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Old 09-05-2012, 01:03 PM   #11 (permalink)
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True there are useless patents but there are also very useful ones, we (we being general automotive inclined people) that some water sprayed into your engine is good, it helps clean the pistons and valves and begins to remove that carbon built up throughout the engine, more so AEM is selling a product that does this for $500 on their website. The product is aimed at Turbo/Super charger applications however, in an effort to cool the incoming air and keep the engine from detonating (engine knock). The residual effects are a slightly increased burn inside the cylinder walls...

AEM Water/Methanol Injection Kits - Water-Meth Injection Systems for Turbo/Super - Wideband O2 UEGO, Water/Methanol, Stand Alone Engine Management, Piggyback F/IC, Tru Boost Controller, Gauges, Automotive Performance Electronics

AEM Water/Methanol Injection Monitor Evaluation

I don't mean to argue but this is sound, though I do appreciate your input and especially your contribution with that other article! :-)

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Old 09-05-2012, 01:21 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Would someone with the spare $ and a mpg reader be willing to experiment with the alcohol/water cheap method?

Mother Earth Alcohol Fuel: Ron Novak's Do-It-Yourself Water Injection System

it would be hard for me to test this on my 04 Silverado, I'm broke and don't have an mpg reader...
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:29 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Its only going to do any good on a high compression engine, more than 11:1, or forced induction. Putting water injection on a stock engine with stock tune is not going to do any good.
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Old 09-05-2012, 01:42 PM   #14 (permalink)
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how do you know this? Are you referring to solely the AEM systems?

Last edited by Lethedethius; 09-05-2012 at 02:00 PM.. Reason: mispelled word
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Old 09-05-2012, 02:02 PM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ksa8907 View Post
Its only going to do any good on a high compression engine, more than 11:1, or forced induction. Putting water injection on a stock engine with stock tune is not going to do any good.
x2

I think the idea has some merit. But you would have a lot of experimenting to do.

It would be a fun experiment, that might yield better FE. Most people don't have the skill, patience, or time/money to carry it out (including me).

The increased compression ratio and cylinder pressure might give you better efficiency from the given engine, the 'fog' introduced at the right time under the right conditions, could keep combustion temperatures and detonation in check under heavy load. Gaining efficiency while cruising at a constant speed and relatively low load, yet keeping engine killing detonation and Nox production under control under heavier loads.

I'll add to that: raising the compression ratio of most any normally aspirated gasoline (street) engine will increase power, and usually efficiency. The oem's have know this for a long time, and as of the last 15 years or so, have been able to take advantage of that through better fuel metering and ignition timing controls. Standard compression ratios for passenger cars used to be in the neighborhood of 8 or 9:1. These days, 10 or 10.5:1 are common in normally aspirated passenger cars that burn 87 octane fuel. You could have never gotten away with burning 87 octane in a 1960's 9.5:1 compression mild performance V8. 87 octane in a 1960's performance V8 like a factory optioned 11:1 Chevrolet V8, would have ruined the ring lands and beat the rod bearings up, not made much power and would have run very hot.

If a guy had a car to experiment with, and lots of spare time, I'd start by doing the required machine work and increase the compression ratio by an entire point. Say, from factory 10:1 to 11:1 for example, then adding a computer controlled Snow or similar system.

I tried something like this on an air-cooled VW back in 1981. The guy I bought the car from warned me it had higher than factory 9:1 compression, and said I needed to burn premium fuel in it, or it would ping and overheat (death to an air-cooled engine). I cobbled together a primitive water injection system copied from a magazine article of the day, and was able to burn regular octane fuel, without running hot, had good power, and decent FE while I was commuting back and forth to college. When it ran out of water, it would ping and rattle so bad you could hear it over that aweful music I used to listen to back then
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:03 PM   #16 (permalink)
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A good deal of the increased compression available today stem from the use of aluminum heads which dissipate heat better than do iron heads.
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Old 09-05-2012, 03:17 PM   #17 (permalink)
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In short, running water injection on a gas engine is a waste of time.
Running water injection on a new gen-III LS serries motor that my have DoD would hydrolock your motor if it did have DoD.

Lots and lots and lots of people have tried water injection on gassers for fuel economy but very few are able to produce positive results, most gassers that try water injection lose fuel milage.

Water injection - EcoModder

With a gas powered truck you are better off looking into aero mods.
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Old 09-05-2012, 11:07 PM   #18 (permalink)
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I've got it on my ride, 2 benefits for me 1) cleans intake (regular service item on ALH) 2) additional power when the intercooler is heat soaked (mostly noticeable over 135f iat).

If I was low specific output naturally aspirated I would not even consider it.
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Old 09-06-2012, 05:41 AM   #19 (permalink)
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It will clean the intake and combustion chamber for sure.
That in its self might be worth a small MPG boost.

If you run water/methanol you are just burning alcohol in place of gasoline, kind of like a propane or natural gas bifuel vehicle. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
On a gasser running straight methanol would be better.

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