV batteries are probably the best bang for your buck if you want kwhs of capacity.

I have looked into that, but without much good experience, obviously, I have done the obvious and searched craiglist and ebay and such. Is there a special community or page? I know of the endless sphere forum, but anything else? Just fishing for surprises...

vskid3 04-30-2017 09:52 PM

I'm not really sure, it almost seems like people just magically find them. Being in SoCal, you should have a good selection when you find a source. Maybe a local EV group or larger/specialty salvage yards? A totaled EV from auction would work if you don't mind getting rid of the rest of the car.

Stubby79 05-01-2017 02:12 AM and

Usually plenty to choose from around California.

Piotrsko 05-19-2017 09:59 AM for junk yard listings. Under
batteries other

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