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Originally Posted by t vago
You're calling the Northern Hemisphere "local?" Wow.
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Drop the fake surprise, what are you referring to?
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Originally Posted by t vago
Besides that, you can point out that global temperatures have been rising in the recent past, from about 1990 onward.
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It looks like longer than that
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Originally Posted by t vago
However, that does not mean that Mankind carbon dioxide output is definitively proven as the reason why.
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One step at a time please.
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Originally Posted by t vago
Harp on greenhouse gas all you want, but the fact remains that there's no causal link showing carbon dioxide makes temperatures rise.
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They trap more heat, that is what greenhouse gasses do by definition.
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Originally Posted by t vago
water vapor is anywhere from 2 to 10 times more effective as a greenhouse gas
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Excellent point. And a warmer atmosphere can hold even more vapor, and be even better at trapping the suns energy.
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Originally Posted by t vago
Given that, and given the estimate of 750 gigatons of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere at the same time, how can you with a straight face claim that carbon dioxide alone is responsible for the temperature rise?
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Is that addressed to me? I never said that. as bwilson might say, I don't have a dog in this fight. I'm just trying to get the facts straight.
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Originally Posted by t vago
At that, how can you claim that MANMADE carbon dioxide is responsible for this temperature rise?
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Show me where I claimed such a thing. I'm looking at pictures and listening to "fanatics" on both sides trying to make sense of it.
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Originally Posted by t vago
While we're asking questions to each other that imply a lack of intelligence - You do realize that 12,900 gigatons of water vapor is more mass than 750 gigatons of carbon dioxide, right, acb? You do realize that water vapor is at least twice as effective a greenhouse gas as carbon dioxide is, right, acb?
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I'm not sure where you are going w/the mass. Do you agree with the wikipedia assesment of relative contributions? h2o is not twice as effective by weight, but rather overall?
Gas Contribution
Water Vapor H2O 36 – 72 %
Carbon Dioxide CO2 9 – 26 %
Methane CH4 4 – 9 %
Ozone O3 3 – 7 %
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Originally Posted by t vago
(Waiting for Neil to come up with some other close-minded AGW zealot source, and pass it off as scientific support for AGW...)
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honestly I can't deal w/him when he gets like this either, but do please try to stay calm for my own edification. You bring up a lot of good points, though they do seem to come with a tinge of bias.
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Originally Posted by t vago
Why do you ignore the effects of water vapor, and belittle the effects of that huge glowing thermonuclear ball hanging about 93 million miles above us?
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I don't think that is an accurate assessment of my position.