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RedDevil 03-07-2019 05:55 PM

Tesla Model Y
 
The Model Y is set to be revealed next week, unless someone slips the cover early...

Tesla Model Y caught without camouflage – CarTests
https://i2.wp.com/en.cartests.net/wp...size=800%2C445
Different headlights to the 3, that's for sure.
It has a face. But... White mirrors?

redpoint5 03-07-2019 09:45 PM

For only $1000 extra, you can get body color matched mirrors.

Speaking of mirrors, it would be nice if Musk pushed state and federal laws to allow cameras instead of mirrors. Eliminating them will go a long way towards improving the range of these EVs.

RedDevil 03-08-2019 04:20 AM

On second thought the above picture may not be the Model Y but a clever PhotoShop job of a Model X...
https://st.motortrend.ca/uploads/sit...ront-end-1.jpg
Paste the 3's bumper and non-grille, done?
https://icdn2.digitaltrends.com/imag...ro-720x720.jpg

It would be strange if Tesla used the same style headlights as the X, but fractionally smaller as the car is more narrow, while each model had unique headlights up to now?
And even then, why not the 3's headlights?
So I don't know. Ah well, in 6 days we will know.

RedDevil 03-08-2019 07:15 AM

The model Y will be built in Gigafactory 1 by... robots?
https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-mode...ought-factory/

It did not work with the Model 3. You cannot experiment too much if you are desperate to raise the output at the same time.
But time has moved on and lessons have been learned. The Model Y offers a clean slate with less pressure.
This could be interesting.

RedDevil 03-08-2019 11:11 AM

Oh my...
https://www.teslarati.com/used-tesla...blue-book-kbb/
https://media.licdn.com/media-proxy/...aQMDZVEuy2Nf6w
lolcopycats.

Still - white mirrors?

Piotrsko 03-08-2019 11:33 AM

Giga 1 is here in RENO? There's room for the line, but he still has to build and empty some of it. Wonder where the people to work it come from.

Since paying off the last bond in cash, where is needed investment cash coming from?

RedDevil 03-08-2019 01:09 PM

Production would start somewhere next year at the earliest, so there's still time for all of that.
Some of the robots used in the first attempt to robotize the Model 3 production line should be available, with upgrades.

Vman455 03-08-2019 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593051)
Speaking of mirrors, it would be nice if Musk pushed state and federal laws to allow cameras instead of mirrors. Eliminating them will go a long way towards improving the range of these EVs.

30-something states already don't require outside mirrors, but since the FMVSS do, you have to have them to sell a car here. Stupid.

roflwaffle 03-08-2019 11:55 PM

That's almost certainly a photoshop. The teaser pick on Tesla's site doesn't match any of it's lines.

https://www.tesla.com/modely

RedDevil 03-09-2019 03:41 AM

Not sure. It could still be a Windows Paint job... ;)

The Model Y page announces a 14 march livestream of the unveiling.

RedDevil 03-09-2019 05:31 AM

Remember the Semi reveal? It had a surprise (the Roadster V2).

I expect something extra coming with the Model Y reveal too.
Maybe this?
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2019-03-08/tesla-bull-left-shares-photo-of-what-he-says-is-the-new-model-s
https://assets.bwbx.io/images/users/...v2/1000x-1.jpg

EDIT This is branded a '2022 Model S'. More pics here: https://www.topspeed.com/cars/tesla/...-ar182122.html
https://pictures.topspeed.com/IMG/cr...12_1600x0w.jpg

RedDevil 03-09-2019 07:57 AM

https://www.cdrinfo.com/d7/content/tesla-releases-new-model-y-teaser
https://www.cdrinfo.com/d7/system/fi...?itok=kxdnBYFs
It has mirrors now, and the headlights do look like the Model 3.

In fact nothing looks dissimilar from the Model 3.
Did they just raise the suspension and called it a day?

redpoint5 03-09-2019 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedDevil (Post 593168)

In fact nothing looks dissimilar from the Model 3.
Did they just raise the suspension and called it a day?

I hope so, the Model 3 is a fine looking car, and is fairly aerodynamic.

aerohead 03-09-2019 01:00 PM

Mirrors
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593051)
For only $1000 extra, you can get body color matched mirrors.

Speaking of mirrors, it would be nice if Musk pushed state and federal laws to allow cameras instead of mirrors. Eliminating them will go a long way towards improving the range of these EVs.

I believe that Tesla has been petitioning the DOT since before they ever went into production,to allow 'camera' systems,because of the associated drag reduction which would be realized.About Cd 0.01.

aerohead 03-09-2019 01:07 PM

aerodynamic
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593175)
I hope so, the Model 3 is a fine looking car, and is fairly aerodynamic.

While not the lowest drag car ever offered for lease in North America (Cd 0.197 GM EV1),at Cd 0.23,the Model 3 is the lowest drag car ever offered for sale.

RedDevil 03-09-2019 01:29 PM

Because the Volkswagen XL1 was only available in Europe...
Quote:

The XL1 has a curb weight of 795 kg (1,753 lb), and a drag coefficient of Cd=0.186 (a similar drag coefficient to the General Motors EV1 electric car).

RedDevil 03-09-2019 04:24 PM

Tesla teases 'Nice Try'
 
https://mobilesyrup.com/2019/03/09/t...ssage-model-y/

Enhancing the contrast on the shady picture reveals a secret message!

Fat Charlie 03-09-2019 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedDevil (Post 593187)
Because the Volkswagen XL1 was only available in Europe...

You can buy a garage full of Model 3s and a lot of electricity before you come close to paying for one of those.

Vman455 03-09-2019 11:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aerohead (Post 593185)
While not the lowest drag car ever offered for lease in North America (Cd 0.197 GM EV1),at Cd 0.23,the Model 3 is the lowest drag car ever offered for sale.

Lowest drag coefficient ever offered for sale in North America, not lowest drag. If I'm not mistaken, that honor still belongs to the original Honda Insight by virtue of its small cross-sectional area (it's a full 3" shorter and 7" narrower than the Model 3).

ETA: I remembered, and double-checked just now, that Tesla now advertises CD .23 for the Model S as well, while the Model X has been bumped up to CD .25 with the fixed spoiler.

RedDevil 03-10-2019 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fat Charlie (Post 593240)
You can buy a garage full of Model 3s and a lot of electricity before you come close to paying for one of those.

What about one top spec Model 3, a PowerWall 2, an oversized solar roof and home improvements (isolation, heat pump).
For the price of one XL1 you could be a net supplier of energy and have a faster car.

Makes you wonder what VW was trying to achieve with the XL1...
Of course, if mass produced the price would have come down. But it would never be a mainstream car. So it wasn't viable.

JSH 03-10-2019 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aerohead (Post 593184)
I believe that Tesla has been petitioning the DOT since before they ever went into production,to allow 'camera' systems,because of the associated drag reduction which would be realized.About Cd 0.01.

They aren't the only manufacturer petitioning. So far the NHTSA isn't budging.

Here is the latest test: https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.do...518_v3-tag.pdf

NeilBlanchard 03-11-2019 01:02 PM

Model Y reveal this coming Thursday.

redpoint5 03-11-2019 01:45 PM

Any predictions about things that might wow us in the reveal? Musk usually has something radical to reveal besides the car itself.

JSH 03-11-2019 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593365)
Any predictions about things that might wow us in the reveal? Musk usually has something radical to reveal besides the car itself.

He will explain why he changed his mind and is keeping the Tesla dealerships open?

redpoint5 03-11-2019 02:43 PM

Probably self-explanatory. They thought they'd save money shutting them all down, then quickly realized they'd lose more sales income than the money they'd save by closing down.

RedDevil 03-11-2019 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593365)
Any predictions about things that might wow us in the reveal? Musk usually has something radical to reveal besides the car itself.

There could be data or dates about the Semi and the Roadster, or the pickup we've seen wrapped on a trailer may show up, the Model S is getting long in the tooth so it may get a revamp, and then there's the 2 or 3 years in the future when Tesla would reveal a smaller $25,000 model...

And the model Y... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGDYL3Lu4XM

JSH 03-11-2019 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593369)
Probably self-explanatory. They thought they'd save money shutting them all down, then quickly realized they'd lose more sales income than the money they'd save by closing down.

Mystery solved. The Wall Street Journal did some digging in Tesla’s latest quarterly report. It would cost Tesla $1.6 billion to break their leases and close all of their stores. Leases are 5 to 10 years.

redpoint5 03-11-2019 06:46 PM

Might as well convert them to sales/service centers and have loaner cars for those needing service, and the same cars could be demo units for test drives too.

RedDevil 03-11-2019 07:09 PM

Tesla will keep many of its stores open, even if sales move exclusively online.
Moreover, they will raise the price of the luxury models some starting March 18th.
I expect a rush of sales of those this week...

Here's straight from the horses mouth:
https://www.tesla.com/nl_NL/blog/upd...ng?redirect=no

RedDevil 03-12-2019 04:38 AM

There won't be a reveal of the pickup truck coming Thursday.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/...nieuw-model%2F
(apparently)

RedDevil 03-13-2019 07:14 AM

Tesla's teaser enhanced and edited:
https://www.teslarati.com/wp-content...2-1024x555.png

https://www.teslarati.com/wp-content...dit-render.jpg

aerohead 03-13-2019 10:54 AM

Cd vs CDA
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Vman455 (Post 593245)
Lowest drag coefficient ever offered for sale in North America, not lowest drag. If I'm not mistaken, that honor still belongs to the original Honda Insight by virtue of its small cross-sectional area (it's a full 3" shorter and 7" narrower than the Model 3).

ETA: I remembered, and double-checked just now, that Tesla now advertises CD .23 for the Model S as well, while the Model X has been bumped up to CD .25 with the fixed spoiler.

You're correct.The drag index of the 1st-gen Insight probably trumps that of the Tesla.
CAR and DRIVER attributed a higher Cd to the Insight,than what Honda claimed,(I think Cd 0.30,( re:'Drag Queens' article,from A2 wind tunnel testing),but the Honda's frontal area is just a bit above the 1st-gen CRX,so it's overall drag is pretty sweet!
Shame about the XL-1.VW could have done it in stamped-steel and glass,and mass-produced it, as a plug-and-play-optioned car for $10,000-up.It would still get over 100-mpg HWY,even with gasoline power.
Didn't know Zika-virus had hit Germany so hard!:(

RedDevil 03-15-2019 03:44 AM

Revealed
 
https://www.tesla.com/modely
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=knaskUXb12A
A Cd of 0.23... for a SUV!

https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-model-y-specs-batteries-range-price/
https://www.teslarati.com/wp-content...c-1024x469.jpg
Quote:

the Model Y is a larger, somewhat bulkier version of the Model 3. Inside the vehicle, the Model Y is all Model 3, with the dashboard being dominated by the same 15″ touchscreen, which controls the majority of the vehicle’s functions. The Tesla Model Y is an SUV that [optionally] seats seven passengers comfortably, and it has 66 cu ft of cargo space.
...
The Model Y comes in four variants: the Standard Range, Long Range, Dual Motor AWD, and Performance versions.
...
The Model Y is built to be fully compatible with the Supercharger V3 network, which supports charging at 250 kW. This translates to a charging speed of up to 1,000 miles per hour
...
The Model Y is expected to enter production sometime in Fall 2020, with the company producing the Long Range, Dual Motor AWD, and Performance versions first. The Standard Range hits production in Spring 2021. The Model Y starts at $39,000 for the base variant and $47,000 for the Long Range version. A Dual Motor AWD version costs $51,000 and a Performance variant will be priced at $60,000.
https://www.teslarati.com/wp-content...c-1024x683.jpg

JSH 03-15-2019 09:16 AM

So they took the Model 3, sliced it horizontally, added a couple of inches, then called it a day. It looks dated already 2 years from launch.

At least Musk is being honest and saying the base model won’t be available for at least a year from launch.

This design will pull a LOT of sales from the Model 3.

RedDevil 03-15-2019 10:03 AM

Ha. If that looks dated, I'd like to be its date :)

The design may look similar to the 3, but there are important differences.
The Model Y is a hatchback.
See the line over the rear quarter panel between the tail light and the side window, and high up on the rear window.
The hatch lid is huge. You can move house with that.

It seats 7 (optionally). The doors seem set slightly forward, the chairs probably are too; it must have higher seats, winning leg room.

Judging by the 230 mile range for the Standard range, it probably uses the same pack as the lighter and lower 264 mile Medium range Model 3 (62 kWh).

Don't worry for the Model 3 though. It is cheaper, that will never lose appeal.
The Model Y Standard range won't be built until 2021. Lease drivers can't wait for that when their new lease is due.
Model 3 versions cheaper than €50,000 will come available soon; our lease market will go crazy for them, especially since diesels are on their way out.

Piotrsko 03-15-2019 11:06 AM

YAWN.

still vapourware, and wouldn't buy one even if I could.

redpoint5 03-15-2019 11:38 AM

0-60 in 3.5 seconds in a CUV is yawn?

I don't know you you get out of bed then.

If Tesla can make these performance machines, I hope we'll soon see the "economy" version of EVs. Where are the $20k EVs?

RedDevil 03-15-2019 12:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piotrsko (Post 593724)
still vapourware, and wouldn't buy one even if I could.

You think they can't build it? Having 75% of the parts in common with the Model 3 they've built 220,000 times already?

Oh I get is it was a joke ;)

jjackstone 03-15-2019 02:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by redpoint5 (Post 593731)
.... Where are the $20k EVs?

Obviously a reasonably ranged(200 miles?) battery pack still precludes the $20K EV. However my thoughts are that a lot of the creature features that these vehicles include could be done away with.

You guys have to help me out here but the only model 3 I was in had power everything....windows, locks, etc. Any base EV's that don't have power stuff(i.e. extra little motors)? I say go old school and make those manual again and eliminate all the little motors and solenoids that will likely wear out faster than the manual version in the first place..

I would imagine that software costs more than hardware up front and that over time it becomes much less expensive than the hardware since it can be installed in tiny little spaces in on board memory. But I really don't need(or want) a car that parks itself, drives itself, talks to me or anything else that that I can easily do myself.

While I'm sure everyone appreciates the massive amounts of acceleration and power of Tesla's motors, they simply do not need to be that powerful. Look at the vehicles we had in the past with their fifty or sixty hp engines. Unless they were severely under powered they did just fine for basic transportation. So smaller motors mean less expensive motors and less weight in the car and less expensive controllers. Basically all power control components can be sized down and then cost less.

I don't know what sort of equipment comes in other EV's so I can't comment on them but in general it just seems to me that EV cost is so high simply because they have too many gadgets even for the low cost versions. No one wants just a base package, bare bones unit anymore.

It is possible the reason EV's are so much more expensive than comparative ICE vehicles is because they have to perform so much better than ICE vehicles just to be accepted by the general public. Even today I still here the same old tired arguments against EV's. What happens if your battery gets too low? Well the same thing that happens if you run out of gas. You're stuck until you get a recharge or a tow. I will say I wouldn't want to pay $30 K or even $20 K for an around town car. That's what a used Leaf is for.

JJ

samwichse 03-15-2019 03:02 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Looks like it does have a liftback-type rear opening. I was a little worried that, in order to keep the glass roof profile, they'd just make it a taller model 3 with a trunklike opening in the back. But it seems to hinge right above those C windows in the back.
https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1552677338


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