Trollinsight Modding Thread (2000 Honda Insight)
 

Hi folks!

Yesterday, I wen't to Gatineau to buy a 1st gen Insight! This was definitely the best drive I ever had in my life! All I can say about the price I paid is that it was dirt cheap$ for what I got. It is a 2000, Manual transmission, ~200600 at purchase km and counting, color : Silverstone Metallic NH-630M (dooh).

Link to EcoModder Garage : Trollinsight

EPA : 49 City \ 61 Highway \ 53 Combined MPG (US) | Fuel Economy

Summer MPG's : 85 to 130 MPG in city \ 90 to 110 MPG on highway.

Winter MPG's : 55 to 90 MPG in city \ 75 to 95 MPG on highway.

http://ecomodder.com/forum/fe-graphs/graph6854.gif


Pro's:

-OEM Honda Rims.
-Working IMA Battery System.
-Good Tranny.
-Low (for me) Mileage (200 502 km at purshase).
-New 12v Baterry.
-Better Grounds.
-New catalyst.
-New Shifter Cable.
-New OEM Rear Wheel Skirts.
-PO was the first owner of this car.
-All Services & Oil Changes done.
-New Kenwood Radio/MP3/Ipod Player.
-New Floor Mats.
-New Bridgestone Blizzak 165/65/14'' Winter tires.
-Block Heater (Bought a New Cable and Works Great).


Con's:

-Missing Underbelly Pannels.
-Broken Rear Shocks.
-Lots of dents & scuffs on the front bumper.
-Lots of things are held up by zip-ties underneath the car.
-Lot of rust in the Engine Bay.
-Hood is tough to close.
-Highest Intensity of Wipers isn't working.
-Rear Bumper is legerly deattached.
-Rear Kamm Spoiler is depicted.
-Driver door Window's bottom pannel is depicted (Fixed).
-Driver door window doesn't close properly.
-There is a medium dent on the rear bumper.
-NO Bridgestone Potenza RE92 165/65/14'' (Fixed).
-Cracked Windshield.
-No Trunk Net (not that worst).
-Trip Button Not Working (Fixed).


Up to Date List of my Current Aeromods :

-New Rear Fender Skirts
-Stock Front Wheel Spats
-Stock Rear Wheel Spats
-Stock Front Wheel Arch Deflector
-Stock Belly Pans (Missing some... Need a DIY one)
-Stock Wheel Covers
-100% Lower Grille Block
-Antenna Remove
-Sealed Gaps Around Headlights
-Rear Hatch Wiper Removed In Summer


Planned Aeromods :

-Upper Grille Block
-Passenger Side Mirror Delete (Replace with Interior)
-Smaller Driver Side Mirror (Interior One too)
-Kammback (Maybe Boat-Tail)
-Articulated and Top Hinged Front Wheel Skirts
-DIY Front Belly Pan
-DIY Rear Belly Pan


Inside of the Car Modifications :

-ScanGauge-II
-Daytime Running Lights (DRL) Disabled
-Electric Power-Steering (EPS) Disabled
-Electric Block Heater
-Engine Pad Heater (125w)
-Fire Blanket
-LED 25w Headlights, Side Markers Lights, Position Lights, Dome Light, Map Lights, Tail Lights, Liscence Plate Light & Trunk Light
-LRR Summer Tires (Bridgestone Potenza RE92 P165/65R14, 50 Psi All Around)
-Winter Tires (Bridgestone Blizzak P165/65R14, 45 Psi All Around)
-IMA Inhibit Switch (CLutch Switch)
-2 A 12V Battery Grid Charger
-350 mA 144v Battery Grid Charger & 1.15 A Discharger
-Syntec Motor Oil (Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy 0w-20)
-Accord 2.3L EGR Valve


Planned Inside Modifications :

-Hand-Throttle
-Manual Integrated Motor Assist (MIMA)
-Forced Auto Stop (FAS)
-Bumblebee MaxIMA Battery (6.5 Ah --> 8.0 Ah)
-Ducting From Grille Block Hole to Radiator
-Air Conditioning Delete
-LED Cluster Lights
-Mechanical Water Pump Delete
-Electric Water Pump & EWP Digital Controller
-More Weight Remove
-Syntec Transmission Oil (Honda MTF)


The Ultimate Goal #1 (2013-2014):

My goal is to achieve 100+ MPG tanks [X] , 110+ MPG trips [X] and 117+ MPG highscore (under 2L/100KM) [X] .

The Ultimate Goal #2 (2015-2016):

My new goal is to achieve 117+ MPG tanks [ ] , 130+ MPG trips [ ] and 150+ MPG highscore [ ] .


For now my highest segment score is 151 MPG (1.56 LHK) on the returning trip of my Costco Commute (3.2 mi.) my best trip is 109.7 MPG (2.2 LHK) SMCC 2014 and back (47.2 mi.). My best cummute (7.5 mi.) is 119.8 MPG (1.96 LHK) for the go trip, 132.4 MPG (1.78 LHK) for the returning trip, for an average of 126.1 MPG (1.87 LHK) and my best tank is 94.7 MPG (2.48 LHK) (1004.3 mi. on 40.15 Liters (10.6 Gal US)).


The Car :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...7-sideview.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...e5076-rear.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...5074-front.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...e5072-rear.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...071-rear-2.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...5070-front.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...69-front-2.jpg
FCD showed 79.6 MPG (US) / 2.95 L/100 KM after returning from Gatineau.
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...8-mai-2013.jpg

Congratulations!

However, will you please clarify what you mean by "depicted?" Is there some problem that I should have recognized from the pictures? Thanks!

Good luck! :)

Nice car! As for the "issues" with it, man it's 13 years old, all that stuff is minor! You joined the 369 Club today, welcome! Here's your key to the members lounge lol. You are also a member of the 155 Club, seeing as it's a 2000. Someone will send you a memo on the secret handshake for that club.

Of the 369 sold in Canada, I wonder how many of them are owned by people on this site?

And 200k KMs is nothing! You did good with this one. One of mine has 372k KMs on it, and it's fine! The engine has never been apart, and it has never used any oil since I have owned it. My "low KM" one has 264k KMs, so you have my twins beat lol. I'm jealous!

Very exciting - congrats!

The pictures above doesn't show it, but I took better pictures to show you :

This is the driver's side, you can see that the metal gray part is supposed to be all black.
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...annel-left.jpg

Look at the other side :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...nnel-right.jpg

This is how the Kammback looks
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...4-kammback.jpg

Front Bumper (Left) :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...umper-left.jpg

Front Bumper (Right) :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...mper-right.jpg

All the spots are dents, not dust.

Hahahaha! The secret handshake part made my day :D. Yeah, 200k kms is low. Is there a way to check the lifetime mileage since new? Because all I can display with the FCD button is the trip A and lifetime since I reseted it.

Thank you metro! It is fun to say that the first car I bought is my dream car :p.

There are 4 separate numeric mileage gauges: lifetime, "segment" via FCD button on left of dashboard, trip A, trip B.

Which one did you reset? If you reset lifetime, the old data is lost.

To view the lifetime figure, use the trip button. It cycles between A-B-lifetime.

Yes! That is much clearer! Thank you very much!

Yes, my first car had some pitting in the front from gravel or something and I think that much of the black coating on the metal trim was in the process of peeling off. I would think that a paint job would fix the front, although it may slowly get damaged again. While Aerohead says that the front ends are usually pretty aerodynamic, and Insights should have the best, if you ever decided to try to make it more aerodynamic, that would also protect the bumper.

As for the trim, guys, can he paint that with Plasti-dip?

My trip button doesn't switch between Trip A-Trip B-Lifetime. It stays at Trip A. If I push the FCD button it toggles from Trip A-segment. What is the problem in your opinion?

The FCD button might be stuck. I read somewhere that is a way to "un-stuck" it. Try moving the FCD button slightly sideways, up and down. Might just be a bad mechanical/electrical contact.

Congrats on your purchase. I hope a first gen. Insight is the next vehicle I buy.

Mauricio is right ... the trip or FCD buttons can be a problem. I haven't experienced it yet, but remember someone talking about it here. Insightcentral.net would be a good place to search too.

Don't know about the FCD button (I don't think I've used it since the first few weeks), but the trip button does wear and eventually becomes inoperable. There are two solutions, both of which involve removing the instrument panel (which isn't that difficult, surprisingly). There are two small printed circuit boards, one on each side of the panel, that hold microswitches for the trip button, and the other two similar switches on the left (can't remember what they do). Simplest, if you don't use the left-side buttons, is to just swap the two boards. Otherwise, you can order replacement switches and solder them in. Instructions can be found at InsightCentral, just search for "trip button repair".

My car has 249,827 miles on it. .2 Tm is just broken in for a toyota, an insight should be the same.

I can't help with the display questions, but after looking at those pictures, you could sort that car out in about 20 minutes with 2 cans of spray paint. The trim under the window just needs the remaining black removed (wire brush), then mask the door and window with some tape and spray it with a few coats of semi-gloss black. The faded part on the hatch should be glossy black, but you have to be really careful sanding it smooth as it's plastic. Though try a bit of wax on it first. It won't be perfect, but it will probably look a lot better, and you won't have to worry about ruining the plastic. The front bumper needs to be painted professionally. Silver is a very hard colour to match due to the metallic content. If you tried it yourself with Honda touch up paint out of a spray can, it will look terrible. Trust me, I have ruined enough cars to know ha ha. :snail:

Your exterior issues are pretty good actually! It's the trip button pcb. You can get a free upgrade at Insight central. You have to take the dash apart, i did it to my car.

I tried to push the Trip button all the way possible, for like 300 times. But its still not working. What is weird is that when I push the Trip button for several seconds, it resets my Trip A (where my Trip A-Trip B-Lifetime display is stuck).

Also, I did 80.8 MPG on the FCD on my commute to CEGEP :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...9-mai-2013.jpg

Took a picture of the engine bay :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...engine-bay.jpg

And a picture of the trunk :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...5093-trunk.jpg

Update : I did my first mods! The first one is a DRL (Daytime Running Lights) Deactivation. What I did is simply tilt the switch under the hand brake. It is still grounded so when I start the car, the DRL's are off, and when I remove my hand brake, it doesn't detect it, so the DRL's stays off. I always have the ''DRL'' and ''Hand Brake'' dash lights tho.

I also sealed some gaps between the hood and light plastic cover. It is made of weatherstripping tape.

I will provide some pictures when it will be sunny outside.

What is on my to do list :
-Put the Rear Fender Skirts (I don't have the OEM Fasteners),
-LED Lights,
-Summer Tires (Bridgestone Potenza RE92 165/65/14''),
-New Rear Shock Absorbers,
-Grille Block,
-Antenna Relocation,
-Hatch Wiper Remove for Summer,
-Repair the Trip Button,
-100 MPG Trip! :p

So THAT's what they look like under that plastic engine cover! I've never had to remove mine, so I just left it alone, thanks for posting that. That isn't the factory ground strap on the 12v battery, but I can't remember if that is the correct location for it to be attached to on the body. I only mention it because these cars are really finicky about having the system well grounded, so you might want to double check that it shouldn't be attached to something else for what it's worth.

No problem, in fact I popped the cover only to take a picture of it and ensure everything was fine.

Yes, I know. The PO had grounding problems, so he took the Insight to a Honda Mechanic and he changed all the grounds in the engine bay. There seems to be no ground problems (maybe).

Since I bought the car, the rear fender skirts have been off the car. This was due to missing OEM fasteners. My father and I thinkered a solution and came with an idea : A 1/4'' plastic bolt with a rubber washer and a plastic butterfly nut. There is two of them per fender skirts.

I also did another mod, simple & easy antenna remove. I turned on my radio and tried different stations and even without the antenna I could capt the majority of them, plus, I rarely listen to radio. Since it weights less than a pound, I decided to keep it in the car in case I need the radio out ot town. (Not showned in the pictures).

I took some pictures of the car today :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...nsightsot1.jpg
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...sightshot2.jpg
I decided to remove the "L'allier" sticker from the back window.
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...tshot-rear.jpg

Some Ecomodders have installed the antenna inside of the car. I do not know how they do that, but when I have a car worth modifying, I plan on installing a shark fin antenna.

Of course, I would need one of those with the Sirius radio that has been waiting in my closet.

Forget the Scangauge and go to Insightcentral for a OBDII C&C. It is a member designed device that does everything a Scangauge does plus it shows you what the hybrid system is doing. It allows you to control the state of charge gauge so that you can force charge the battery or stop a charge.

Yeah, I could do that but I do not use my radio much, so that would be useless.

I would probably plug the two devices on a OBD-II splitter :). What is the price of an OBDII C&C?

Update : Today I went to VitroPlus Ziebart to install my insurrance transponder, they started my engine and made it idle for 15-20 minutes :(. 76.2 MPG down to 71.7 MPG... I also decided to disable my electric power steering. I removed the EPS fuse from the engine bay fusebox. It works well, and my steering is still pretty easy to turn. I always have the "EPS" dash light tho.

I ordered 8 LEDs from lightdepot.ca. They should be here in a week or two...

Did a lower grille block on my Insight today. It is made of coroplast and gorilla tape and its help up by zip-ties. It definitely helped with warm-up time and sooner lean burn activation. I also plan on doing a 100% upper grille block. This is not permanent, I plan on doing a more esthetic one this summer.

http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...ille-block.jpg

Congrats on your purchase and welcome to a small club.

My thoughts on your car.

1) Sort/check the grounds out in the engine bay they are vital.
2) Replace all the under body panels or make your own.
3) Fit the proper RE92 Bridgestone tyres and sell yours.
4) Buy the little dash trip switch pcb from the supplier on IC. (Insight central)
5) Read up on and or fit/build a grid charger it may improve your battery and keep it going for a long time.
6) Build and fit a MIMA manual IMA control device :D

Re OBDIIC&C I designed and built that device. ;)
It can't work with another device on the OBDII port and neither can the Scangauge ASFAIK. But you don't need both anyway.
The cost of it is $50 for the blank pcb and software license.
Assembled and tested units cost around $150 on top of the above.
Read the large number of threads on it at IC.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forums...c-c-gauge.html
The lead time for built units is quite long so you are best to buy a pcb and build your own at the moment. All the details are on IC.

Although this is a good forum the main technical discussions surrounding the Insight take place on IC ASFAIK. I suggest get yourself logged on over there as well.

I am with Peter (retepsnikrep). The OBDII C&C does everything the scangauge does, PLUS it tells you what is going on with the IMA system.

I think building and/or buying a grid charger is also a must for battery health. I built a dumb charger. My 2000 has its original battery, I think, and while its capacity is down a bit, it doesn't cause me any problems.

Once you get some RE92s, make sure you keep an eye on tire pressure, I.e. as high as you feel comfortable with. Many go 60 PSI+, depending on what kind of potholes you deal with.

1) All the grounds have been upgraded by the PO.
2) I plan on making my own.
3) I will buy the Bridgestone Potenza RE92 165/65/14, but I won't sell my current tires, being in Quebec, winter tires are mandatory from december 15 to march 15.
4) How much does it cost? Who do I contact on IC?
5) Wondering how to do it.
6) Same thing as above.

Can you program the Gauges shown on the C&C to be displayed on the SG-II? Cause I don't think I can afford 150$ for another OBD-II computer :p.

I would really like to build a grid charger. My battery pack has been replaced 6 years ago and I'm sure that grid charging could improve its SOC range.

Once I get the RE92, I'll probably inflate them between 50-60 PSI. I don't want to inflate them more than 60, because my rear shock absorbers are broken. For now, my winter tires are inflated at 40 PSI.

I guess if you already have the scangauge, you can either stick with it or sell it used to get the C&C (I am sure you could find a buyer here). You might benefit from finding an Insight driver around you that has it and seeing firsthand what it can do.

The grid charger is pretty easy. I built my own. Just type dumb grid charger into the search engine on Insightcentral and you will get easy to find results. A rough explanation is that you wire a couple of 90 volt LED power sources in series with the proper diodes so the current flows in one direction. Pretty easy, and my wiring experience is limited to car stereo installs.

60 PSI is what I use without problem, although I might be careful with blown shocks. I could easily be wrong, but my gut tells me the front tires are a bit more important than rear anyway.

No you can't they work in different ways, the scangauge does not talk to the car on the correct data lines either.

One other little thing to keep in mind is the 12v battery. The Insight is kind of hard on them, and they don't last long. However, you don't use them to start the car except in REALLY cold weather, so you might not realize they are going bad. Once they start to go, the Motor will leech a small amount of engine power to perpetually try to charge them. This will make it a lot harder to stay up with the flow of traffic in lean burn. Also, and I don't have empirical evidence to back this up, but the engine seemed to run less smooth and with a bit less power. I assume it had to do with a weaker spark. Some have had better success with deep cycle batteries, but I didn't go that route, so I can't testify to that. A new 12v will make it feel like you have the wind at your back compared to a bad one.

The 12v Battery on my car is brand new. For now, I've never heard the 12v starter.

Update : Received my LED yersterday. Could put 6 of them in the front + interior. The 2 others (brake lights) blown 2 of my fuses... I changed them, tried again, same results... Returning to disgusting stock brake lights...

Also bought a Block Heater Cord, tested the EBH for about 1 hour and c°WT went from ~18°C to 44°C! Viva el EBH!
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...re5158-ebh.jpg

For what it is worth, I am starting to suspect that mine was more a grounding issue than a bad battery. The old battery looks okay. I imagine I did a better job of grounding it when I attached the new battery. No matter, I have another car that needs a battery. I will just switch the terminals. Still, what I said about batteries holds true, and I got a good lesson on proper grounding as well.

Did a ~30 km trip today and got 61.3 MPG on the FCD. Temp was around 12°C, it was rainy and windy, and I got some traffic. With a passenger. Pretty happy with that! The EBH helped alot when I started, I could definitely see the difference between a cold start and a 2 hour EBH start :).

Also, I have the Insight #95, FWIW. I think that my 144v IMA battery is strong, I read alot on the subject on IC and from what I've learned, when the battery take alot of regen and assist to increase or decrease, this means that your pack is in good shape. I can not compare because I only have one Insight:p, but I think my pack is pretty stong. It has been changed in 2007 on the garantee. The IMA Battery Gauge toggles from 19 bars to 1 bar. I've never seen it at 20 bars. [EDIT : Saw it at 20 bars recently, 12/04/2014]

Repaired my Trip Button problem... I changed the OEM switch for a printer keyboard switch. It doesn't fit perfectly and the switch doesn't react the same way, but it works! I can now toggle from Trip A-Trip B and Lifetime. Used this tutorial to repair the switch : Long writeup of trip button repair.

This is the switch I have used (very crappy quality pictures)... :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...203-switch.jpg

And a random interior picture :
http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-hy...-interieur.jpg

Only little question, I've heard somewhere (in a MetroMPG thread) that you can reset yout lifetime FC. How? I've tried reseting it by pushing for several seconds the trip button in the lifetime display, and it does nothing. The FCD button, if holded for several seconds, deactivate/reactivate the fuel consumption AVG and graph bar.

I also removed the DRL, EPS and E-Brake lights from the dash cluster.

Be aware that the e-brake light also shows if your brake fluid gets low - it's not only for the parking brake.

=----=

As for the lifetime mileage:

Press and hold the trip button for 5 seconds or more until it begins to flash. Then release and press again to clear.

It worked! Thanks. Had to hold it for ~20 seconds until it flashed. Then it resetted like a trip. I was pretty annoyed when looking at the 4.7 LHK / 49.8 MPG lifetime. Below EPA... I hope it stays in the 70+ MPG range now :)