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-   -   Tesla not waiting for your charging infrastructure... (https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/tesla-not-waiting-your-charging-infrastructure-26025.html)

botsapper 05-30-2013 06:15 PM

Tesla not waiting for your charging infrastructure...
 
Take Charge!...of supplying the juice. Tesla is planning to create a national network of high-speed 120 kW 'Supercharging' stations.
Fantastic Henry Ford-like vision, own your own proprietary 'fueling' infrastructure to your own brand EVs, and wait for it, charge it for free, for life!

Tesla Supercharger network goes nationwide, gets quicker [w/video]

It is an obvious analogy, Tesla (remember it not just a car company but a technology company) has seen & learned from the exponential growth of another industry, cellular communications. In the beginning of that industry it was not popular & problematic because early suppliers were limited to radio range & signal strengths, but soon widespread hexagonal cells and logical coverage made it practical and commonplace. Think of it as cellular-ization of EV transportation, and Tesla owns it first.
Hmm, another history lesson, a REVERSE General Motor Streetcar conspiracy...and hopes the same old major industries does not not BLOCK Tesla's idea(s).

MPaulHolmes 05-30-2013 11:18 PM

120kW per car? Or the whole station can do 120kW?

botsapper 05-31-2013 01:18 AM

Tesla Supercharger technology, faster charging. The new rate is 120 kW, which means you can add three hours of driving to a pack in "just over 20 minutes."

...looking at their planned infrastructure map (supported w/ onboard gps/driving routine/recharging software/app), it would be very practical for my personal/commuter routine.

Xist 05-31-2013 02:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by botsapper (Post 373963)
Tesla Supercharger technology, faster charging. The new rate is 120 kW, which means you can add three hours of driving to a pack in "just over 20 minutes."

On their website they talk about driving 55MPG. Good luck, but I think that most of us here would support it. 165 miles. On their website, they show that it would take 5 hours and 11 minutes to charge that much with a 240 volt outlet, and almost 29 hours at 110v.

Will someone please explain how electricity works? :)

Their 240v High Power Wall Connector does the job in 2 hours and 35 minutes, so if you are on a road trip, you would spend almost as much time charging as driving. For people who can afford electric cars, I imagine the charging time is a major objection, as well as range, even though they probably drive further than something like a Leaf would allow infrequently, but charging seven times as fast, for free, should make Tesla far more popular.

I have seen arguments on here that the company will likely not be around for several years, but I think that this plan could really help, and then electric car technology should progress much faster.

wdb 05-31-2013 06:16 AM

Ooooh and swappable batteries too. Elon ain't waiting around for anybody, folks. I continue to be impressed.

RedDevil 05-31-2013 07:04 AM

The charging stations need to be closer together than half the range. When your destination is just short of a charging point, you don't want to start the return trip by having to move on towards that point but rather take the first one on the route back.

There will be food stores close to those charging points. That means there needs to be a charging station nearby whenever you get hungry if you don't want to lose time nor weight.

Ryland 05-31-2013 09:15 AM

Average person spends 11 minutes or more at a gas station so 20 minute to charge an EV while driving a long trip is not bad at all! after a few hours of driving it's a good idea to get out and stretch anyway.
Their web site says they will have regular J1772 charging plugs as well, I wonder what the deal is to use one of them for charging other EV's.
I have't seen any official published cost, but the Tesla web site says that the super chargers are only free automatically to the upper two models of the Model S and that to use it for the lower version there is a one time fee ($2,000 I hear) not sure if that fee also adds hard ware to the vehicle or if the car just has a dead plug in the back.

One of the next phase of super chargers is putting one up about 30 miles from me, right off I-94, so it will be interesting to see where it ends up in that area.

gone-ot 05-31-2013 10:16 AM

FWIW, about the "only" drivers these days who drive 55 mph are those who are entering a freeway on-ramp on their way UP to their normal 65-75-80 mph 'jaunt.'

Daox 05-31-2013 10:50 AM

The base Model S has 208 miles of range (according to the Tesla site), the higher trims have 265 miles. How often do you really drive that far in one jaunt??? Chances are a Model S owner also probably has another vehicle. If they need to drive 500 miles in a day they can just take that. I'm really not even seeing a problem here.

botsapper 05-31-2013 01:32 PM

Getting more and more convinced...a modern-day Henry Ford. Tesla CEO on Race to Expand Superchargers - CNBC

Xist 05-31-2013 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ryland (Post 373989)
Average person spends 11 minutes or more at a gas station so 20 minute to charge an EV while driving a long trip is not bad at all! after a few hours of driving it's a good idea to get out and stretch anyway.
Their web site says they will have regular J1772 charging plugs as well, I wonder what the deal is to use one of them for charging other EV's.
I have't seen any official published cost, but the Tesla web site says that the super chargers are only free automatically to the upper two models of the Model S and that to use it for the lower version there is a one time fee ($2,000 I hear) not sure if that fee also adds hard ware to the vehicle or if the car just has a dead plug in the back.

One of the next phase of super chargers is putting one up about 30 miles from me, right off I-94, so it will be interesting to see where it ends up in that area.

I really wonder what other electric car manufacturers will do if this starts making good progress. I believe that Tesla.com said that a year's worth of gas was almost $5,000, while electricity would be less than $1,000, but that was for 30,000 miles. Halving that to EPA's average means that it would take a little over four years to break even (on the one-time fee), but that does not sound bad at all. Being able to charge non-Tesla cars would slightly remove Tesla's advantage, but they would still take hours to charge.

Do you think there would be taxis waiting around?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Tele man (Post 373993)
FWIW, about the "only" drivers these days who drive 55 mph are those who are entering a freeway on-ramp on their way UP to their normal 65-75-80 mph 'jaunt.'

Does anyone else here hit fifty-five on the on-ramp? :)

I imagine that most people will consider the 55 MPH estimates to be "unreasonable," but people already willingly pay more to drive too fast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daox (Post 374000)
The base Model S has 208 miles of range (according to the Tesla site), the higher trims have 265 miles. How often do you really drive that far in one jaunt??? Chances are a Model S owner also probably has another vehicle. If they need to drive 500 miles in a day they can just take that. I'm really not even seeing a problem here.

I try to avoid driving at all, but I honestly do not remember the last time that I drove further than the 165 miles to my parents' house. I have driven to California with my family, but not in my vehicle, and I rarely actually drove.

MPaulHolmes 06-01-2013 04:54 PM

Does anyone know how they will be powered? Is it just the regular old grid?

wdb 06-03-2013 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MPaulHolmes (Post 374189)
Does anyone know how they will be powered? Is it just the regular old grid?

Mostly. The article states that some will use solar also.

gone-ot 06-03-2013 02:31 PM

Tesla would be smart to advertise "potty & power" at those EV stops: pee for free while your EV gets charged for free!

UltArc 06-03-2013 06:36 PM

I usually hit 65-80 on the on ramp.

DIMS 06-03-2013 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Tele man (Post 374522)
Tesla would be smart to advertise "potty & power" at those EV stops: pee for free while your EV gets charged for free!

Bammmm! Pee power! African teens create urine-fueled generator | Crave - CNET

gone-ot 06-03-2013 07:07 PM

Darn, out maneuvered (and thought) again!

oil pan 4 06-04-2013 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wdb (Post 374504)
some will use solar also.

120kw? of solar at a car charging station, no I don't think so.

wdb 06-04-2013 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oil pan 4 (Post 374617)
120kw? of solar at a car charging station, no I don't think so.

I apologize - I was unaware that you suffered from nectuntphobia. Please allow me to provide this quote:
Quote:

Musk also said there is grid storage – using huge, half-megawatthour batteries – at some of the stations that have solar power, where stationary batteries take energy from the sun and store it until a Model S pulls up. That means these stations can be completely taken off the grid, so that "even if there is a zombie apocalypse," Musk said, "you will still be able to travel throughout the country using Superchargers."

botsapper 06-04-2013 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wdb (Post 374633)
I apologize - I was unaware that you suffered from nectuntphobia. Please allow me to provide this quote:

...the next post-apocalyptic Mad Max would choose a black hi-po extra-range run-flat tired zombie plow bumpered - Tesla Model X - running from one Supercharger to another!

botsapper 06-04-2013 01:19 PM

...the next post-apocalyptic Mad Max would choose a black hi-po extra-range run-flat tired zombie plow bumpered - Tesla Model X - running from one Supercharger to another!

oil pan 4 06-11-2013 10:10 AM

"half-megawatthour batteries – at some of the stations that have solar power"

I should have been more clear, as in I will believe it when I see it.
I didn't say it can't be done, just that its not going to get done because no one is going to be willing to pay for it.
Almost anything is possible with unlimited money.
I bet they will build one of these solar chargers for the photo op, then when the bills for it come due they will realize how expensive and impractile they are and not make that mistake again.
There is no point in having these "half-megawatthour batteries" sitting around when we have a perfectly good power grid that reaches almost everywhere.
I thought the point with these electric cars was to save the environment.

If I am reading this right, it isn't free by any stretch of the imigination.
A one time $2000 fee or you buy one of their top two most expensive offerings does not meet my definition of free.
Then it only works on teslas, everyone else with a regular affordable, economic EV is SOL.

wdb 06-12-2013 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oil pan 4 (Post 375852)
If I am reading this right, it isn't free by any stretch of the imigination.
A one time $2000 fee or you buy one of their top two most expensive offerings does not meet my definition of free.

I'm curious how much gasoline (or diesel) you got at no extra cost with your last car purchase.

The more expensive Teslas have greater range. You're paying for more batteries. Taking that the next logical step: by offering free "fillups" on the longer range vehicles, Tesla is committing itself to providing more KWH. If the cost of the electricity itself were the primary factor, one would think that they'd charge a fee for the longer range cars. But the primary cost is not the electricity; the primary cost is building the charging stations in the first place.
Quote:

Then it only works on teslas, everyone else with a regular affordable, economic EV is SOL.
Not only that, it only works with Tesla's Model S, not their other cars.

It's chicken/egg. Nobody -- not even Tesla -- built cars up until now with the expectation that charging at this rate would be a practical option. If Tesla succeeds in building out this network, you can bet people will start building their electric cars to make use of it.


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