Fuel Economy, Hypermiling, EcoModding News and Forum - EcoModder.com - View Single Post - Project 60/60 Xfi Metro and Singh grooves

metromizer · 09-08-2008, 08:48 PM

[QUOTE=bbjsw10;59333]The only problem I have with this "improvement" from singh grooves is all the testimonials I read, the people had done other things along with it, resurface head, valves, tune-up's, etc. Who is to say these grooves did the improvement or the repairs they did.
QUOTE]

That's the same thing I thought, initially at least. I think I looged on to the site and was able to view more things inside... I've never received any spam or solicitations as a result. I read where one guy at least, compensated for groove volume by flycutting the head slightly. Then reading further, some guys simply flycut the head more, under the assumption the grooves are an "enabler" that allow the engine builder to run slightly higher than normal compression with no detonation. Slightly higher than normal compression definately give better cylinder filling and more power. More power per pulse can result in a more efficient use of the fuel you feed the engine.

I can't recite combustion theory paragraph and verse like some can here, but I have been motivated to play with and better understand combustion chamber shape in race engines. A faster burn means less timing lead (advance) is needed, a good thing. Tightening the 'deck' (reducing the clearence between the quench area of the head and piston) on a normally aspirated wedge head design always seems to produce more power, irrespective of compression ratio. On a supercharged engine, tighening the deck has little effect. I believe the tight deck increase turbulance and charge mixing just before ignition.

So, might those low-tech grooves cause 'jets' of air fuel mixture to futher enhance mixing just before ignition? Again, the guy isn't selling anything, so what's the motivation for telling big fish stories? I'm not sure, but I wouldn't use the old "Then whay aren't the automove manufactures all using if its so good" argument. Many large manufacturers have the 'not invented here' mentality, GM had been know for that line of thinking, for instance (not sure about today).

It seems to me there are enough guys here who tinker, that someone objective has played with this idea. You know, layed hands on hardware... or grooves as it were.

Anyone?

09-08-2008, 08:48 PM	#15 (permalink)
metromizer Master EcoModder Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: NorCal Posts: 451 Thanks: 1 Thanked 40 Times in 26 Posts	[QUOTE=bbjsw10;59333]The only problem I have with this "improvement" from singh grooves is all the testimonials I read, the people had done other things along with it, resurface head, valves, tune-up's, etc. Who is to say these grooves did the improvement or the repairs they did. QUOTE] That's the same thing I thought, initially at least. I think I looged on to the site and was able to view more things inside... I've never received any spam or solicitations as a result. I read where one guy at least, compensated for groove volume by flycutting the head slightly. Then reading further, some guys simply flycut the head more, under the assumption the grooves are an "enabler" that allow the engine builder to run slightly higher than normal compression with no detonation. Slightly higher than normal compression definately give better cylinder filling and more power. More power per pulse can result in a more efficient use of the fuel you feed the engine. I can't recite combustion theory paragraph and verse like some can here, but I have been motivated to play with and better understand combustion chamber shape in race engines. A faster burn means less timing lead (advance) is needed, a good thing. Tightening the 'deck' (reducing the clearence between the quench area of the head and piston) on a normally aspirated wedge head design always seems to produce more power, irrespective of compression ratio. On a supercharged engine, tighening the deck has little effect. I believe the tight deck increase turbulance and charge mixing just before ignition. So, might those low-tech grooves cause 'jets' of air fuel mixture to futher enhance mixing just before ignition? Again, the guy isn't selling anything, so what's the motivation for telling big fish stories? I'm not sure, but I wouldn't use the old "Then whay aren't the automove manufactures all using if its so good" argument. Many large manufacturers have the 'not invented here' mentality, GM had been know for that line of thinking, for instance (not sure about today). It seems to me there are enough guys here who tinker, that someone objective has played with this idea. You know, layed hands on hardware... or grooves as it were. Anyone?