New (old) truck - 1986 Toyota Hulix 4x4 - Build thread
 

Well to make a long story short, been looking for this truck for ages, sadily it is in poor shape and needs a lot of work, but I found it, and it was a good price :). Came with 2 parts trucks as well, so the main thing I need to do is get the body fixed up so it won't rot out in a year or 2 lol.

Specs:

22RE engine out of some newer truck (don't even know if it is a 2.2L or 2.4L)
4x4 (rear axle needs rebuilt/replaced, was dry when I hulled it, and to load it backwards on the dolly to get it home).
5 speed stick, seems to work fine of the good 3 mins I messed around with it running lol
Body = trashed/rusted, I live in Michigan, it is standard for anything 20+ years old to be rusty

Parts machines:
Both 22r engines (carbed)
Both 5 speed manuals, one is 4x4, other is 2x4
The 4x4 one has a really badly rusted frame, so going to save the axles, drive shaft, and cab, box is already on the truck above and engine/trans from both parts machines are already out too.
Other truck might get fixed up too, not sure as of yet.

No photos yet, will get them as I get a chance. I have to go get the parts trucks yet, but not bad for $550 for it all.

I can't find a very good base line for MPG on this truck for real world driving, seems it ranges from 20 to 28mpg which isn't exactly great, but isn't too bad.

Seems the last owner thought he was handy at fixing up cars/trucks, but his yard is littered with dead machines, he swapped the 22re engine in, but failed to hook up half the sensors. He claims he drove it this way for 60k miles (truck has 140k on the body) and all of a sudden it wouldn't idle, a wheel bearing is hanging up (more like the axle bearing in the rear end), and it has no brakes as the brake lines are rusted all apart. Oh he "fixed" the frame rot problem by welding chainsaw bars onto the frame, I lol'ed when I saw that. His comment "Them chainsaw bars are real strong".

So here are my plans with it in no special order

Get it running right, and road worthy
Clean up the frame, and do a proper fix on it and paint it to prevent further rust
Cut out the rust holes and patch up the cab so it is solid again and the driver's seat isn't bobbing around with the bumps.
Bedliner the underside of the cab, maybe the frame too

I'm not sure what to do with the box, of what the last owner claims, it is a rare box since it is fibre glass on the outside, and galvanized steel on the inside (which has surface rust). Might try to get another cab/box off a non-runner if one comes up on craigslist for cheap with a better body (not likely).

Planned ecomods:
-Belly pan!
-Grill block
-Max sidewall presure on tires (need to be replaced too lol)
-Some sort of boat tail like topper (I got 2 with the 3 trucks I could try to modify)
-Electric fan (have some off other cars, just need to wire up a heat sensor etc to turn it on/off)
-Small air dam (it is a truck, and will be used as one, so can't go down too far, but there is a good 1 foot or so of area that needs to be covered up)
-warm/hot air intake depending how it effects mpg, I suspect a cold air intake would be bad for FE, but might make a flap system, so when I need more power, i can switch to the CAI

Not sure how fast this build will go, but will try to keep the post updated :). My first target of course is to get the truck worthy for the road and do the very basic mods, probably won't be going for this winter, so might do the body work etc all in one shot. My first target once the truck is on the road is 30mpg for my current route to/from work (~40 miles per direction, 40-45mpg in my corolla 1.8L auto). I'm hoping to hit around 40mpg, and I would just drive it all the time to work, since I enjoy driving a stick more, and the fact it is a truck. People throw out stuff quite often that I could pick up to fix/scrap and a truck really helps a lot :).

Anyone else have experence with these little trucks? My dad has a 89 Mazda Pickup 4x4 which he loves, but he gets bad mpg (15-20mpg) and refuses to ecomod it in any way :(. I know the Toyota engines are known to last forever, and Top Gear has declared the truck to be indestructible.

Part1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnWKz7Cthkk
Part2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTPnIpjodA8
Part3 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kFnVZXQD5_k

Enjoy :).

Hi,

The 22R is a 2.4 liter (2366cc) engine. Unless you find somebody's stroker project, in which case anything could happen. You also can find some that have had their stock heads replaced with 20R heads, which breathe more freely for better power, but I don't know if that changes the displacement at all.

I don't have much room to comment on the 4x4 but I think it's a bit weird you're seeing such a wide range of mileage. I assume you're following a pretty consistent pattern of trips, or else the mileage spread wouldn't be noteworthy. I don't know what to tell you there, except that maybe you're seeing an intermittent fault in a sensor on the FI system.

Based on your description of the project truck, I would recommend you strongly consider making the 4x2 into your project, if its frame is okay. The chainsaw bar repair is laughable, but only because I'm not in a position to drive it. If that's the quality of work you're seeing, I wouldn't trust it any farther than I can throw it.

Air dams are your friend. Make a sturdy one under the bumper and then add landscape edging to take it down even lower. If you go off road and the edging gets torn off by landscape, well, you can get more for cheap at Home Depot. But in the meantime it'll save you a few bucks. You can also add edging to create rocker skirts for more/better air control.

I would assume you have tires that are wide enough to disallow fender skirts out back, but if they fall inside the body line at all then cover them.

One of these days I'm going to convert my truck from the stock Aisin carb to a Weber, but it's not cheap. I understand the Weber conversion is supposed to be a big improvement in both power and economy, and since the little truck was never a big torque monster any improvement is a good thing. The Aisin gets the job done, but I like the idea of having that capability of dragging around a half-ton of firewood AND getting better highway mileage than a new Corolla. But with the higher power requirements of pushing a 4x4 down the road, you might do better to move a project like that higher up the list.

Thanks for the feed back. the MPG values I stated were from researching different sites including this one, fuely, and other general forums where people were posting their MPG. I don't have one currently running and driving, just this project of 3 trucks lol.

The 4x4 toyotas had a different body than the 2x4, so the fenders flare out more, so wheel skirts should be possible, but a lot of angles to deal with. I'm not one of those people throwing 32s on a little truck that are super wide or anything, just going to go with stock sized tires with fairly agressive tread.

According to the wiki, the 20r head has a smaller combustion chamber, so it makes it higher compression and better flow, so if I ever need to rebuild the engine, I think the 20R head upgrade should be well worth it :).

One thing I didn't say before, the O2 sensor isn't hooked up, and I can't locate the plug for it. If I remember correctly, it is only a 1 wire. That might be part of the running issues besides the vacuum leak I already found. The truck will also need rear shocks (maybe fronts too), I have a pair from when my dad had an 82, so hopefully they didn't change :D. Still no photos :(, I go off shift soon, so I'll probably be working on it some soon. Hoping to get the parts trucks over the weekend.

For the chainsaw bar frame, my dad and I both can weld, and have scrap metal laying around, so we can fab something up to beef the frame up some. The welds on the chainsaw bars appear to be a quality weld, just not so sure how well the bars will hold up lol.

Kind of ironic that the 2.4L 22R engine is rated about the same HP or less than my 1.8L corolla engine. Of course the 22R has a bit more torque. Interesting to read about the turbo version of the engine, might be an ok idea to look into that as well :D.

early or late 22re?
Can be answered with the valve cover. Squareish or round.
I have a late motor in my 84 Celica, and get high 30's mpg on highway, my mother in law claims 36 out of her 91 pickup 4x4.
Late motor 115 hp early motor 105,
Let me know i have learned alot about these little motors.

By boxed off vs round you mean like these? I only looked at the engine a couple of times, but I'm thinking it is the more boxed off style, looked the same as the 22r spare engine that is still together.

http://www.lcengineering.com/LCNewsl...une/covers.jpg

According to the little research I did on the differences between the two, the later model had the intake simplified some so it was less restrictive and seems to have given it +hp which should be also more efficent or atleast the same.

36 out of the 4x4 91 sounds really good to me, but I'm assuming little to no eco mods right?

Cracking into the 30+mpg region in a 4x4 is the holy grail, if you can do that you're golden. Even in a little thriftbox like the Toy.

It was never big on power but the 22R makes decent torque for a motor its size. Its greatest strength is that it's a really durable design, a stout bottom end and very flexible power delivery. It's a good engine to have when you're trying to teach someone how to drive stick.

Subbed with interest. I've always been a big fan of the 22R, even if I'm not that wild about other Toyota vehicles.

I don't think 30mpg will be too hard, but my conditions are pretty ideal for mpg. Long trips (40 miles one way to work), I can drive 45-55mph w\e is the most efficient, not too many of stops, mainly rolling turns.

I checked the truck out a bit better today, and basically the whole floor pan for the drivers side needs replaced including rocker pannels, the frame is pretty much toast, sadly the chain saw bars are probably holding it together. There is hope, the guy said the 2wd truck has a solid frame, but sadly it is the reg cab, I'm 6'2" so I need all the room I can get lol. Anyway, worse case, I'll get this one going and just use it as a play toy till the frame gets too bad, and I'll be keeping an eye out for another with a solid body/frame.

Anyway, back to the running issue. the clamps were not tight on the intake to the mass air flow meter, so I fixed the clamps (all bent up oem ones) and got it sealed up and it would atleast idle. It still went up and down for rpm though :(. Pretty sure it needs the vacuum lines replace, don't see any holes or major dry rot, but several are rather loose fitting and probably are leaking slightly. The O2 sensor isn't hooked up, so maybe the ECU is searching for it's learning curve, but it can't get a reading so it keeps going rich/lean? The wire harness is pretty hacked up, so this isn't exactly an ideal machine to fix up for good :(.

I have been a fan of the older Toyotas, mainly the 80s pickups and the 70s corollas, the 90s Camry and Corolla are boring to drive, but reliable. My dad had an 82 pickup with only 30k miles on it, sat for a good 18 years in his pole barn waiting for the body work to be done (he never got to it lol), gave it to me for my 16th birthday, and it had to sit outside for a few years. In that time, the frame went to complete crap, and I had a ranger at the time, so didn't see a point in trying to fix it even though now I'm kicking my self lol. Anyway, the body went to the scrap yard, engine and trans was sold. It was the 2wd model too.

PHOTOS! Finally right? lol


Well the 150kb file limit really kicked some of the photos out :(, i'll upload else where.

I see your rocker panels are going the way of the dodo, too.

That frame patch is funny, I chuckled at it. I say funny, if I had to ride around on it I'd probably NOT be chuckling.

My earlier question still stands: is the 4x2 in decent enough shape you could make that your project? I'm not sure how much of the 4x4 running gear will transfer over but I'm pretty sure everything abaft the firewall is 100% compatible, your only stumbling blocks would be making the front drive bits fit. Fit the engine and tranny and other stuff into the 4x2 and make it over as a 4x4.

Gads, that would be a big job. It sure is easy to talk about when it isn't in my driveway, I admit.

The other 2 trucks I don't currently have, I'm picking them up this weekend, and when I got the first truck it was right before dark so didn't get to check them over much :(. I know the 2wd one has a pretty shot body, but I couldn't get under it, too many other dead cars around it and trees. The other 4x4 one I saw the rocker panels were solid, but that is as far as I checked it.

I got more photos, I'll upload as I get a chance and more photos of the other 2 trucks (will be 1 truck + pile of parts when I get it home lol).

I have an '88 4x4. Don't have much experience working on it, though, as very little ever goes wrong (knock on wood :-)) I'm in Nevada, where we don't get the road salt/rust issues you folks back east do, so the body & frame are solid.

I get about 26-27 mpg on mine, but I think my driving is a lot different than yours seems to be. When I drive it, at least part of the trip is on really rough mountain roads (places where I've seen Jeeps get high-centered), or hauling loads of hay, firewood, &c. Put it in low range, and it will haul a good load just about anywhere.

Early left, late right on those valve covers.
I think the Mother inlaw is a bit generous with the mpg's.
I use photo bucket for all my photos. 30 mpg shouldn't be to hard imo, particulary with the natural weight loss.
I would suggest taking care of the rust first then worry about mods. My car really woke up when i put in my e fan. Also not running power steering ac or any other acc except the altenator.

Small update on details of the other 2 trucks, hoping to get them tomorrow! Blue truck (4x4 frame shot one) has been sitting 4 years, which is when he swapped the engine into the silver one (one i got now). Other truck has been sitting around 10 years, was a solid frame when it was parked, but 10 years + under trees = probably not good.

Natural weight loss, gona need to make a bumper sticker to say that on my corolla :D.

@jamesqf

I suspect your average temps there are a bit warmer than over here in Michigan, average summer day is like 80-90F.

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps0ad8c4b0.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps8850bed5.jpg

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps1d021a32.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps2ae86cf7.jpg

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...pse277d55a.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps6b65c15d.jpg

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...pse86a4e92.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...pscf777e84.jpg

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps92e4d8fd.jpg

Looks like a late engine to me.
My Celica sat for 12 years and had Winston tires on it Lol.
Don't write your other truck off yet.

We get cold enough here during winter, but it is said we live in a banana belt, not nearly the problem with rust either.:D

One way or another I'm getting one of these trucks going, even if I need to buy another lol. Been wanting one for quite a long time since my dad's 89 Mazda is basically the same thing and it shocks people all the time what it can do for towing / hulling. Been a really useful truck for him.

I don't think so. I'm in Northern Nevada, which is nothing at all like the Las Vegas area. (Despite being in the same state, we're in entirely differerent realities.) I'm also at about 5000 ft elevation (my house), and less than 10 miles from a 10K peak. 80-90 highs are usually for summer, though hot spells can get over 100. But a summer day with a 90 degree high is likely to see an overnight low in the 50s.

Yeah, and people keep forgetting the Pyramids were built by slaves. If you're not in a huge hurry, you can get a lot done with less power and keepin' at it.

Hopefully with a bit less flogging/killing the slave drivers.

Most I ever put in my truck was about 1800lbs of fresh hickory. That was a LOT of firewood, and the rear sank right down. Then I and the wife got in. We didn't have far to drive. Good thing. It got us there, but I didn't dare go fast. That was a little more than was safe.

Never towed more than a ton, but I've had 1000 lbs in the bed and a ton in a trailer, at that point you're moving a pretty decent load for just a half-ton pickup. Nothing to impress the fullsize American boys, but when I unload and unhitch, I'm back to 30mpg. In an f-250, unless you're Big Dave, that doesn't happen.

@jamesqf

Sounds a lot like here, I'm mid state MI, so not really in the snow belt, unlike where I picked these trucks up at, guy said he has atleast 12-18inches of snow on the ground during the winter and 110+ inches of snow fall. My area is probably around 1/2 or a little less than that for a "normal" cold year even though it has been pretty warm the last few years. The major difference I see is if we have a 100 degree day, the night is still like 85, and since there are lakes all around, it is a humid heat. I went on vacation once to CO, it was like 75F at home, and 95F there in a drought. It felt so much better in the dry 95F weather!


@elhigh

My dad has impressed quite a few full sized pickup people, but the average person things a loaded truck is flat across the bed walls full of wood and my dad heaps it and pulls a trailer. I won't go into the safty side of it, it isn't exactly quick to stop or take off, but slow and defensive driving works very well. We don't go though the city or anything, so it is basically all open country roads with farm fields all over.



Anyway, quick update, the trip took a little longer than expected, but I got to use a plasma cutter, OMG I NEED ONE! 2WD truck is a 1 ton long box, non-duels (idk if the rear end is or not, but only single tires are on it). Driver's front top control arm is rusted in 2, so that made keeping the chains tight fun on the flat bed trailer.

The blue 4x4 with the bad frame has a pretty solid cab! Just as I was hoping, however the rear end might need work like the silver truck :(. The Pinion bolt is loose, and is really sloppy in the housing. I'm pretty sure it was loose when the guy drove the truck 15+ years ago, so the splines are probably worn quite badly. Only thing that kept the nut on was the bashed in spots on the nut to keep it from coming loose, It is catching on the last thread it seems like.

I took photos, my cousin got a couple of interesting videos of us loading, so in time more stuff! The Mazda did well on the trip and no break downs this time since we used the trailer :).

Going to have to say for $550 I got a steal of a deal, just hopefully I can get a title for the blue truck. I don't think it is too hard in Michigan compared to other states.

PHOTOS, not a lot but a few. Got the camo one unloaded, the blue cab is going to be fun :P.

Day time photos are at the guy's house I bought the trucks from, night time was almost home checking the load and getting a snack. That front wheel kept going further and further out as we went lol. Unloading it was a pain ^.^.

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps1dc3d0b3.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps032407e3.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...psc19ef551.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...psaaff48b9.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps9c12c7dd.jpg

Looks like you've got yourself a wee bit of a project ;)

I had an 85 2wd long box SR5 EFI for 10 years.
I drove it like a Celica w/o a thought to FE and avg. 28 mpg. Loaded too the gunnels, tires rubbing many times and it didn't care, even towed a 80's F450 diesel (about 2.5 times the curb weight) a couple miles once, the clutch complained about that one a bit. It was like a faithful dog, wish I hadn't sold it.

Looking forward to the resurrection:)

Haha yea I figured they were really similar to my dad's Mazda, or even better :D. One of the spare engines has a pretty new looking clutch assembly with tons of pad left, so that might come in handy some day :).

I don't expect to have the trucks done super fast or anything, I don't have anywhere to really work on them over the winter, so once snow flys the project might get put on hold :(.

If I recall correctly the Toy one-ton had six lugs on the hubs. I don't remember the axle ratio though. And the ones I saw on the lot when I was a lot boy, they were available as both singles and duallies, so what you wind up with can be stock either way.

I don't reckon I need to warn you away from trucks modified with dually "kits." That way lies trashed bearings.

Yea it is kind of odd it is 5 lug, but all 4 tires are the same so it seems it must be factory, it is 2wd as well, both of the 4x4 ones are 6 lug.

I don't really see a real point in duals on a small truck, I don't think it would benefit much unless you were already overloading the truck and needed a little extra support. Not like the stopping power is any better unless you upgraded the brakes lol.

Know of any tricks to get the door to open up, I can't really tell exactly what is going on, but everything moves like normal, door handle is free, inner handle works fine, lock I can pull up and it seems to go up all the way, but when I pull one of the door handles it pulls back down. The key even works, but on the unlock side it is a bit restrictive, I worked with it for a few mins and didn't seem to get any progress on it. I guess I should probably just pull the panel off, lube it all up and work with it more.

You might have a broken handle or a rod popped off. You may have to roll the window down and go at the mechanism with a coat hanger to get it open.

^^
It can be damned hard but not impossible to get that door panel off from the inside without opening the door. I think there's a hidden screw or two under the armrest on the door and at least one more in the latch pull. My recommendation is that you leave the window up, remove the door panel and go at the mechanism that way, laid bare. It's possibly slower than going after the mechanism through the window slot, but you're going to need to pull the panel anyway, to set things right.

Finally figured out that the blue 4x4 is an 85, so both 4x4s are the independent suspension style of front axle. Nice for the fact that they are the same lol.

Starting my shift at work so progress is going to be slow, maybe on the next off days i'll get the driver's door open lol!

I like the trick of going though the window slot, but I'm sure I'll need to pull the panel off, it is already in pretty bad shape since the window was left down slightly and sat 15 years that way -_-.

Well if the door panels already toast, no loss then :)

Well... small update, have not touched the 2wd one yet, still need to find out what year... because I picked up ANOTHER! lol. This is starting to turn into an addiction. This one has the body + frame to be a good FE truck, after the seller signed the title over, I got it all loaded up etc, THEN he tells me he has a 4x4 in better shape with a little front end damage and he thinks he has the parts to fix it O.o.

Anyway, quick specs on this one, which most likely will be my FE truck, and the 4x4 v6 one will be the work truck for larger loads. 1986 1/2 ton Cream colored (same as the other 2wd truck I have) 22r (old style) carbed, 5 speed stick. Has only 1 rust hole in the driver's cab corner, rest is solid but has a little surface rust starting. Been in MI since 1999, drove only 2 years here then sat. He uses it every once in a while to drive to his bother's house a couple of miles away, so it still got used a bit, but not much. Body had 265k miles, engine has around 120k.

Problems are fairly simple stuff, water pump bad, carb running rich, tail gate linkages are hanging up a little, door seals need put together right, dash cracked (have replacement too :)), tires before too long (dry rot). While hulling it 2.5 hours going around 60mph the axles got fairly hot which transferred to the rims. No sizzling like the 4x4 one, but I suspect the axle bearings need replaced at least. Pumpkin and transmission were fine for temp.

I'm not sure if I'll drive it this winter or not, I need to do the body work on it and repaint it before the MI cancer (rust) gets to it and the body is junk lol.

Now for the photos... sorry they were a bit late at night, sun was setting.

http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps4823dd70.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps7450cf24.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps69e123ca.jpg
http://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...psba10aacd.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...psa3107a94.jpghttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/z...ps37787559.jpg


I just noticed, my front tires are missing the hub caps. They look nice and areo of what I can tell, probably should try to source the missing ones, maybe try them on my corolla and see if they fit :). Might be a fair option instead of pizza pans if you don't mind the toyota logo on them.

Your new cream ride is very similar to mine, I don't have the Xtra cab, wish I did. Wish I had the Xtra cab/long bed combo, rare as hen's teeth but there are a few out there.

Get in front of that rust, pronto. That body seam on the bed is a known starting point for rot. And pry up that bed liner and see what's going on with the bed, I left my liner alone too damn long and now have extra ventilation in my bed.

Yep, plans are to repaint the whole thing, at least touch up the bottom and repaint the visible areas and bedliner/undercoat the bottom of the body.

I understand the bed sides are 2 part, and where to 2 parts go together isn't painted, just joint sealer. I'm planning to take it apart, sand / repaint and reseal the joint up and reattach it. Probably rivets or small bolts since I think it is spot welded.

That's news to me but based on everything I've seen I won't try to refute it. I never saw beds separated when I was a lot boy. We did remove/replace a few, but they were always in one piece when we did that.

These guys make 84-95 Toyota beds in solid fiberglass from cheap to steep, and Chevy S-10 beds in similar grades. If you're bucks-up, that's an option and no future body rot to worry about. Well, not rust anyway.

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure I read the bed side splits where the rust likes to start.

Anyway, i'm getting backwards progress :(, now the truck don't want to start lol. Fuel delivery problem. If I put gas down the carb it fires right up and dies. Fuel pump is new, maybe fuel filter, or lack of a fuel filter? Carb seems to have some gas in it, pumping it does squirt gas out.

Yesterday I tried to tackle the other 2wd 1 ton driver's door, still can't get it opened. I sprayed it with some lube so hopefully over time it will unlock. I'm thinking it shouldn't be too hard to sneak a saw blade in and cut the loop the door latches on. Probably not keeping that cab anyway, but I do need to pull parts off it etc yet.

Hopefully I can report some progress soon, and get onto the ecomodding part of the truck lol.

Filter's where I would start. If it sat for a while, it might just be varnish in there. I think it's under the passenger side somewhere ahead of the rear wheel, but before you get to the cab. On mine it is, anyway.

Got the truck running again, guy at the parts store said before he knew much about cars he had an 88 carbed, and he thinks now the float was just sticking, just randomly died on him one day and wouldn't start back up. Tapped on the carb and heard the float drop. Runs as good or slightly better now :).

Might give seafoam a shot in the tank to see if it will loosen up the buildup that is making it stick. If not I have a 2nd carb they gave me to fix it. If that flops I'll just have to clean and/or rebuild the carb.

Bought air filter, fuel filter, and water pump to get started on it. On shift at work so idk when I'll get it done, air filter of course was 3 mins lol.

Another good thing not really related to this thread, yesterday and today the corolla got really good mpg even though it isn't "hot" out. MPG gauge said 45 and 50mpg for yesterday and today. It isn't calibrated, but it isn't super far off. Been having a hard time getting over 40mpg on it, and driving 55-60mph was running 34-36mpg, just wasn't right, I'm thinking it might be the EGR valve sticking, bad primary O2 sensor, or the CAT is in fact going back (seems to act up in cycles). Check engine light comes on rarely with a CAT inefficiency code, and normally when that happens, I'm getting good mpg but going faster or on take off :(