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rmay635703 06-10-2008 10:38 PM

Longtime Lurker Looking for Miles ZX40 Electric Micro van mods & information
 
Hi, I have finally decided to register here as my father is getting a Miles ZX40 (the original slow 2005 model)

Anyway the dealer that sold it was saying that some have been able to remove the governor and get speeds up to 45mph.

I don't believe that but I do think 30-35 would be possible and would eliminate the unwanted police attention as our town is now fighting to make it difficult to drive NEVs if they don't go the posted speed limit. (Local boneheads causing irritation due to ignorance of the law)

I have been searching for information on the Miles but can only find
that it has a Curtis 1204 controller and 5hp motor and little REAL technical information on the vehicle like I find for most others.

Can anyone here direct me to some info on how to remove the governor or at least the specific type of motor and components? I would like to find out if anyone else has done anything creative with one of these heavy steel NEVs.

The Miles is still sitting in CA until the rear seats come in so I won't get to see it in the flesh for several weeks, maybe a month :(

So I hope to get my plans set in the meantime, I figure drive it stock a while to get a feel, then test a few minor mods, I do not plan on updating the motor/controller for a long time but that may change (especially the wimpy 275amp controller). Not sure how reliable or temperature resistant the motor in this is either, would like to find out how resistant the motor is to slightly higher than stock voltages.

In terms of my vehicles I currently drive a little Yellow 1981 Comutacar, don't go on the highway much anymore due to sticky Ebrake but it is all I drive during the week, got a little over 3200 EV miles last year right through the winter. Working on getting a Bedini to test for pulsing will see how this homebrew 1 ampper goes once I get all the parts together and humming.

Thanx for any information
Ryan

MetroMPG 06-10-2008 10:50 PM

Hi Ryan - welcome. You're the second yellow CitiCar in the forum!

I don't know if Miles has any discussion groups of its own. I'm guessing probably not, because it hasn't sold many of them yet. (There is a Xebra Yahoo group though.)

The governor is probably a controller feature. The ZENN can be upgraded with a kit. See http://www.electric-cars-are-for-gir...your-zenn.html

mattW 06-10-2008 10:57 PM

One method of doing speed governing is to add a resister in parallel with the pot so you never get to the full power... you could try and trace the wiring from the pot to the controller to see if that is how they did it.

rmay635703 06-11-2008 08:47 PM

Well that would be a very simple fix indeed, hopefully that is all it is and not what I figure I will see. Will have to check if the ohms go 0-5? on the pedal and at the controller input.

The only issue is I don't think that would be a very reliable governor so I have the strong feeling something else is employed, perhaps a wimpy 275amp controller can't drive it any faster :)

Keep em coming, I really haven't found anything usefull on the Miles at all they've been around going on 3 yrs so there must be a few floating around, mine was a dealer demo from 05 with 30miles and a nice low price, not forkenswift low but around the price I would expect to pay for a decent Gem or Comutacar.

Cheers
Ryan

Quote:

Originally Posted by mattW (Post 33566)
One method of doing speed governing is to add a resister in parallel with the pot so you never get to the full power... you could try and trace the wiring from the pot to the controller to see if that is how they did it.


NoCO2 06-11-2008 10:32 PM

OOO, hey, unfortunately I can't really help you with your question. However, I thought I would just interject that because of your post I did some research on them to see what you were talking about as I've never heard of them before, and I found that the zx40st is actually what my college uses as the grounds keeper's vehicles. I had no idea who made them, then after seeing them on the site, that must be what they are.

rmay635703 06-12-2008 06:09 PM

Not quite the ST is a much newer and better model (well it has a souped up motor anyway though the rest is still the same)

A few colleges use them as ambulances on ground and for transport of stuff. The miles actually had a fair amount of propaganda released on it from the usual sources but none say anything usefull about the car, at least usefull as I'm concerned.

Unlike regular NEVs these are real cars, Miles opted against crash testing and also didn't buy the optional airbags from Daitsu as a result.

I still wonder if I could buy the airbags from China (in the steering wheel I believe), ship over and have installed here so I could up the ante a bit later down the road. Go for the homebrew titling process and get certified. Not really sure how that works.

PS these are selling fairly cheaply for virtually unused vehicles, good deal if you can find a 2005/2006. Sadly though they use lowsy glass mat 12v's not my first choice at all but I guess they have a few advantages, though range and longevity is not one.

Another issue is because they are real cars they are also steel and like every other vehicle will enivitably rust (I hate rust) My C-car can't rust and is much better on that regard, maybe a good ol zeibart and truck bed liner on the bottom to prevent rust through.

Cheers
Ryan

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoCO2 (Post 33942)
OOO, hey, unfortunately I can't really help you with your question. However, I thought I would just interject that because of your post I did some research on them to see what you were talking about as I've never heard of them before, and I found that the zx40st is actually what my college uses as the grounds keeper's vehicles. I had no idea who made them, then after seeing them on the site, that must be what they are.


rmay635703 06-28-2008 02:01 PM

I recently found a website miles35.com but it seems that most of it sounds like BS. All he did is put a resistor of some type over the field (field weakening).

Am I missing something? Any ideas on what type of exotic metal he would used? I thought all of the old coiled resistors had little resistance until there were higher amp values presented and they heated.

Also, he is saying the miles only goes 19mph, I didn't think that was true but can't find anything that says one way or another.

I should have it by July 14 :( blast this is taking a long time.

Any help is appreciated.

rodneydiller 06-30-2008 12:54 AM

Waiting for back seats to arrive?
 
In the beginning of your first post, you noted you are waiting for the back seats to arrive...huh? I've also been milling the zx40 around, because of its relative affordability, but wish it could carry a couple of small kids. Have you figured a way to squeeze a back seat in there? The dealer is adding this? Let me know if I'm reading this right or if I'm dreaming...it is after midnight! Thanks. I'm new to the community, but keep us all posted what you think of the zx40 when you get it.

Duh...it really is late. I've been looking at Flybo and stumbled on this blog and are mixing apples and oranges. I told you it is late!

rmay635703 06-30-2008 06:19 PM

I don't have it yet but I am getting feedback from those who deal with them, take this as a grain of salt until I can form my own oppinion anyway flame on...

The Miles SHOULD ALWAYS COME with rear seats, sadly I can't find how you get the bench seat available for the Daihatsu here, so it seats 4 as is with buckets. I don't think there is such a thing as 3rd row and I doubt there is room unless you can scrunch the seats in line with little leg room, to do this I would assume you would have to take a 3rd row seat from a junked van, suburban or minivan and maybe mod it a tad.

Also take care when considering purchase as many internet specials are 2 seater cargo type vehicles, not sure why, must not be demand for them. Anyway with the rear seats your range decreases somewhat but not sure how much as I don't have the vehicle yet. Also miles won't just sell you seats they want you to bring it to them for installation, if I was the one doing it I would want to beat the crap out of them given the seats are supposedly removables in most models.

Also before you buy any EV made by a manufacturer be sure to test drive it. The guy at

http://www.miles35.com said he has been converting many miles zx40's of various flavors because of their extreme underpowered nature and he seems to be geniunely angry at miles for the as he says dangerous charger (dumb kind, open housing?) and poor cheap heavy batteries. The actual vehicle he says isn't bad but he seems to be scathing about the poor ride (which I doubt is that bad)

My guess is that the flybo would take off faster than a Miles but it is cheaply built (might as well get a c-car) Anyhoo the Daihtsu's are the so called mini trucks you see floating around all over the country as OFF ROAD ONLY. To get a slight feel take one of those out for a test drive. I am told they ride rough but the people I get the reports from I don't think have driven a C-Car. The Miles ZX40 is a real vehicle in China and Japan and probably is better built than most every NEV but again they are small and probably feel like any subcompact 2200lb vehicle.

Many are scathing about the performance of the vehicle, I personally could care less about accelleration but many do and that comes into play. For the price I paid I could afford to upgrade mine but I have no plans on updating the motor or controller until the original is just about worn. I may pump more volts through or put a resistor over the field with a contactor to boost the top end but I will report EXACTLY how it is once I get it. (top speed is a worry to me, if it can't go 24.xx like most nev's I will be somewhat frustrated)

Be warned I am used to slow underpowered vehicles so I will try to state numbers including my 1 small hill for hill climbing, what I figure on the charger and the range. Because I can tolerate poor accell I may not be a good source on that, range and reliability however are another issue.

Also Remember mine is a 2005, there were some major changes to the Miles over the years but apparently the top speed has reduced as power has gone up due to the type of motor selected.

This is all 3rd hand speculation though. I still reserve my oppinion until I drive it a while.

Back onto my current needs, anyone know much about

"FIELD REDUCTION"

I am looking to see what metals work the best as described at miles35.com with a low starting resistance that grows as current increases, I thought nichrome did this but I may be wrong.

Good Luck to all on their ecomodding ventures

Ryan

rmay635703 08-28-2008 11:25 PM

Well, I have to post on the Miles ZX40 situation

I finally got my car at the end of LAST month but did not get a title.

After calling around I found out that Miles itself had some sort of fire sale liquidation and screwed up the title transfer process, my title probably won't come until November!!! Ah well at least I know this is legit and I will eventually get it on the road.

Anyway I have been quite fearfull of driving it without plates and title as the police are real *******s around here. But I have done a few preliminary tests.

Acceleration is as expected underwelming but for my purposes acceptable 2 of my 4 batteries are shot so I will not state performance until I get things straightened out. It also appears the guys who welded the non-removable rear folding bench seat in place damaged the embedded voltmeter/fuel guage. So initially I was getting BS battery error/failure messages that were inaccurate. I will have to put a real ammeter / volt meter into this unit before I really start to drive. (stock has no ammeter, to me that is a travesty!, every EV I have ever had has some sort of ammeter to guage how much pedal to put on to conserve power, not to mention if I upgrade to prevent motor failure!)

The ride to me is quite a pleasant change compared to most NEVs but if you want the best range and speed you need to overinflate to 40psi and then the ride is rather craptaskic but still better than my Jetta TDI has been lately. Front of vehicle is better riding than in the rear seats.

As for the range test I went around in circles at the full 23-29mph until my speed dropped one mph. (I was in a OOB parking lot, lots of fun and strange looks) I went approx 10 miles and the two front batteryies were at 11.9 volts the rears were at a normal 12.3v. My father added water to AGMs after a battery guy told him to, something seems wrong about that also.

Miles says if I cycle the batteries enough they will come back, we will see. For now 10 miles is sufficient for many of the tasks as my folks are landlocked in town near work and near their grocery store so I may have them keep the batteries until they really have failed. Main issue is they NEED a voltmeter that accurately states the real voltage.

I also have gotten some of the tech manuals from miles and I found that the ZX40s have 4 speed trannies locked into 2nd with the linkages removed. Speed regulation is because of the motors back emf in this gearing, no actual speed regulation is employed. I'm not sure if anyone is familiar with daihtsu happy messenger trannies here but if they are and can possibly direct me to a transmission reenable after looking at the rebuild tech manual for the tranny I will send it to them. It seems if both the internal and external linkages are attached, the lock is removed and the cup holder is removed and a shifter replaced I should have a working tranny.

Based on the calculations I have done from the tech manual
1st should give me about 16-18mph (maybe a little more but at high RPM with lots of power)
2nd - Default
3rd - Slow up to about 36mph
4th - lots of amps but theoretically 56mph w/ losses I would assume about 45mph but I would need an ammeter to accurately monitor amperate so I do not burn it up, motor is quite durable but the controller is not, luckily the unit has sensors to drop current to the motor if it starts to overheat)

As for speed on flat ground it goes 26mph, with any type of incline, even ones that are almost unnoticeable you can easily accelerate to 28 or even 30mph. Up hills speed never dropped below 18mph, these were not mountains but they were relatively steep. Acceleration was good up to about 20mph everything past that was gradual I would say 1/5-1/4 mile to full speed but 0-20mph was good

I will keep everyone posted on my progress. There are always speed bumps when you get something for much less than you should :)

Cheers
Ryan

PS if anyone wants a fixer upper Miles ZX40 there may still be some left over from the fire sale. Main issue will be batteries and fading of the dash plastic, along with dust and dirt. Take care if you have someone install rear seats as it apparently is easy to disable the onboard voltmeter.

toyobug 08-29-2008 06:21 AM

can you provide info on the "fire sale"....maybe a website, email address?

rmay635703 09-19-2008 07:39 PM

There is no website or email address, you need to call, but given the continued troubles I am having with the title and other issues I can't in good faith give it out yet. If things work out I might but you may have to be prepared to fight the DOT, file complaints and go through lots of red tape to get it on the road.

bennelson 09-23-2008 09:09 PM

If you have questions on the Miles vehicles, Tim Thompson at Green Autos might be able to help you.

He's a dealer for ZENN, IT, and Miles. Can't hurt to give him a call.

https://www.greenautos.com/Home_Page.php

rmay635703 09-24-2008 02:19 PM

Right now its just a case of shut up and wait :( We had to file a complaint with the CA DOT criminal investigations. We have since sent all the paperwork we have to our DOT in Madison as the locals are useless. (local DOT says NEV's are illegal) Madison has said if we have a proper BOS we can get plates. Still waiting though, we paid for this thing in June.

We haven't gotten any response yet from either DOT after sending paperwork.

This is how the story started...

Basically Miles itself messed up the titling paperwork sent to the auction company, cars were sold with invalid or missing titles (one made it to me through D&D automotive). D&D being the nice place it was took my money but didn't pay the auction company once it found the title error (it also dooped me into taking the car without a title by saying it was in the car), proceded to give me a runaround, then forged my fathers signature on export paperwork. Miles in the meantime was trying to get me the needed paperwork but was stalled at the auction company because D&D refused to pay, so the auction company is holding it as evidense for possible lawsuit.

Now we are trying to get plates without a title, which "MAY" work and filed a complaint against D&D through the CA DOT but they are not very enthusiastic and forced us to send in the million pages of paperwork before they would consider "looking into" our case.

Nice.

rmay635703 10-05-2008 05:12 PM

My Comutacar had the mods already in place, 72v controller and D&D motor, it had a nice charger (that isn't waterproof) and a fancy energy meter that was not installed. My Comutacar does what it needs to do and I have been happy with it, just wish I could make it more weatherproof.

bennelson 10-05-2008 06:37 PM

I guess that's my main complaint about the Citicar - it's VERY open to the elements.

I figure I will end up trying to seal it as best I can, and Insulate the batteries as well.

rmay635703 10-06-2008 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bennelson (Post 65390)
I guess that's my main complaint about the Citicar - it's VERY open to the elements.

I figure I will end up trying to seal it as best I can, and Insulate the batteries as well.

I've gotten mine so it stays warm inside with just body heat the windows and doors are sealed well with new gaskets but WATER and electronics don't much agree.

I really wish there was a good way to get the window to stop leaking slowly after constant rain, my dash (and under my dash) and under my seat where my charger and forward reverse reside were always getting wet. More annoying is when the rain is harder and the top of my seat gets wet. :(

My batteries I have given up on keeping dry, they stay wet a lot and I just keep them charged so they don't die.

Ah well, still beats my Dodge Ram 1500 or my Suburban :)

rmay635703 10-20-2008 06:19 PM

Well they finally gave us plates to get this Miles ZX40 officially on the road last saturday, man has this been a pain.

We are driving it with or without an ordanance (we are avoiding 35mph streets though just in case someone is a jackhole).
The front battery seems to be shot it drops to 9.6v after 5-10 miles The #2 battery isn't much better.

On the flat the car accellerates
0-10 in approximately 5 seconds
0-20 in approximately 14 seconds (inclines make a hug difference)
0-25 in about 50 seconds

It g r a d u a l l y accelerates to about 26mph on the flat though the 45 degree weather is probably not helping things.

I have had it up to about 32mph with a few gradual hills and it maintains speed a long time so long as there isn't an incline.

This thing is MUCH more affected by hills than my comuta, a very slight incline affects the speed by 4 mph easily. Up normal hills I can maintain 18mph, up steep hills I can only go about 14mph with 3 people and a backup generator (just in case)

The ride as far as I'm concerned is excellent better than my TDI jetta, I overinflated the tires a tad so ride isn't as good but I could care less.

I still don't have a title but at least I can drive the thing.

Is anyone here willing to look at the 4 speed transmission tech manual for this vehicle to see if there might be a way of reenbling the transmission? Looking myself I can't seem to make out what I would need to accomplish.

If I can't find a way of jeryrigging the tranny I will probably end up putting in a field reduction wire and contactor (my comuta blew one side of the forward reverse so I have on available)

bennelson 10-20-2008 06:39 PM

Do you have any photos of the Miles that you couple post?

I know we would all love to see it!

hhughes0320 10-22-2008 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rmay635703 (Post 56984)
Well, I have to post on the Miles ZX40 situation

I finally got my car at the end of LAST month but did not get a title.

After calling around I found out that Miles itself had some sort of fire sale liquidation and screwed up the title transfer process, my title probably won't come until November!!! Ah well at least I know this is legit and I will eventually get it on the road.

Anyway I have been quite fearfull of driving it without plates and title as the police are real *******s around here. But I have done a few preliminary tests.

Acceleration is as expected underwelming but for my purposes acceptable 2 of my 4 batteries are shot so I will not state performance until I get things straightened out. It also appears the guys who welded the non-removable rear folding bench seat in place damaged the embedded voltmeter/fuel guage. So initially I was getting BS battery error/failure messages that were inaccurate. I will have to put a real ammeter / volt meter into this unit before I really start to drive. (stock has no ammeter, to me that is a travesty!, every EV I have ever had has some sort of ammeter to guage how much pedal to put on to conserve power, not to mention if I upgrade to prevent motor failure!)

The ride to me is quite a pleasant change compared to most NEVs but if you want the best range and speed you need to overinflate to 40psi and then the ride is rather craptaskic but still better than my Jetta TDI has been lately. Front of vehicle is better riding than in the rear seats.

As for the range test I went around in circles at the full 23-29mph until my speed dropped one mph. (I was in a OOB parking lot, lots of fun and strange looks) I went approx 10 miles and the two front batteryies were at 11.9 volts the rears were at a normal 12.3v. My father added water to AGMs after a battery guy told him to, something seems wrong about that also.

Miles says if I cycle the batteries enough they will come back, we will see. For now 10 miles is sufficient for many of the tasks as my folks are landlocked in town near work and near their grocery store so I may have them keep the batteries until they really have failed. Main issue is they NEED a voltmeter that accurately states the real voltage.

I also have gotten some of the tech manuals from miles and I found that the ZX40s have 4 speed trannies locked into 2nd with the linkages removed. Speed regulation is because of the motors back emf in this gearing, no actual speed regulation is employed. I'm not sure if anyone is familiar with daihtsu happy messenger trannies here but if they are and can possibly direct me to a transmission reenable after looking at the rebuild tech manual for the tranny I will send it to them. It seems if both the internal and external linkages are attached, the lock is removed and the cup holder is removed and a shifter replaced I should have a working tranny.

Based on the calculations I have done from the tech manual
1st should give me about 16-18mph (maybe a little more but at high RPM with lots of power)
2nd - Default
3rd - Slow up to about 36mph
4th - lots of amps but theoretically 56mph w/ losses I would assume about 45mph but I would need an ammeter to accurately monitor amperate so I do not burn it up, motor is quite durable but the controller is not, luckily the unit has sensors to drop current to the motor if it starts to overheat)

As for speed on flat ground it goes 26mph, with any type of incline, even ones that are almost unnoticeable you can easily accelerate to 28 or even 30mph. Up hills speed never dropped below 18mph, these were not mountains but they were relatively steep. Acceleration was good up to about 20mph everything past that was gradual I would say 1/5-1/4 mile to full speed but 0-20mph was good

I will keep everyone posted on my progress. There are always speed bumps when you get something for much less than you should :)

Cheers
Ryan

PS if anyone wants a fixer upper Miles ZX40 there may still be some left over from the fire sale. Main issue will be batteries and fading of the dash plastic, along with dust and dirt. Take care if you have someone install rear seats as it apparently is easy to disable the onboard voltmeter.



Ryan,
You said that you have a tech manual. Can you let me know where you got one? I am having some difficulty getting one.


I want to soup my 2007 Miles ZX40 up and get it up to about 30-35mph.

Also currently having issues with radio....no power.
Checked all fuses, but they all look good.
Do you know which fuse powers the radio?
thx.
Howard

rmay635703 10-22-2008 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hhughes0320 (Post 68728)
Ryan,
You said that you have a tech manual. Can you let me know where you got one? I am having some difficulty getting one.

I want to soup my 2007 Miles ZX40 up and get it up to about 30-35mph.

Also currently having issues with radio....no power.
Checked all fuses, but they all look good.
Do you know which fuse powers the radio?
thx.
Howard

1st off the easiest way to speed up the miles zx40 is to buy a smallish contactor (50-100 amp should be more than enough), measure the OHM value over the field and put in a small section of bare 12-16 guage copper wire of sufficient length and small enough gauge to be approximately equal to the OHM value of the field on the series wound motor. Thus when you click on the contactor over the field you will perform field reduction and be able to increase your top end speed. YOU MUST have a ammeter to monitor how much current you draw when you perform this action so you do not melt anything. It is also a very good Idea to have your contactor on an easy to access switch and only turn it on once you are going about 20mph so you don't draw too much current.

If your car has an AC motor your are up ship crick as you would need to reconfigure your controller which as of yet hasn't been accomplished (or rewind your motor). You could ask at miles35.com to see if he has done any AC cars and what approximate method he uses, sadly he is very expensive but if it works for you and you can't get it anywhere else I guess you might have no choice.

As toward the tech manual it is really just a set of repair documents...

These coarse like service manuals are for different segments of the vehicle, they are geared for troubleshooting/repairing the vehicle but don't go as in depth as I would like but they are all I have. I doubt you can get one off the web. One section does go through rebuilding the transmission which may be of use to the both of us.

MILESEVOWNERSGROUP : Messages : 1-30 of 30

there is one for sale there by I believe the owner of the company but I am uncertain how in depth it is.

As for the radio I believe one section referes to it and has a halfway circuit but again I am uncertain if it is in depth enough to fix or not.

As for the tranny the company that made it is shuttered up, I have gotten a contact but haven't tried yet. My guess is you would have to buy a complete tranny at great cost along with all the linkages. It may however be possible to change the gear permanently which I have thought about also, 3rd would give decent speed but hill power in my paticular vehicle would probably be unacceptable.

http://www.chinacarforums.com/forum/...highlight=zx40

PM me and I between the two of us maybe we can figure a way for you to get this 12 part set to fit in your email.

Cheers
Ryan

Milesdriver 02-15-2009 12:46 PM

Hi, I just stumbled upon this site and had to register. I have a Miles in the U.P. of Michigan. It is a daily driver in spring - fall. Winter is murder on batteries.

I am also having radio problems, it cuts out randomly.

All-in-all. I love the car. I'm confused about why they welded in a backseat - mine bolts in.

I bought mine in the lower peninsula and because of the model (OR70) the dealer had to register it and "plate" it as a moped. It tops out at 41mph without mods and ranges about 35 miles per charge on a stock car.

Any info in regards to making the tranny an active 4spd would be great.

rmay635703 02-15-2009 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Milesdriver (Post 87926)
Hi, I just stumbled upon this site and had to register. I have a Miles in the U.P. of Michigan. It is a daily driver in spring - fall. Winter is murder on batteries.

All-in-all. I love the car. I'm confused about why they welded in a backseat - mine bolts in.

I bought mine in the lower peninsula and because of the model (OR70) the dealer had to register it and "plate" it as a moped. It tops out at 41mph without mods and ranges about 35 miles per charge on a stock car.

Any info in regards to making the tranny an active 4spd would be great.

You are VERY lucky that you were able to get an OR70 on the road as they are NOT street legal, I had hard enough time getting ours on the road and I still do not have a title, blasted CA DMV, they wanted to close our case because we got plates even though we could never sell the car except gray market :(

If I could have gotten the OR70 onto the road I would have bought that model because it is superior to the zx40 which tops at 25mph. (I have gotten it to about 28mph due to higher tire pressure)

I am curious can you look at the motor itself and give me the numbers and code on it? I have a hunch we have the same motor but run at a different voltage, also what RPM are you at when going top speed? Mine is around 3500-4000rpm

Anyway I will post something I have in regards to rebuilding the tranny later if I can find it, not sure if it will help but if you can find someone willing to rebuild the tranny removing the welded block and put in the missing linkages you could have your 4 speed tranny working again, easiest way would be if you could find a junked out Daihatsu Move or Sambar or some other Japanese Kei car to steal a full tranny, shifter, etc. As you probably guessed your cupholder on the floor is where the shifting lever would have been.

Anyway I got this from one of my posts on another site that is good for general japanese mini vehicle info Japanese Mini Truck Forum - Powered by vBulletin
Miles Automotive sells electric vehicles, manufactured in China - Page 2 - China Car Forums

Good Luck
Ryan


\--------------------------------------------------------------
This Miles ZX40 vehicle is made for the US market, so I do not believe I have everything you want, but here goes
On the firewall
LECML55H55T000147
On the Transmission
EV7100 & 250000112

On the Electric motor
JB5335-91

On the Bumper
2803011P1

On the Vacuum Pump?
chinarupieng.com
wzrpsz@mail.wzptt.zjicn

The contact info I was given for the Daihtsu contract company who installed the motor was

Tianjin Tianqi Group Meiya Auto Manufacture Co., Ltd.
Address: Dashaozhikou, Zhongbei Town, Xiqing, Tianjin, P.R. China
Zip Code: 300112
Telephone: +86-22-27538480
E-mail: tqmy2006@163.com

I am told the Parudia and the Daihtsu Move 98-99 are related to my vehicle.
__________________________________________________ _____________

Milesdriver 02-16-2009 01:45 PM

Thanks for the info. I'll try to get the motor numbers this week. I have the batteries out for the winter, so it should be easy to find. As for rpms, mine tops out at 2500 when I'm at top speed. Here is the specs from Miles on the OR70 (2007):

http://www.milesautomotive.com/uploa...or70_specs.pdf

and the zx40 (2007):

http://www.milesautomotive.com/uploa...zx40_specs.pdf

and the zx40s (2007):

http://www.milesautomotive.com/uploa...x40s_specs.pdf

With the research I've done, the closest body match was the 2000 Move.
and the Perodua Kenari is close also: Perodua Kenari - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Btw: I like the Citicar. I tried to find one before I found the Miles.

Let me know if the specs help.

rmay635703 02-27-2009 02:26 PM

Sorry about the long wait this seems to be all I can find for the Miles transmission

Download here

Send big files the easy way. Files too large for email attachments? No problem!

Why does this forum limit doc & PDFs to 19KB?

Anyway out of one of the "modules"

Module 12:
Motor & Transmission



Introduction
Traction Motor
The electric motor is a device used to convert electrical energy into mechanical energy. When electricity is supplied to the motor, it produces mechanical motion. A good example is the starter motor on an internal combustion engine. When the ignition key is turned to the start position, the starter relay or solenoid closes to allow electric power from the battery to flow to the starter motor. It then produces mechanical motion to spin the engine. The same thing happens when the Miles ZX40S is operated.
How does the motor convert the electric power to mechanical rotation? All motors use magnetism that is created by current flowing through a wire. Any time current flows through a wire, a magnetic field is produced around that wire. Wires wrapped into coils increase the strength of the magnetic fields. These coils are used in a motor to pull the armature in a circular motion.
Because of the short length of this course, we will not delve into the theoretical operation of electric motors.
EV Motor Types
There are two general classifications of motors. The one used in the ZX40S is a Changzhou Huasheng direct current (DC) motor, part number XQ-6.3/6H. The other type is an alternating current (AC) motor, which we will not cover.
Brush Type DC Motors
Brush type DC motors use a commutator to switch the direction of current flow. Switching the current flow is what keeps the motor rotating. The commutator is the device on the armature that the brushes rub on. You have probably seen one on a starter motor.
While all brush type DC motors use a commutator and brush setup to switch current flow, there are different types of brushed motors. The primary difference that determines the type of brushed motor is how the armature and field coils are connected together. The field coils are stationary coils of wire around the housing of the motor that create a strong magnetic field to pull the armature around.
Brush type motors can be divided into three major groups (1) series wound, (2) shunt wound motors, and (3) compound wound motors. The ZX40S has a series wound motor.

Personal Safety
Your personal safety must come first. Never risk your life or livelihood with unsafe practices. If you find yourself in a dangerous situation that you cannot rectify on your own, notify your supervisor.
Wear Appropriate Work Clothing
· Wear clothing and safety equipment appropriate to the job. Close-fitting, natural fabric clothing is a good choice since polyester melts and adheres to the skin when exposed to electrical arcs.
· Wear proper eye protection, especially when using power tools.
· Wear a suitable hearing protection device, such as earplugs, to protect against objectionable or uncomfortable loud noises. Prolonged exposure to loud noise can cause impairment or loss of hearing.
· Do not play audio devices with headphones while operating a machine. Operating equipment safely requires the full attention of the operator.
· Tie long hair behind your head. Do not wear a necktie, scarf, loose clothing, or necklace when you work near machine tools or other moving parts which could entangle these objects.
· Remove rings, watches, necklaces, and other metallic items from your body to prevent electrical shorts and entanglements in moving parts.
Use Appropriate Tools and Equipment
· Keep your tools and equipment clean and in good condition.
· Make sure you have all the necessary tools, equipment, and protective devices to do your job.
· Use tools appropriate for the work. Makeshift tools and procedures create safety hazards.
· Use the correct size tool for loosening and tightening hardware. Use power tools to loosen threaded parts and fasteners when appropriate.
· Never use U.S. measurement tools on metric fasteners, or vice versa.
· Avoid bodily injury caused by slipping wrenches.
· Follow the manufacturer’s recommended procedures for removal and installation of components. Refer to the appropriate manuals when necessary.
High-Voltage Safety Precautions
Electrical safety is foremost when working on the Miles ZX40S because these vehicles operate at high voltage. Maintenance should, therefore, always be performed by a trained professional, and precautions should be taken to eliminate the possibility of accidental contact with high-voltage sources like electronic controllers, battery chargers, and test equipment.
Electronic controllers, battery chargers, and test equipment have high-voltage components that can be lethal. Some examples of these components are capacitors, contactors, shunts, resistors, and exposed terminals. Caution must be taken when discharging the capacitors and when insulating exposed terminals.
Unlike other components for energy storage, batteries cannot be de-energized for maintenance and troubleshooting procedures. There is ALWAYS voltage present at the terminals of the battery cell/module. When battery modules are connected in series the hazard of a shock is greatly increased because the voltage levels rise to lethal potential.
Precautions should also be taken to eliminate the possibility of accidental contact with high-voltage sources when training personnel, insulating the affected component parts, or installing warning labels and signs. Safety protection should be worn when working in close proximity to a high-voltage source, so rubber gloves and approved safety glasses and/or a face shield should always be used.
High-Voltage Hazards
High-voltage levels present on the Miles ZX40S can cause severe burns, muscle contractions, shock, or death. The high voltage is isolated from earth ground and chassis ground under normal circumstances. You must touch both a positive and negative point in the circuit in order to receive an electric shock.
Arcing occurs when electricity is discharged across a circuit gap. The heat at the ends of an arc can be four times the surface temperature of the sun. Severe burns can be caused when a person is near or in contact with an arc. Additionally, an arc can cause an electric blast. The blast is the expansion of the air and molten metal, usually copper, from the rapid heating that takes place.
Even a small amount of current can cause body tissue damage. This damage is caused by heat generated from current flow. When the heat passes a point where it can be dissipated, the body tissue is burned.
High-voltage electric shock can cause acute muscle contractions. A current of only 10 milliamperes (mA) can cause muscles to contract. Hands that are exposed to enough electrical current clinch tight and cannot release their grip.
Fibrillation, the disruption of the body’s normal heartbeat, can be caused by electrical shock. The current must pass through the body (for example, through a hand-to-hand connection) in order for fibrillation to occur.
To ensure safety and reduce the risk of high-voltage shock, use the following procedures:
· Never work on high voltage when you are alone. Someone else should be present in case an emergency arises.
· Never work in wet or damp areas.
· Remove all jewelry and metallic items from your body, including rings, watches, and necklaces.
· Wear approved high-voltage gloves.
· Use insulated tools when servicing battery packs. Inspect tools regularly for damaged insulation.
· Use only one hand when possible.
· DO NOT touch any component that you cannot positively identify.
· Never assume that no voltage is present; check it with a known good meter or other test device.
· Never lay tools (like wrenches, crimping/lug pliers, screwdrivers), test equipment (like meters), or any conductive material on any high-voltage component or battery pack.
· Do not allow metallic materials to simultaneously contact both terminals.
· Never try to bypass or override a safety device, such as an interlock, unless specified to do so with an approved tool as described in the manufacturer’s procedures.
· Before performing work on a battery, make sure that battery-charging equipment is disconnected and any potential DC load is disconnected.
· Cover that portion of the battery not requiring physical maintenance when the traction battery is exposed for the purpose of repairs, maintenance, or testing. Covering the battery is a precaution taken to prevent personal injury as a result of electric shock. The battery should be covered with an approved insulating material such as a rubber blanket designed for this purpose.

Motor Test Procedures
The traction motor operates on high voltage; therefore, all previously described high-voltage safety procedures should be used when testing or repairing the motor. Most EV motor testing is done with the motor removed from the power, thus eliminating the HV concerns. Care should be taken and all HV safety procedures observed when testing a motor that is connected to its power source. It is also important to disable the HV before removing a motor for testing or inspection. EV motors do not normally have capacitors in them; so once they are disconnected, there should be no HV present.
Test Procedures
The Miles ZX40S uses a brush type DC motor that must be periodically checked for brush wear and commutator condition. When inspecting brushes, you should ensure that the brushes move freely within the brush holders. The springs that apply pressure to the brushes must do so uniformly and at the correct tension. Brush tension and adjustment procedures are specified by the motor manufacturer.

The brushes should be checked to see if they are making good contact with the surface of the commutator. The surface of the brush that contacts the commutator is known as the brush face. The brush face should have a smooth, polished look across its entire surface and should be in contact with the commutator across the entire face.

Over time, the brushes wear down. This is normal and expected. Check the amount of wear remaining on the brush and compare the measurement to the motor manufacturer’s specifications for replacement. If the brush is getting close to its wear limit, it is better to go ahead and replace it than to try and get the most wear out of it. The danger is that when the brush wears down too much, it damages the commutator surface leading to an expensive repair.

The commutator should be inspected when the brushes are checked. It should appear clean, smooth, and somewhat polished. A slight brownish or caramel color is acceptable in the area where the brushes make contact.

If the commutator is grooved or pitted, it must be repaired by a motor repair facility or replaced. Very minor roughness of the commutator can be sanded with fine grit sandpaper (no emery cloth) to smooth the surface if this procedure is acceptable to the manufacturer.

All types of motors may need to have their windings tested at some point. Windings can be checked with an ohmmeter from one end connection to the other to make sure they are not open. Since windings are nothing more than a wire wrapped around in circles, there should be very little resistance in a good winding.

A common fault with motor windings is that they either partially or fully short to the motor case. A short causes poor or no motor performance and an HV to chassis leakage condition. A megger, as described earlier, is used to test for any breakdown in the winding’s insulation.
To take the measurement, one lead of the megger is connected to one winding terminal, while the other megger lead is connected to the motor’s case. Then use the megger to apply the HV to the circuit, and it will give a reading in ohms of the resistance between the windings and the case. Compare the reading to the manufacturer’s specifications.
Troubleshooting Procedures
Troubleshooting the Miles ZX40S should be done according to manufacturer’s procedures. Always follow the specified procedures and use the proper tools when diagnosing and repairing these vehicles.
Propulsion System Troubleshooting
Even reliable electric vehicles sometimes fail to start or to drive. Just as there is a sequence of procedures that should be followed to find the cause of an ICE not starting—such as checking for ignition spark and fuel first—there is a sequence to find the cause of a Miles ZX40S operating failure.
The Miles ZX40S has two batteries systems: a high-voltage traction battery pack (72-volt) that supplies energy to the traction motor that powers the wheels and a 12-volt auxiliary battery that supplies energy to start the vehicle and run the accessories. Proper voltage is fundamental to the operation of the Miles ZX40S. Voltage from the traction batteries must be available and sufficient to power the vehicle, and voltage from the auxiliary battery must be available and sufficient to start the vehicle by closing the main contactor. These are the first things to check on a Miles ZX40S that does not start or drive:
1. Check the auxiliary battery voltage at its terminals. The voltage should be at least 12.0 volts. If the voltage is low, charge the battery and test it. Also, check the DC/DC converter to ensure that it is providing a charge to the auxiliary battery.
2. Check the traction battery voltage at the input to the DC/DC converter.
3. Once the presence of sufficient traction pack and auxiliary battery voltage is established, determine whether the main contactor is working. The voltage on the traction pack is the potential that must flow to the controller for the vehicle to operate.
4. You can test the contactor by turning on the ignition switch and listening for the click sound of the contactor closing. But don’t rely on the click. Check the voltage on the output of the contactor regardless of whether or not you heard the click.
5. If no voltage is available at the contactor’s output, check to see if the coil of the contactor is receiving the 12.0 or more volts needed to close it. If the voltage to the coil is present, replace the contactor and check its output voltage. If no voltage is present at the coil, then the ignition circuit from the auxiliary battery to the contactor coil must be checked for a circuit. Check not only the wiring and ignition switch, but any lockouts as well, such as a charging or accelerator lockout relay that might be stuck open. Refer to the vehicle’s wiring diagram so that you can trace the ignition circuit completely.
6. When voltage is present at the contactor output, check for open circuits in the cable from the contactor output to the controller input. If you are certain that the controller has a voltage supply, check its output. This should be done according to the controller output test procedures. If the controller is producing the proper output, then check the motor or driveline. If the controller has no output, then the problem could be a fault with a signal that is required for the controller to operate. Required signals include the throttle potentiometer, high pedal lockout, charging lockout, and drive position signals as well as others.
7. First, check the throttle potentiometer and the drive selection switch. If the controller is receiving all the necessary signals and has input voltage but no output, replace the controller.
Traction Motor Maintenance
It is a good practice to periodically check the motor because problems that cause motor failure usually develop over a fairly long period of time. By identifying these problems early, motor failures can be eliminated. Every six months, do the following:
· Inspect the connections to and from the motor for tightness, corrosion, and discoloration
· Check the mounting bolts and brackets of the motor for tightness.
Once a year, do the following:
· Inspect the motor bearings. If the motor is not removed from the vehicle, listening carefully to the bearings as the motor rotates in a quiet environment will usually reveal a bad bearing by a rough sound.
· Check the lubrication of the bearing.

Motor and Transmission Safety Procedures

Safety Equipment:
Safety glasses
Properly-rated electrical safety gloves
Electrical tape

Motor and Transmission Safety Procedures:
· Use insulated tools when possible. However, insulated tools DO NOT create a hazard-free working environment alone.
· Technicians MUST proceed as though they are working with non-insulated tools. This continued attitude will ensure that a safe working environment is maintained.
· NOTE: When using insulated tools, always check the manufacturer ratings for their tools.
· SAFETY NOTE: Make sure the insulated tools are rated for at least a 72-volt system.
· Wear appropriate work clothing.
· Use appropriate tools and equipment for the job.
· Never use U.S. measurement tools on metric fasteners, or vice versa.
· Maintain a safe working environment.
· Keep the service area clean and dry.
· Understand each service procedure before beginning any work.
· Understand all chemical safety precautions and procedures in case of accidental contact with acid.
· It is strongly recommended that you review the Safety Procedures that are listed in the Safety and Multi-Meter Module.

Motor and Transmission Diagnostic Procedures

Safety Equipment:
Safety glasses
Properly-rated electrical safety gloves
Electrical tape

Tool Box:
Metric tool set
Multi-meter

Introduction:
The front wheel propulsion for the Miles ZX40S is provided by a transaxle assembly combination of the XQ-6.3/6H DC traction motor and a 4-speed manual transmission, which is permanently locked into 2nd gear. For these reasons, there are no replacement issues with either of the components. The transmission can still be rebuilt, but all of the shift linkage have been removed.

Warnings:
· Use proper vehicle lifting methods set forth by both the lift manufacturer and the lift procedures already established in the Lifting Module.
· The use of pneumatics is allowed on everything except for the batteries and the motor.

Diagnostic Procedures for Motor:
1. Check the batteries (see Traction Battery Module).
2. Check the ignition.
NOTE: If you turn the key and the Instrument Panel lights up and you hear the vacuum pump, then the ignition is okay.
3. Check the controller (see Controller System Module).
4. Check the DC/DC converter (see DC/DC Converter Module).
5. Check to see if all of the wiring is still connected and working properly.
6. Check motor brushes (see Motor Brush Module).
7. If a problem still exists, check the motor.







Logic Trees






Diagnostic Procedures for Transmission:
1. Check to make sure the brakes are properly working.
2. Check to see if the direction switch on the dash is working properly.
3. Check to see if the short shafts are fuctional.
NOTE: You will hear a loud banging noise if the shafts are broken, and a visual inspection will confirm this.
4. If steps 1-3 do not diagnose the problem, then the problem could be internally with the gears.


Logic Tree—General Overview


Motor and Transmission Removal Procedures

Safety Equipment:
Safety glasses
Properly-rated electrical safety gloves
Electrical tape

Tool Box:
Metric tool set
Multi-meter
Chisels or flat-head screwdrivers
Pneumatics (optional)
Transmission jack or jack stands
Subframe assembly plate (optional)
Ball-joint separator

Introduction:
The front wheel propulsion for the Miles ZX40S is provided by a transaxle assembly combination of the XQ-6.3/6H DC traction motor and a 4-speed manual transmission, which is permanently locked into second gear. The XQ-6.3/6H traction motor weighs 137 lbs. The transmission weights approximately 100 lbs and has a capacity of 2.113 quarts.

Warnings:
· Use proper vehicle lifting methods set forth by both the lift manufacturer and the lift procedures already established in the Lifting Module of this course.
· The use of pneumatics is allowed on everything except for the batteries and the motor.

Removal Procedures:
1. Disconnect the auxiliary 12-volt battery.
2. Disconnect the master disconnect.
SAFETY NOTE: Cover the exposed terminals to prevent shock hazards. Use electrical tape or terminal boot cap.
SAFETY NOTE: Cover the positive and negative cables to prevent electrical shock.
3. Disconnect the steering universal joint at the floor boards.
NOTE: Make sure to fully remove the bolt and position the boot back over the joint for easier lifting.
4. Lift vehicle.
NOTE: Use safe lifting procedures (see Lifting Module).
5. Remove front wheels.
6. Disconnect lower control arm.
7. Disconnect steering box tie rod ends from the steering knuckle.
NOTE: DO NOT reuse the castle nuts or cotter pins.
8. Remove sway bar.
NOTE: There is no need to remove or loosen the shock mount bolts or suspension bolts.
WARNING! If you remove the knuckle from the shock mounts, you will need to reset the toe in and out, as well as caster and camber angles.
9. Remove peen nut from axle shaft.
NOTE: Remove peen with either a chisel or flat-head screwdriver. DO NOT reuse this nut.
10. Remove half shafts from the steering knuckle.
11. Remove the front fascia.
SAFETY NOTE: Place a meter set to measure DC Volts on all of the motor wires to make sure there is no residual voltage.
12. Label and remove the motor wires.
13. Remove wiring harness from transmission.
14a. Method One: Place four jack stands under motor and transmission.
NOTE: Make sure that the sub-assembly is supported with a jack before proceeding. Make sure the jacks are properly aligned to support the motor and transmission.
WARNING! MAKE SURE SUPPORT IS ALIGNED WITH NO GAPS AND/OR SWAYING OR ROCKING! IF THE MOTOR FALLS, IT CAN CAUSE SERIOUS INJURY OR DAMAGE TO THE MOTOR AND TRANSMISSION.
14b. Method Two: Place the sub-assembly plate (see Service Manual for information) on transmission jack.
NOTE: Make sure that the plate is supported by the transmission jack before proceeding. Make sure the jack is properly aligned to support the motor and transmission.
WARNING! MAKE SURE SUPPORT IS ALIGNED WITH NO GAPS AND/OR SWAYING OR ROCKING! IF THE MOTOR FALLS IT CAN CAUSE SERIOUS INJURY OR DAMAGE TO THE MOTOR AND TRANSMISSION.
15. Both methods are the same for the rest of the procedures. Lower the vehicle until it comes in contact with the jack set up.
NOTE: At this time, make sure plate or jacks are level and aligned properly before proceeding. Make sure jack or stands have not slipped!
NOTE: Make sure everything that was listed above was removed and that the plate is stable and secure before proceeding.
16. Remove the four sub-assembly mounting bolts.
17. Slowly raise the vehicle until the subframe assembly separates from the car.
WARNING! STAND CLEAR OF MOTOR AND TRANSMISSION WHEN LIFTING!
NOTE: It is important you make sure steering shaft separates from the universal joint in the car as it is lifted.
WARNING! If steering shaft does not separate from knuckle, damage to steering box will occur!
NOTE: Have a second person keep an eye on the sheering shaft and the plate to make sure the sub-assembly will separate cleanly.
18. Lift car two inches. Inspect steering box for freedom, raise two inches, and repeat inspection to ensure steering box is not strained or damaged.
NOTE: Once the vehicle is at the desired height, place a support under the rear of the vehicle.
19. With the subframe on the floor, remove either the motor or the transmission.
20. Disconnect the mounting bolts and remove the desired part.
21. Install the new motor or transmission and reverse the above procedures to install the subframe assembly back into the car.




Notes:
In order to separate the motor from the transmission, you do not need to drain the transmission fluids. Remove casing bolts to slide units apart. The transmission and motor are connected with a splined-shaft. The tolerance of this connection is small.
Carefully slide the unit apart to avoid damage to the splined shafts.
The torque of the high-voltage connections should be checked every 3,000 miles or every six months, whichever occurs first.


Installation Torque:
· SAFETY NOTE: The use of a threadlocker is prohibited.
· Motor to transmission -- 50 ft-lbs
· Subframe bolts -- 60 ft-lbs
· Electrical connections -- 16 ft-lbs
· Stabilizer bar to subframe -- 40 ft-lbs
· Stabilizer bar to lower control arm -- 60 ft-lbs
· Steering tie-rod end to steering knuckle -- 30 ft-lbs
· Lower control arm to stabilizer bar -- 70 ft-lbs
· Lower control arm to steering knuckle -- 30 ft-lbs
· Axle hub nut -- 160 ft-lbs

Milesdriver 02-28-2009 11:37 AM

Thanks. I think this may help out. I've been looking for Daihatsu Move parts in the U.S., but as you know, they a few and far between.

Is yours a 48 volt or 72?

rmay635703 02-28-2009 02:06 PM

Were you able to download the transmission rebuild file? I couldn't find a decent free download service, they all have started dissappearing in the last few months.

If you have any luck figuring out how to move the transmission internally up a gear or down, leave a post here about how it goes, how much work etc. I looked inside once but was confused and gave up, also it looked like I had to tear apart more than I would like.

Milesdriver 03-01-2009 10:17 AM

Yes I was able to download the file. I haven't had time to read it yet. I'm still trying to move snow and have a few other projects that take priority right now.

I'll keep you posted. BTW I just saw a citicar on ebay yesterday, located in lower Michigan, if you know anyone looking for one.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Cars-...3A1|240%3A1318

mspradz 05-04-2009 07:44 PM

I bought a 2005 Miles ZX40 electric vehicle in July and I think the batteries are dead. It worked a little in July and August but then it died and I had to have it towed back to my house. I have been searching the net to find out how to purchase new batteries and it has been difficult to find this information. In fact, the most information I got came from you on this blog. I am not at all mechanical but I would like to get my car working again. Any suggestions?

bennelson 05-04-2009 09:27 PM

Replacing the batteries is easy. Pull one out. Measure it. Go to Walmart and buy a bunch of the same size!

Put them in. It's real easy.

rmay635703 05-05-2009 03:21 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Sorry, this will be long, you should check your batteries before you give up, if you want to replace with non-miles batteries you will need to do something similar to what I've done either wiring them into the back of the rear seat or clearing out your spare tire area for extra battery space.

If you do decide to get all new and trash the old batteries LET ME KNOW as I WILL TAKE THEM!!! I will pay the scrap value for them if you are nearby should you decide to get rid of them.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mspradz (Post 102270)
I bought a 2005 Miles ZX40 electric vehicle in July and I think the batteries are dead. It worked a little in July and August but then it died and I had to have it towed back to my house. I have been searching the net to find out how to purchase new batteries and it has been difficult to find this information. Any suggestions?

First, Did you try contacting Miles itself? Doug Rosen (the owner) is very helpfull.
Miles Electric Vehicles
310-390-4890

I am very tempted to order one battery myself (yes they do sell them), the batteries aren't as bad as some describe them to be but they work best if used which yours and mine probably weren't. I think they are an OK value for large capacity AGM's and they obviously fit without any "work"

Anyway I myself received a car with 4 "bad" unused batteries, I eventually brought them into a local mom & pop battery mart and they ran them on an automatic high amperage charge/discharge desulphating charger for a few days and 2 of the 4 came back. On my own I brought back 1 more battery and the last just keeps dropping in voltage down to around 11v and is probably shot.

If you know of any small locally owned battery places (especially ones that service golf carts) find out if they will cycle and desulphate your batteries for a small fee, state that you think they are probably on their way out. The place I brought mine to did it free.

Also I would strongly recommend before you buy any batteries that you do the following.
1. Buy a multmeter
2. Buy a cheap 10-20 amp automatic DIGITAL 12v battery charger.
(or a pair of jumper cables to hookup to your car whiles its running if you aren't afraid of doing it that way)
3. Buy a cheap battery tester/ discharger from harbor freight (or some place similar)

These batteries are fairly durable but once they get "screwed up" you need to charge them rapidly then discharge rapidly.

To check your batteries....
(the miles website has a file on how to fix bad batteries, you can ask them for access when you call)

After your vehicle finishes charging, check the voltages of each of your batteries, if one is significantly lower than the others hookup the 12v battery charger and let it charge until it finishes.

Let the batteries sit overnight with the charger unplugged, check the voltages in the morning. This reading will be your resting voltage, it should be around 13.2 volts if the batteries are in really good condition, around 12.6 volts if they are moderate to good conditionl. Below 12.6v and the battery is likely failing but don't give up on it instantly, cycling it with the small 12v battery charger (or better yet a pair of jumper cables and your cars alternator) and then discharging it with your battery discharger can make it start coming back. Or like I said there are places that can do it more quickly and effectively if you look around

My guess is if you check you will probably find only a few of your batteries (possibly one) are not up to the proper charge level (which is around 13.2v for these batteries)

Quote:

Originally Posted by bennelson (Post 102286)
Replacing the batteries is easy. Pull one out. Measure it. Go to Walmart and buy a bunch of the same size!

Put them in. It's real easy.

Its easy but not that easy, you will need to put some styrofoam, plywood or whatever to hold up/hold in the batteries you buy as the ones in the car are very odd large 12v batteries (6.4"x18.35"). The size is such that 2 normal 12v are way too small, need to be mounted 90 degrees differently (a c-clip and wire routing has to be changed) and you need to tie them down (and the range sucks from them compared to the 101lb Tianjan AGMs) And the 4x 6 volt batteries are too wide/long to fit in the compartments for the pair of 12v miles batteries.

Anyway if you don't like the miles battery the cheap models you can get at wallmart and other places will need to be 6 volt or 8 volt to get any range, take care on what you select as they likely won't fit without some effort AND the car has 2 24 volt bins of batteries one in the front and one in the rear under the seat, THEY MUST BE 24v as there are 24v electronics hooked up to each pack separately.

I've found that if you take out the top metal battery holdown rack and put a piece of plywood under you can fit 3x 8 volt trojan T-875/895 batteries in place of each 12v set. This is probably the easiest (albeit not perfect) way of replacing the batteries with non-miles batteries. If you go with 6 volt batteries look at the picture of my car. (that is what you will have to do)

Or you need to clear out the spare tire area.

(also remember non-miles batteries will require the copper bus bars replaced with a normal battery cable for terminal type batteries available from any Fleet farm or store that sells deepcycles as the bus bars are sized specifically for the lug spacing on the miles battery)

Good Luck, if you have specific questions feel free to ask, I have been there done that and yes batteries ARE available from Miles.

But you can get cheaper batteries elsewhere but DO NOT BUY 12volt deepcycles as you will be VERY dissappointed.

I also have some email addies I should give you of dealers that are more helpfull providing mods and suggestions.

rmay635703 05-05-2009 04:06 PM

4 Attachment(s)
WHile I am here I might as well post a progress report on what I've been doing, the main thing is USING THE VAN, but I have done a few minor things.

I have purchased 4 junkyard Trojan t1275 12v batteries the place I bought them from added acid to make them appear to be much better than they are.

What I've done is I use the 2 original Miles 12v 150ahr AGM batteries in the front bin and a set of (now 5) 12v batteries in the rear bin, I have drug my feet on converting the batteries or dumping the acid as I would do with a 6v battery because 12v FLA batteries love to short out during the rejuvinating process.

Right now my range is around 18miles techinically I could drive a little further but it would be very hard on the poor batteries in the back.

I also found that inflating the tires to 60psi, replacing the gear oil with synthetic and a little moly on the bearings I can keep and sustain my speed around 30-32mph depending on my battery level on flat ground.

At the moment the van is sufficient for everything we do locally Oh, and here are some pictures.

bennelson 05-05-2009 08:21 PM

Is there a certain "size" on those batteries? Group 34 for example?

I looked on the MIles web page, and only saw that the batteries are listed as "150ah AGM". That DOES sound like a weird size.

rmay635703 05-06-2009 11:17 AM

They are a cross between Group 2E and a 97r (lol, the closest size is 2E but they are wider and taller)

On the batteries is L2404 and on the front GFM150 my guess is they are a chinese standard and something worth noting the 150ahr seems to be the UNDER LOAD capacity with peukert figured not the nominal capacity which is why its hard to get a battery that performs similarly to these gigantic batteries.

If he wanted 4 6 volt batteries in the rear pack he would need to remove the battery charger and reroute it up front, one of the dealers said to remove the front grill and slide stuff around to fit in the 4 6 volt batteries but some new battery hold downs would need to be made as they just float there over the motor on a few carefully placed strips of metal.

rmay635703 05-18-2009 11:42 AM

Well, I have finally done it, sadly its temporary.

I placed 3 of my ancient trojan T-875 8 volt batteries in place of the two 12v 1275's in the back of the ZX40 and my range went from roughly 18miles to 40 miles (possibly a little further but one battery goes lower than it should around 40 miles and I need to reduce speed)

With a 40miles range I can go two towns over and back, I can go anywhere in wausau and back, I can go to Mosinee and back. This is nice.

Sadly my top speed dropped from a peak of about 30-32mph down to around 28mph, the batteries have more capacity but at a slightly lower voltage so my speed is lower, that and they weigh more. If they didn't have 18,000 miles on them they might have a higher voltage :)

I stole the batteries from my C-car which has some shredded unlabled white wires that I am still trying to sort out (my C-car was running with burnt wires, very strange as I don't know what the disconnected devices did)

Now I really need to get a pair of replacement chinaman 101lb 150ahr AGM batteries @ $250 each I am waiting :( Funny thing is I think I am drawing more than 150ahr 9.6kw used on a 48v pack and still 50% battery capacity something just aint right.

Too bad no one locally has a good test station, I would like to test one of these for its real capacity, it appears 150ahr is the rating under load to 50% capacity, if that is true we have a 300ahr AGM which at $250 is a steal.

Cheers
Ryan

Oval_Overload 03-09-2010 10:18 AM

Did you ever get your speed conundrum figured out?

~Jimbo
Electric Vehicle Store, Minneapolis

rmay635703 03-09-2010 07:36 PM

We have just been using the van AS-is. Though I added an ammeter and 12v meter.

We have purchased a new set of greensaver 6v 250ahr batteries which seem to be working "OK" thus far

When we do want an occasional increase in speed I have a field reduction setup which can move the van up to about 35mph or so but only during "optimal" conditions.

Normal speed is stuck between 28-33mph depending on the temperature outside.

Ideally we would move to 72v and regear into 3rd, sadly the transmission is just too expensive and far away to justify and 72v won't work since I have a nice and expensive 48v set of greensavers in the van for testing. Also voltage moves require

1. New controller
2. New charger
3. Royally messed up battery box configurations (not sure where to put them when using 6v golf cart type)
4. Very strange inbalanced wiring to the dash and contactors

I would love to have a transmission (more than 72v actually) but can't justify it.

Since it does what we need it to do at 28mph around town why mess with a good thing? Also at 48v at top speed we are only using 144 watt/mile

Which ain't half bad!

I have considered a bypass contactor, sadly though the batteries for the bypass would have to go in the back of the vehicle REALLY far away from the motor, bleh! And I already have 3 sitting on the ass end of the car now which makes for more drag and wear on the rearend.

Cheers
Ryan

Oval_Overload 03-09-2010 08:26 PM

I guess I'm not really familiar with the DC cars. Our Miles is a 72 volt, AC drive. It hits the 35 mph legal limitation without complaint. I'm sure it would do a brisk 40 mph.

Have you reprogramed the controller?

~Jimbo

rmay635703 03-09-2010 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oval_Overload (Post 165240)
Have you reprogramed the controller?

~Jimbo

LoL, A curtis 1204 either works... poorly or not at all

In any event my car is serial number 29, it is one of the very first made and is so early it does not even have the "Standard" heat that is supposed to be included.

Anyway Series motors only go faster at higher volts or with a transmission (gears).

Although it would be rather interesting to install a 48v AC drive motor & controller in there or a perminent mag motor. Any volunteers to build a controller and locate a motor that can spin high RPM at 48v :)

I never have found the proper spec for the motor shaft, from what I hear it is rather odd and non-standard though.

Cheers
Ryan

rmay635703 03-16-2010 05:58 PM

Well I ended up replacing the hacksaw blade field reduction resistor with a long section of heavy guage wire and sucess!

I now can hit 38mph on flat ground with a slight tail wind, 35mph is reliable under most conditions and 33mph into the wind on a slight incline.

Trouble is my amps are around 125amps at 33mph into a headwind up an incline and about 100amps at 38mph with this new resistor.

I really wish a decent variable field reduction schematic would be made, depending on the situation more or less field reduction works better.

Cheers
Ryan


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