[Patrick]

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

The cost of EV's will come down when they're in mass production.

Agreed. And I hope they do. Soon. But the sales prices out now are all we have to work with.

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

And what does the cost of purchase have to do with the efficiency of the vehicle?

Nothing, but the videos posted are rather disingenuous in trying to show that EVs save the owner money, which they don't once the purchase price is included. The purchase price must be included in any cost/benefit analysis.

And don't try to tell me you "saved" enough through EV efficiency to buy a battery pack when you haven't paid off the car price difference yet.

Originally Posted by NeilBlanchard

I doubt very much that the carbon footprint for the Prius's gasoline included the well-to-wheels. Need I mention again, that a car that burns fuel refined from petroleum is consuming as much electricity as the EV is PLUS the gasoline/diesel. 3-5 days "cooking" the oil into fuel takes a lot of additional energy; including electricity (with it's own embedded carbon) and natural gas (which includes it's drilling, transportation, etc.).

Can you tell me how much energy is embedded in gasoline? Because, if you want to be fair, then you have to take this into account.

Edit:

Toyota RAV4 EV: 887 BTU/mile
Toyota Prius: 2250 BTU/mile
Toyota RAV4 Gas: 4423 BTU/mile

(From: Gas Mileage, greenhouse gas emissions, air pollutant emissions and safety ratings of new and used alternative fuel vehicles)

How can 887BTU/mile emit the same carbon as 2250BTU/mile? It is 2.5X higher for the Prius -- is exploring for oil, drilling, transporting, storing, transporting, refining, storing, transporting, storing, and then pumping it into your Prius really that much more efficient than the electric grid? If so, then prove it.

I already did. Fueleconomy.gov uses the GREET 1.7 model, which is well-to-wheels. It's already figured in. If you don't like it, go argue with the DOE and Argonne National Labs.

"Our carbon footprint shows a car's CO2 emissions in tons per year, along with the CO2 emitted in producing and distributing the fuel."

The bottom line with all of this is that EV proponents have to be honest about their limitations as well as touting their advantages before EVs will be widely adopted. Only telling half the story will result in disgruntled buyers who will spread the word and kill off any potential foothold in the marketplace that EVs may have gained.