[mpg_numbers_guy]

Originally Posted by Xist

The HX engine of both generations has maintenance issues or just one generation?

I'm not sure, I just remember reading earlier that engines with lean burn had issues as they aged if not meticulously cared for. Due to the lean burn, not the engine build.

Originally Posted by Xist

I do not understand the popularity of coupes. Cheaper? Sure. They look better? People have strange opinions regarding appearances. Even when I rarely have passengers, I have always preferred being able to access the back seats via doors.

I wanted a sedan even before discovering that its insurance would be cheaper lol.

Originally Posted by Xist

How long would the cheaper insurance take to pay for the complicated swap?

None really because it would be all covered by the sale of my current car.

Originally Posted by Ecky

I'm not certain that a CEL breaks lean burn in the HCH1. It certainly doesn't in the G1 Insight.

This article talks about it a little bit, and there were a couple others but I can't find them yet - should've bookmarked them.

Originally Posted by Ecky

When the battery goes, you're looking at ~$1000 for a rebuilt one which would probably be good for a minimum of 4-5 years, or if it turns out the CEL doesn't break lean burn, you can just remove it entirely and save the weight. HCH1 is a fantastic car, whose only real weakness was the HV battery.

I'd either get one with an already dead battery, or a cheapo one and then sell the battery. I'd rather deal with a conventional gasoline engine than something that'll require a $1000+ replacement every few years. Just doesn't make sense in terms of ROI.

Originally Posted by Ecky

In fact, you could remove the entire hybrid system and do something similar to what I did in my car, which is to just hook the 3 phase wires from the HV motor to a rectifier and drop the 70-300v DC produced down to 14v. Costs about $120 in parts (just 2 parts, in fact) and you'll have what is effectively a far more efficient alternator.

It can be wired up in such a way that I can delete the alternator without having to use a deep cycle battery or grid charging?

Honestly that would be great; would you mind me paying you a visit next spring to help me wire this out?

Originally Posted by Ecky

HCH1s with dead batteries are common and cheap as dirt.

This is why it's appealing to me more than doing an engine and/or tranny swap in a regular Civic.

Originally Posted by California98Civic

...But imagine a little bit more how you might drive the hybrid. It has final drive gearing in between where a VX transmission and a Sixth Gen HX. So even if you disable the Hybrid battery you'll have a car with really tall gearing even if not quite as tall as a 5th gen VX or CX. However, with the hybrid and the bypassed battery you have an engine that is much smaller than a standard 7th gen engine and it's even significantly smaller than the 5th gen 1.5 liter engines. That means that doing pulse and glide with your very tall Transmission and your very small engine, you should be able to get some really remarkable numbers with the kill switch installed.

Just an alternate suggestion.

An alternate suggestion and I like it a lot. Now to find me the best of the available HCH1 cheapos.

Originally Posted by Ecky

Any reason why an Insight might not work for you? My insurance is really cheap...

EDIT: Yesterday I drove around 15 miles on the highway, and ~8 miles through town. To get this kind of economy in an Insight, I just set cruise control to 50 and watch the gauge slowly creep up toward 100mpg, no pulse and glide or drafting.

2 passenger, less cargo space, and most important, impossible to find. One with a bypassed battery was ~$3000, decent ones are $4000-$6000, or they're $1000 autotragics with bad transmissions...cvts....

Originally Posted by Ecky

So, the Honda Insight was the prototype "L" series engine, which replaced the D-series in Honda's lineup. The Insight's engine is called an "ECA1", but it's really a 3 cylinder L engine, and is most similar to the engine in the HCH1 (L13) and Fit (L15). The most recent L15B engine is in the turbo Civic and delivers 200HP while capable of 60+ mpg in the hands of a capable driver - ask Balto about his time with one. The "L" engines have some major advantages over the D series. Read about it here:

The Truly Amazing Honda Fit/Jazz

Some highlights:

-10% weight over D series
Smaller dimensions
Smaller angle combustion chamber -> better combustion
Camshafts have roller bearings where the rocker arms contact -> lower friction
Molydebnum coated piston skirts -> lower friction
Crankshaft offset -> more torque, lower friction, longer engine life (this is huge!)
Time chain never needs replacement, lower friction
Plastic/resin intake, reduces weight
Higher compression ratio -> more efficient
Some L-series have dual spark plugs

So it is the HCH1 engine an L-series then, or a D-series?

ALSO, FuelEconomy.gov indicated that there were two manual HCH1s - one with lean burn and one without. How would I tell the difference when inspecting a car?