Trying to figure out the budget for a S-10 EV project
 

I am attempting to guess at what the parts will cost to do a EV conversion. I know that they aren't cheap, but I want to try and cut out unnecessary things. And I have no clue on what I am going to do about batteries yet. But, I put in a guess.

I got the initial price list from here and took some guesses at what I was going to need or not need. http://www.evadc.org/build_costs.html

I have a bunch of tools from working on my own car and doing other hobbies. I may also be able to borrow some from other people when needed.

Warp9 DC 9" motor $1,700.00
Adaptor plate and hub 750
Motor mount 137.5
Curtis-PMC1221B motor controller 750
Throttle controller 60
Main contactor 130
Main circuit breaker 110
DC/DC Converter 420
Voltmeter 48
Ammeter 48
Onboard battery charger (Do I need this onboard? I will only recharge at home) 550
Charger interlock relay 15
50 ft 2/0 welding cable 180
Cable lugs 144
Shrink tubing 5
Vacuum brake system 205
Heating system (I plan on using a space heater that runs only in the garage) 25
Electric wire and connectors 170
Batteries1000
"Convert It" Manual 25
Hardware 300
Tools and supplies 100
Paint and supplies 100
Angle iron 50
Welding services 450
Flywheel resurfacing (or should I get a new lightweight one?) 55

Total $7,527.50


So, what costs could I change? Which ones aren't needed?

Are you stuck on the idea of doing your own conversion?

As for cost savings, one often repeated bit of advice on the EVDL is to buy someone else's - you'll almost always end up paying less than if you build it yourself.

EG: electric trucks for sale...
http://www.austinev.org/evtradinpost...=13&clearoff=1

I haven't made any commitment yet. So, if I find the perfect one that is on sale (and close to me), I would buy it. However, I would think that would be a long shot. Plus, I would probably have to pay sales tax on the full price (Although I'm supposed to pay on internet orders ;) )


This weekend, I'll have to do some shopping to see if I can find better prices and write down where I found these prices. And I'll also have to see if getting a kit would save money (it would save some shipping costs)

http://www.cloudelectric.com/inc/sdetail/1992

I also found this price list from 2005:
http://peakoil.com/fortopic9721.html

If you do go the route of building your own then keep a more open mind to the prospect of using scrap, used, or spare parts. What is available will depend on what is in and around your town/city of residence.
Also, i'm still very much an EV Rookie so don't take my word as gospel.

Warp9 DC 9" motor = $1,700.00
used DC motor from a forklift junk yard = $60 to $180 (I paid $60 for mine)
Refurbish motor cost (DIY) = $20 - $40

Adaptor plate and hub 750
Possibility: buy a small sheet of metal and pay a hobby mechanist to custom make one for you. Price: $200

Motor mount 137.5
Same as above. but it MIGHT be cheaper instead of will.

Curtis-PMC1221B motor controller 750
Throttle controller 60
Main contactor 130
Main circuit breaker 110
DC/DC Converter 420
Voltmeter 48
Will this work? Meters - Voltmeter DC (0-3V/0-15V/0-300V) $12.65


Ammeter 48
Onboard battery charger (Do I need this onboard? I will only recharge at home) 550
If you ONLY plan to recharge at home then no, you don't need it. But what about when you have those rare instances where you have to drive all the way across town for a meeting, family reunion, or just to show it off? When people see "Electric" written on the truck they WILL stop and ask you questions, even invite you to car shows. don't underestimate the power of the electric.

Charger interlock relay 15
50 ft 2/0 welding cable 180
Cable lugs 144
Shrink tubing 5
Vacuum brake system 205
Heating system (I plan on using a space heater that runs only in the garage) 25
(Now you're thinking! but goodwill space heater = $10 during summer time.)

Electric wire and connectors 170
Batteries1000
"Convert It" Manual 25
Library Card - Free

Hardware 300
Tools and supplies 100
Paint and supplies 100
Angle iron 50
Welding services 450
Flywheel resurfacing (or should I get a new lightweight one?) 55

Your Total $7,527.50
If my recommendations work: Approx $5422.15
Savings: $2,105 (my math might be off)
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Don't limit yourself to NEW ONLY. Also don't discount the cost of the S-10. Do you already have it?

I'm just a rookie, but hopefully I can get you to view the cost in a different light. RED GREEN is the way to go. you can do this and still find plenty of places to shave cost.

Your original conversion estimate sounds about right.

I was shocked at how expensive it can be to convert to electric.

It's enough money that a person could buy a pretty nice used economy car for the same price as conversion.

There are a number of people here working on some form or another of an electric conversion. Of course a lot of us are doing it homebrew/used parts, etc because of the D-I-Y attitude as much as cost savings.

Your original estimate sounded like you would have a really nice finished vehicle.

If you haven't already, try locating a local chapter of the Electric Auto Association. http://www.eaaev.org/ All those people are very nice and very passionate about electric vehicles.

I don't have the car yet, but the car cost I can justify. I found one around be for under $2,000. Let's just say that I have spent much less than other people on cars in my neighborhood/life/family.

Thanks for your suggestions. I'll have to do some searching, fixing up old stuff if what I like to do. And I guess a trip to the library is in order. I ride my bike past it, so I'll stop in today.

Long time builder and converter here. What is your pack voltage? Just wondering about your battery costs. Also, you might want to invest in a Link-10 battery monitor (used to be called E-Meter), this will tell you your amp-hr capacity.

SM

I'm not sure yet. I would guess 144V, but it may be 120V if it meets my needs and it is $1000+ cheaper or something...

I would need some way to tell how much power I have left, good idea.

Is this your first conversion? I will ask the usual questions I tell to people who want to convert: What range do you want and How much are you willing to spend?
I am not critizing you, but $1000 is pretty low for a 120-144V battery pack. I just paid $2700 last week for twenty replacement batts for my E.V. (120v). Of course by my calculations I hope to have a range of 60 miles.:eek:

I was thinking about your project last night and I can think of a couple of resources for you to save money or time.
I know one company that makes a complete S-10 conversion kit (battery boxes, parts, controller but no batts) but they want close to $9000
I scan daily this website for cheap used parts. If you are on a tight budget you go to that site.
It has been my observation that 50% of E.V. conversions fail due to not finishing the project, loss of motivation or not having enough money for batteries and or finishing the project. Yeah, it is scavenging, but it is cheap parts.

My initial thought was to get 10-12 of these marine deep cycle batteries http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_02827524000P , but I have done no research into batteries or capacitors are anything else. I am leaning towards 120V right now and would hope that it would be powerful enough. I'm not sure if I would go AC or DC though and what that impacts in way of costs:


It should be around $1000. I'm not looking for that much range really. 30 miles (round trip) would be the max, and even that would be a rare thing. Most of my trips are between 2 - 9 miles. I am basically making a grocery getter, bad weather transport, and big item transport. I would like to put my kayak in the back and take it easily to a river or lake that is 6 miles away. If the weather is good (and I don't have to carry anything big or rush anywhere), I can ride my bike and will continue to do so, even with an EV.

I do finish the projects I start, it's just not always on the original schedule. My intention is to get done around Dec. 18 (my birthday) so I can register it for 2009 and not have to register it in 2008. The fact that I have a date set is a good thing and will get high priority. I am working on completing all of the other little outstanding projects that I have and am making good progress. There isn't really anything that I worry about when it comes to being able to complete this project. Others have already done it, I have access to welding supplies and welders at work. I do electric and computer engineering at work (remote autonomous robotics...hardware failure is not an option :) ), and if I go over my budget by a little it won't cause the project to not be completed. This will be my hobby now, so I would like to keep the costs down to make it take fewer years to make up the cost in saved gas, but it's also a fun thing to do.

I wasn't planning on starting anything until August or so, and I will be researching what I need up until then. If the right deal comes along, I may start sooner though.

The best bang for the buck, is to go with flooded 6v golf cart style batteries. If you're doing a truck, you'll have the room / GVWR. 12v batteries won't last as long - the plates aren't as robust as the 6v ones.

AC is more moolah. DC components are more common, and if you start scrounging now, you may be able to pick up some used ones before your deadline.

http://images6.theimagehosting.com/a...-roof.1.th.jpg

:D

Something like this battery?
http://www.batteriesplus.com/pc-3651...SLI6V225S.aspx

It costs $170 for 6V ($3400 for 20 = 120V). It has lots of Ah though (250Ah). How many amp hours do you think I should be looking to get? How many years/miles/recharges could I expect for each type of battery? It sure would be nice if some company would produce a 120V battery (it may be huge, but it would be just one part.) I wonder if the Sears 2 year guarantee applies to electric car batteries?

(My current Saturn SC2 looks like that right now with the kayak on the roof, but it doesn't do a good job carrying lumber, chairs, TVs, dirt, rocks, grills, and a few other items.)

I can tell you a cheaper source of batteries. When I converted over from the Optima Yellow Tops to the Trojan T-125s, I was shocked at the current price of the T-125. Trojan Flooded batteries in the past used to be the cheapest but everyone uses them so the price went up. Then I found out that it is actually one battery manufacturer that produces these and they sell to different battery companies with different case colors. The Trojan T-125 is equivalent to a U.S. Battery U.S. 125, the Dyno sGC2B, Exide's GC5, Interstate U2300 and many others. I can give you an equivalent list if you wish.
I went with the Interstate U2300 because it was cheaper at $120 a battery vs. $187 for the T-125. In past dealings with battery companies, I was always able to haggle over the price since it was a volume purchase (volume discount) and it was for an electric vehicle.

Something else to consider besides amp-hr capacity is the number of cycles the batteries can take. The T-125 can take 650 cycles at 80% Depth of Discharge.

Yes it costs a hell of lot more. When I worked on A.C. Propulsion's 100kw drive system, it cost $25k over ten years ago. Then they came out with the 150kw drive system and that cost $35k. Now they produce a second generation system using IGBT's and the costs are huge.
It is a hell of a lot cheaper to go with a DC setup. The efficencies of the A.C. Propulsion's system is around 95% and I have seen DC setups the vary from 85-89%.