Safety mods?
 

Are there any reasonably simple mods that one could make and increase crash safety of a car?

Add foam in strategic places for a crush zone?

Four point safety belts?

A boattail with impact absorbing properties?

Padding on the dash and steering wheel?

The boat-tail can help, even if it isn't particularly impact-absorbing. If people see that the end of your car is "back there", they will likely be trying to stop "back there" instead of closer to the main part of the structure of the car.

Four-point belts are not so great most of the time. Unless you get them mounted correctly, and always use them correctly and in the right position, they may do more harm than good. Five-point (or six-, or even seven-point!) restraints are preferred in the racing world mainly because the "sub straps" keep the lap belt in position where it is actually effective. And racing harnesses are meant to be worn tight, too tight to easily look over your shoulder like you would do when backing up. So they present their own problems on the street.

Some good safety mods you can make for very cheap are:
- Leaving buffers between you and other cars on the road, especially in front of you.
- Always plan a way out of any situation you think it may be possible for you to get into.
- Keep your eyes moving around, looking for developing situations that can become problems.
- Make sure your horn works and is good and loud.
- Make sure your lights all work.

Extra padding on interior parts of the car may help a little, but probably not a whole lot.

A roll cage is good at keeping anything outside form intruding into the passenger space, but it's also really good at breaking any body parts that come in contact with it. Like skulls. (And you'd be amazed at how far your seat belts stretch in a wreck!) So they aren't generally a very good thing to have in a street car. Most roll cages assume a complete set of safety systems, and if you're missing one or two they can do more harm than good.

Much like saving gas, the cheapest and most effective things to do are to change the way you drive.

-soD

Shop for the safest car, even a model that looks the same for a few years may have additional safety features you don't see.

When I drive in bad weather I leave my winter coat on. Can't hurt right?

On a newer car the decent mods would be to keep brakes in good condition or even improve them and of course buy good tires, because too cheap of a tire can sometimes lengthen the stopping distance tremendously.

The other things are driver related, just like some_other_dave sai. I would add:
1. Have a good driving position -> believe it or not, braking distance increases a lot if your seat is too reclined (like those "I want to look cool" kids drive) and if your feet are too far from the pedals.
http://www.driving-test-success.com/...g-position.gif
2. Ease your mind before you get behind the wheel so that you can keep a relaxed but focused mindset. A lot of accidents are due to drunks or just careless people in a hurry. Make a conscious decision to let go of stress and not only will you drive better and enjoy it, life itself will seem much nicer :)

Have your mirrors correctly adjusted, if you can see your car in the mirror it is wrong. To correctly set the mirrors you will need to lean about 6in toward the mirror you are adjusting now angle the mirror to where you can just see the edge of the car, repeat on the other side. When done correctly it should eliminate most blind spots as a car behind you will move from the rear mirror to the side mirror with it being in both for just a second, when the car moves out of the view of the side mirror you should be able to the car because it is next to you.

place knives and rebar pointing toward you coming out of the dash as a constant reminder that you are operating a vehicle and the safety cage around you is an illusion.

Good tires, mirrors pointed in the right direction (not at your own fenders), and drive like everyone else is trying to kill you.

Securely :
mount a 5BC fire extinguisher in the cabin , mount a 10BC in the trunk
Mount an approved road emergency medical kit in the cabin in view
Mount a 'Life Hammer" [or equivalent]in reach of the drivers position
they say with velcro but thAT IS INADEQUATE , ALL OBJECTS MOUNTED MUST BE ABLE TO SUSTAIN ROLL OVER G-FORCE
.lifehammer.com/

if you are really worried wear a helmet

I can see the fire extinguisher being useful for saving your property, but when's the last time you saw a car fire?

I can't really picture a situation where the hammer or extinguisher could save your life, though. Not a remotely likely situation at least.

Speaking of car fires, clean and degrease your engine bay. Fix any oil leaks you find, and inspect fuel lines for rust.

Hide under the covers and never come out would be the surest bet :thumbup:

September 2009 in Denmark, but it was already way too far gone to fight it with tiny car extinguishers.
It could still have been possible with a 9kg / 20lbs powder extinguisher though, for someone trained to use them.

They certainly exist.
But in the hands of the inexperienced / unaware, car fire extinguishers have a bad habit of not working when needed.
I've seen pics with dozens of them on the pavement while people tried to rescue someone trapped in a burning car, complaining most of them simply didn't work.

The powder sorta solidifies on the bottom - or side, depending on how it's been stored for years, and unless it's kicked loose first, you'll just release the driving gas instead of the powder.
Like all powder fire extinguishers, they could do with a decent kick on the pavement before pulling the safety plug.
Angle them away for yourself when doing so.


I've put out 2 car fires - one on my own car. :o


Germany doesn't even require fire extinguishers.
It's a massive saving on dead weight not being carried around.
Either add mandatory fire extinguishing training to the driver education, or forget about them.

Have a reflective vest on whenever you get out of the car on the roadside (tire change, etc.), not only at night. I've seen a few near misses which were thankfully only misses because of a reflective vest. In a few European countries reflective vests are mandatory, as are fire extinguishers, first aid kits, and reflective triangles (placed 100-150m behind a stopped vehicle).

Another good idea is to make sure any and all objects in the car are fastened and secured. This includes passengers! You don't want the momentum of 70kg bouncing freely around next to you.

Caution - drastic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4Cvg...82A13C0B37934B

+1 for the knives, it was genuine advice offered by my Avatar when he worked in the UK car industry (and helped ruin it).

My dad (cop) always advised against trying to do anything about car fires except run away. Unless there is a threat to life the Police won't even attempt to tackle them. They will wait for the fire tender instead.

Quite a few EU governments have banned roadside repairs on motorways and main roads, and with good reason.

Forget about the reflective vests, just get out of the car and get out of the roadway ASAP. The near-misses wouldn't even have happened then.
Put on the hazard lights, and forget about the safety triangle - it isn't at all what it's claimed to be.

If it were up to me, all that fake safety equipment goes out of cars, and it becomes mandatory to immediately get out of the vehicle and onto the shoulder of the road.

Yes, even the 1kg powder fire extinguishers.
95+ % of people can't properly handle them anyway, so why keep them ?

Vest - pah! Get a reflective full-on padded jacket - quite cheap at places that do workwear - not only reflective but also warm in winter.

+1 for running as far away from your vehicle when stopped at the side of the road as possible, especially on highways / motorways. I was in a taxi which had a dodgy alternator so the lights failed one evening last year on the M62 in traffic. The driver called the RAC and we stood at the top of the roadside bank.

Luckily really as we stood and watched a HGV texting wipe out the taxi and the phone box.

thats not Sydney Enver is it ?

if so i aught to bootleg it from you and use it on the MGB site

Fight Incipient fires ...

minimum 5 lb manual halon type ..

better than being a crispy critter when the valley girl in the SUV texting at 75 MPH tops the hill and clips you while you are coasting down in the glide .. warps the doors , jams the seatbelt ruptures the fuel tank ..

take little training to yank the fire handle then cut your way out.



sedans, 2-seat sports racers, . Complete, ready-to-install system includes metal mounting brackets, (2) 11-foot pull cables, 8 meters (26 feet) of aluminum tubing, (1) T coupler, (4) T nozzle fittings, (2) L shape nozzle fittings, and (6) nozzles.

http://www.pegasusautoracing.com/images/M/2465-004.JPG

Nope, not Mr Enever. This guy. He did some suspension work for MG's though - most notably the Y-type saloons and the disastrous C-type engine in the MGC was partially his idea.

I saw one two days ago. I usually see one or more a month. (part of the job).


All the training I've had says extinguishers are for putting out burning people not burning vehicles. But like was said before, they can help put out smoking things about to be on fire.

You want the hammer for when you drive into bodies of water and want to break a window to get out. Me, I try to use only boats for that.

Consider upgrading lamps to LED. Just about everything is now going to them for their faster response time, and if sized right, brighter light.

This.

I lol'd.:thumbup:

Tell that to this guy :p :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4Usx...eature=related

I'm glad that i read through this thread. Reminds me to test the fire extinguisher in my car.
I also have a first aid kit as well.

I'm surprised by the comment on roll cages. I would have thought that a roll cage would stiffen the structure.
As far as cracking your head on the roll cage, I assumed that since the structure is stronger, it would crumple less around the cabin and you actually would be safer, like this guy :

BTW I just love that engine sound in this video !

What I am pointing out though is the very last part of the video where they show the car. The car looks to be pretty much stock body wise, yet the cabin is still in one piece.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TTzbBRyOO0o

It does--noticeably.

IF you have a helmet on, and are in a good supportive racing seat, and you have five- or six-point harnesses on that are snugged down tight enough that you cannot move your torso enough to reach the radio, or to turn and look over your shoulder, then you will be safer in a roll-over and possibly other collisions. If you are wearing a stock seatbelt, you will move around in the cockpit an awful lot--more than enough distance to smash your head into the top brace shown in the video, for instance. But stock belts let you tune your radio, look over your shoulder to back up, turn your head to check your blind spots, and all of those other things you really do need to do when driving on the street.

This is yet another way that a race car is different from a street car, and another thing that applies to the one but not to the other.

Roll cages are DANGEROUS on the street.

-soD

What about a tube frame chassis ? It would certainly keep the car intact in case of a crash, but all the shock would be absorbed by your body instead - right ?

Surely there has to be something that we can use from F-1 racing that would make our cars safer ( anything ? )

Yes, but even without the cage there, you would be instead smashing your head on the metal frame of the A pillar.

It seems like a cage could be designed with enough clearance to not be so deadly in a crash.

Any pillar in a car these days that wants more than a 1 star rating is covered in plastic trim. It doesn't look or feel soft, but compared to metal it is *much* better. Most pillar trim has space or ribs behind it to absorb the impact energy.

Take a look at crash tests on you tube to see how far a person belted in moves around in a crash. It is surprising.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d7iYZPp2zYY

If you want to be seen LED tail lights are an option as for headlights you can try making a set of LED's or getting a set of Halo light real halogen not the white lights all be it that if you do not have projector housings you blast the light everywhere and while people do see you they can't see with the lights. Avoide a roll cage which can be used for a 4point harness unless you use the car for racing a Import Tunning did a studie on this a few years back and a roll cage with 4-5 point harness could kill you in a crash as it will be a difficult to get oiut of the car once in a crash and if its on fire as well as knocking you into solid steel tubing might break a few bones.

You could upgrade your brake system to large brakes with bigger calipers and an upgraded pump system to supply the proper break pressuer to the calipers you would also need to upgrade the lines to braided lines to handle the pressure. Slotted rotters would help with distributing the heat of the braks cross drilled are prone to cracks. I know a read tires are big as well good tires with decent to allot of grip will help you stop.

If you get stuck on the side of the road with a flat and its a highway try limping the car to a spot where you can get out safly i.e. where there is no gaurd rail only you and a grass median would be safer. Yo would chew your tire but it would be safer then the alternative. Keep a sup[ply of road flares and a repar reflecters along with your hazards on so you do not get hit. Thats mostly how I would emprove a vehicles safty.

The A pillars today are designed to be far enough from the occupant that this is not really a concern. A roll cage is designed to fit inside of the rest of the car, so it by definition will be closer to you.

Roll cages are specifically designed to be part of a safety system, which includes a good supportive seat and very tight multi-point restraints.

You could design a cage with enough clearance to not be so deadly in a crash. It would be built into the rest of the car, and it would look a lot like an A-pillar, a thick roof, and so on.


A full tube-frame is expensive to make. A mass-produced car built with one would cost an obscene amount of money, at least with the way they are currently built. Perhaps in the future...

There was a trend in race cars for a while to make the car as strong and stiff as possible. It turned out that the driver then started taking all of the impact, which predictably wasn't so good for him. So they changed over to deformable structures which crush and dissipate energy that way. A lot of the race cars were built to practically disintegrate when they hit something hard enough, because each piece that left took some kinetic energy with it when it did.


Safety systems are indeed systems. They are designed to work together; when you just patch things together piece-meal you may improve things or may make them much worse.

-soD

The only other problem/anoyance I could see to safty mods as these and this is coming from a custom car builder is the police. Once a cop looks at your roll cage you will be pulled over and frequently.

Something I've noticed on my newer car that my older, similar model didn't have, is that the empty spaces in the body structure have been filled in with heavy-duty styrofoam. It's like the styrofoam in a motorcycle helmet-very stiff and hard. Presumably it's there to absorb additional energy by compressing as the structure collapses.

As far as retrofitting, it seems like it would be almost impossible to predict exactly what effect it would have, although you could probably guess that it would increase the rate at which energy was absorbed (more energy absorbed per unit of body deformation), and on a car whose safety performance might be improved by this, it might be helpful. An awful lot of guessing and conditional language in that statement, though.

Small unibody vehicles seem like they may benefit from this treatment. It seems like it would allow the structure to absorb more energy in the limited amount of distance available to compress. It would increase the G-loading during the compression, though, increasing the forces on the occupants.

Probably not helpful for body-on-frame units, where the problem may be that the structure is already too stiff.

I haven't seen expanding spray-foam that looks like styrofoam when it hardens, but I suppose it might be available.

Here is a bit about adding expanding foam.
Project S13 Nissan 240SX

Awesome! I'm definitely getting some of that stuff to play with.

Maybe try it for filling fairings made of coroplast to make them a little sturdier. If I think ahead, I should be able to put in hard points for fasteners, then foam in around them for support.