[RedDevil]

Originally Posted by oldtamiyaphile

... Certainly for many people in Europe, where cars are taxed into the thousands of dollars per year you can see how someone with a ICE Golf sized car pays thousands a year in tax, while mr Hybrid SUV in some cases pays nothing, even though in all likelihood he's putting out more CO2.

Let's hear it from an European then - me.
First of all my car was not precharged when it was tested for economy. Its EPA number is not high and easy to beat, even in our horrendous traffic.
Some of the PHEV hybrids have artificially good ratings due to precharging and the small test cycle, but not the ordinary hybrids.

There are two kinds of economy related consumer car taxes in my country - a buyers tax and the road tax.
The buyers tax had a system where it was raised or lowered based on CO2 output - for the vehicle type. The idea being that when someone buys a SUV anyway, it better be the one that gets best economy. The bigger the car, the more effect efficiency upgrades have on them. It has changed lately, but it still does something like this.
They just look at economy, not whether it is a hybrid or not.
EV's and plugin hybrids have a taxation reduction in the lease market, but private buyers don't profit from that.

Then there is the road tax, based on vehicle weight and fuel type.
Hybrids may deduct 125 kg from their registered vehicle weight before taxation; as to prevent that car buyers would have to pay more for having hybrid technology making their cars heavier, even though it improves economy.
For me it saves me € 88 per year.
Can't really say they are throwing money at me by the bucketfull for having a hybrid.
But as I have to pay my own fuel, I don't care. It saves me enough on our ridiculously high fuel prices anyway.

But even if it did not I would not care. I love this car! I like the way it drives. I love the sub 2000 RPM on the highway. I love the opportunities to harvest back energy when forced to slow down, and the almost silent running in EV mode 9not that it is loud when burning gas).

Bah!

I've fallen into your trap again.

Here I was argueing that hybrids make sense on other areas than cost, and all you do is keep hammering on cost, and I get into that discussion again.
Who cares.
Most people who spend money on cars don't care about economy.

My dad recently bought a hybrid because it was a high seating small car with a nice and responsive automatic tranny.
He drives just a couple of 1000 miles a year. He could not care less about economy.
Waht majkes sense to him is the way the car behaves.

Maybe we should change the thred title to 'do hybrids really make cents?' so then at least its clear that it is about money with the exclusion of such worldly luxuries as comfort, safety and reliability?

Bedtime, goodnight.