Motorcycle conversion ideas
 

Hello everyone. This is my first of hopefully many threads here. I need some advice. Working on mechanical things has always been a hobby for me. I've worked on cars/trucks, replaced engines and transmissions, and recently I got a newer truck. Since it's newer I don't want to tinker with it and break anything, so I decided to get another object for my hobby: a 1995 Hobda CBR motorcycle that I originally intended to do an electric conversion on. So in my work area sits a stripped down Honda CBR. I got the bike complete with engine and everything, so I'm trying (but failing) to sell those parts. This is where the problem is.

After doing some in depth research on my goals and weighing the costs, the electric conversion is getting expensive. I originally wanted a bike that could reach 75 MPH and have a range of about 35-45 miles. I'm seeing motors and controllers for those go for $2000+, and even as high as $4000. That's not including the cost of batteries. At that cost, I might as well have just bought a Brammo motorcycle.

So I was thinking and weighing out my decisions. I was considering 2 or 3 cheaper electric motors to run together to ease the load and cost. I've also been considering just rebuilding the original engine. Since nowhere around here will rebuild engines off the bike for a reasonable cost, I thought getting other engines to put in place.

I need some advice guys. I'd like to stick with electric, but the cost of everything doesn't seem like it's worth it. So If not electric, I'd like something simple to fix (I HATE dealing with oil, coolant, and any vehicle fluids. It always gets messy). Which is why I was considering another engine that's possibly air cooled. Should I stick with electric or go with another engine? If I go electric, where can I source some parts that are cheap, efficient, and will reach the 75MPH goal? (I don't need sustained 75MPH speeds for 40 miles. At most I go 10 miles at 75 MPH. Most of the cruising I do is around town.)

Have you considered getting a 250 CC motorcycle and doing aero mods? A realistic goal would be to get over 100 MPG and have an engine that's loafing at 75 MPH.

I've not considered that because I was dead set on an electric sportsbike. I wanted to learn new skills like welding and figured a motor bracket and battery holsers would be great to learn from.

72 Volt Electric Motorcycle Kit has one of the expensive kits that I assume you are talking about, personally I think that the motor they are selling is over sized, it's sized more for a small car, not a motorcycle! the 9" motor is what my parents have in their electric car and that motor is plenty big for a car so it would make an awesome but expensive motorcycle, I'd opt for something more along the lines of a 6.7" motor, more or less a golf cart motor with an end plate and output shaft that is set up for the higher voltage, almost big enough for a car but just about right for a motorcycle!

Otherwise I'd buy a used motor from a heavy equipment salvage yard, something in the 6" to 8" range and either buy an Alltrax 7245 controller, a used speed controller or build an Open Revolt speed controller.
To get 75mph I suspect you are going to have to go with a 72v battery pack, but if you shop around I think you could build the whole thing for less then $2,000.

i think shopping around is my problem. As big as vegas is I cant seem to find a scrap yard with motors I need. And online I cant seem to find the right prices. Are there any online places you'd recommend?

You can look on Ebay for used parts.
[EV Tradin' post] - Motors has a bunch of used motors, I've bought stuff off there a few times.
Classifieds - DIY Electric Car Forums is the DIY electric car forum classifieds.

You should also see if there is a chapter of the Electric Auto Association in your area and talk to other club members to see if they have parts for sale.

How about a diesel from a 5 to 7.5 kw generator? Lister (English) made or makes
singles for sure, and I think V twin diesels that shrimp boats used for belt drive generators. Any swap will be more difficult because of the "unit" construction of
most post 1965 motorcycles. They share a common crankcase (engine and transmission)
and consequently lube oil.

what do yu guys think of the D&D ES-31B series DC 48-120v? i see one of those for sale on that classifides section fir a good price. Do you think it's small enough and strong enough for my needs?

Or what about the D&D 170-512-0005? Why is it $300 when it has all the specs i need when compared to $800 models?

I'd have to look closer at the specs of both of those motors, but the first thing that jumps out at me is how long they both are and how heavy they both are, the more expensive higher output one is almost twice as long and getting close to twice as heavy too, at least I think I'm looking at the right specs... but the smaller and cheaper of those two motors is shorter then then even a golf cart motor, so while you might be able to get away with running it at a higher voltage if you force cool it, it's really hard to say, D&D along with other motor companies tend to be pretty good at telling you how far you can push their motors.

I never considered weight. I see what you mean. I'm looking at some other smaller motors like the mars ME series and they're about 35 lbs (compared to 51-62 lbs for the D&D). The Mars are also smaller.

Here's another example of the prices versus specs I need help with:

ME0913 - $820

3-Phase Permanent Magnet Brushless Motor
24 - 96 Volts
Efficiency of 92%
12 KW (180 amps DC) continuous @ 96 Volts
23 KW for 1 minute (600 amps DC) Peak @ 96 Volts
Peak Stall Torque of 90 Nm (66 ft)
Designed for long life. No brush maintenance.
8" OD, 7.17" long (w/o shaft)
7/8"x 1-5/8", 3/16" key shaft
35 Lbs

ME0201014201 - $425

3-Phase Permanent Magnet Brushless Motor
24 - 72 Volts
Efficiency of 90%
90 amps continuous current at 48 VDC
Designed for long life. No brush maintenance.
8" OD, 7.17" long (w/o shaft)
7.9" OD, 5.8" long (w/o shaft)
22 Lbs

Can someone explain the differences in the two? There are some specs on the first motor that aren't listed on the second motor, such as "23 KW for 1 minute (600 amps DC) Peak @ 96 Volts"

And
The 180 amps continues and 90 amps continues are what jump out at me there, because even if you could run a higher voltage in that 2nd motor you are still limited by how many amps it can handle and that number is exactly half, so I suspect they use both a larger gauge wire and more of it, that would account for the extra weight in the same size case.
Being able to draw 600 amps peek at 96v is pretty good, twice the voltage of my car and around the same number of amps that I see if I floor it going up a good size hill, so I'm almost thinking you could get away with using that motor... 3 phase controller would be the only real draw back, they tend to cost more.

Thanks for the info, that clears it up a bit. I've been searching some other forums and found some other bike builders and I've seen a few use the ME0913, one guy chose the ME1003.

I want to say I've settled on the ME0913, but I want some advice. Has anyone looked into the ME1003 versus the ME0913 on a previous build?

Here are the specs and prices for each:

ME0913 - $820
3-Phase Permanent Magnet Brushless Motor
24 - 96 Volts
Efficiency of 92%
12 KW (180 amps DC) continuous @ 96 Volts
23 KW for 1 minute (600 amps DC) Peak @ 96 Volts
Peak Stall Torque of 90 Nm (66 ft)
Designed for long life. No brush maintenance.
8" OD, 7.17" long (w/o shaft)
7/8"x 1-5/8", 3/16" key shaft
35 Lbs

Mars ME1003 - $625
The ME1003 has a double brush set capable of 11.5 KW (200 amps) continuous and 23 KW for 1 minute (400 amps) @ 72 Volts
Permanent Magnet
12 - 72 Volts
8" OD, 7.42" long (w/o shaft)
7/8"x 1-5/8", 3/16" key shaft
39 Lbs

Here's a link to the other thread I was reading

My #1 goal at this point is to pick out a motor so I can order it and get it mounted to the frame so I can begin fabricating brackets and painting the frame. The controller and everything will come later.

-edit-

Also, how are electric motors at freely spinning? If I'm letting off the throttle and coasting to a stop light, will the motor cause any resistance and slow me down?

bump. Any advice on the motors? Im thinking the ME0913 just because "you get what you pay for."

I like the idea of the stronger more powerful motor because it should give you more pep and the motor it's self will be under less stress, you also gain 2% in range because of the increased efficiency of the motor.

Now depending on the controller you use, a 3 phase motor like that should give you nice regen braking as well.

About to pull the trigger on this ME0913 purchase. Yay or nay? Is it the engine I'm looking for?

Does anyone know if a prebuilt Open Revolt controller can be purchased? Or a kit?

[EV Tradin' post] - Controllers has one listed for $700 fully built, but I don't think they will work with a 3 phase brushless motor, that is the only draw back to a 3 phase motor is that you need a 3 phase controller.

Also, Im weighing costs of kits versus buying parts individually. I know I'll need the controller, but not I'm reading (but not seeing) about chargers. Will I also need a $700 charger for the batteries to go along with a $500 controller?

I'm looking at $700 for the motor, $600 for the controller, and now a charger?

$700 for a charger seems a bit much, I spent $650 or a charger for my car, but that was because I wanted a top of the line charger, other options seem to be in the $300 to $500 range, of course it also depends on what you have for batteries and what you want the charger to do.

Just giving you guys a quick update. Motor finally shipped and I should get it within a week. I landed on the ME0913 because it seems to be the most widely used for motorcycle conversions which means I'll have more community support if I have any questions or issues. It may not be the absolute best motor (AC15 or AC20 would have been better) but community support is important in this project, along with keeping it cost efficient.

I think I may begin photographing and documenting the project as I begin mounting the motor and making brackets for it, since right now it's a stripped bike. Nothing too special worth documenting now.

Alright guys, need some advice. I'm about to begin mounting the motor, but I need to know what needs to be bought first. I need to make a custom bracket/frame to hold the motor in place to the motorcycle frame. Should I get the sprocket for the motor first and then the chain so I know how it'll fit in place? Or should I mount it and worry about sprocket and chain after?

Personally I would get the sprocket and chain, align them perfectly, then from that position make your engine mount. Since I can weld, that's how I would do it, then I would have perfect alignment. You could also slot the bracket to allow for adjustment, but if you are using a motorcycle chassis then it should already have a front to rear adjustment capability.

regards
Mech

I can change the chain tension by moving the rear wheel forward or backward. I already have a website in mind that has the sprocket, but I have 2 questions before I purchase.

1: What size of sprocket should I get (number of teeth) for the motor? I'm looking at getting up to 65-70 MPH with this bike and wand a good gear ration to support that.

2: Can you even purchase chains with removable links anymore? I'm not seeing any for sale. Or maybe I'm just looking at the wrong vendors.

-edit-
I was able to do some more research finally and it seems a 4.5:1 ration is standard, but if you want faster acceleration and faster speeds, 8:1 is what people are using. So I think I'll look in the range of 6:1 or 6.5:1.

I'm posting more parts and parts sources so others know what to get and where to buy it.

Looking to start with a 16 tooth gear for the motor. I'm thinking of this one here.

For the wheel, I'm looking at an 80 tooth sprocket. I haven't done any measurements for the rear wheel yet, so I don't know the exact gear I'll get. I need to get the diameter of the bore first.

Alright guys. Sorry for the flood of triple posts. I need some help. I got the motor in and I've been trying to custom fabricate a very simple mounting plate. Does anyone know of a shop that sells generic mounting plates for the ME0913 motor? I'm looking for a generic plate that I can then weld or bolt onto my bike frame, so it doesn't need to be custom fit or anything. I find that at this point in the project I am lacking the proper tools to cut and drill all of the metals.

this company sells motorcycle kits; fabrication required
hub motor, brushless motor, brushless dc motor, BLDC motor, bike conversion kit, brushless controller,brushless motor controller,electric bike,wheelchair controller,electric car motor,brushless joystick controller,electric outboard conversion

good forum for electric vehicles
Endless-sphere.com • Index page

Alright guys. Got my welder and I'm about to mount the motor, but I've run into a problem finding the sprockets I need. I decided to go with a 6.5:1 ratio, meaning a 14 tooth sprocket on the motor and a 72 tooth sprocket on the wheel. However, I'm having trouble finding a vendor who sells 72 tooth sprockets.

Do anyone have any vendors in mind for 72 tooth (or maybe 128 tooth?) sprockets? I should mention that I have found some sites that sell 72 tooth, but they're like $80 a pop.

On to my second issue, the controller. Can you guys do me a favor and keep your eyes/ears out for a used controller? Maybe one from another project that has been abandoned? I'm looking for a reasonably priced controller that's below the $300 mark.