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-   -   2010 Insight -- Hyper Black (https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/2010-insight-hyper-black-34574.html)

Natalya 11-23-2016 02:21 AM

2010 Insight
 
http://www.lady-natalya.info/insight...hts-00-900.png

A couple months ago I started a thread about driving for Uber in the USA, but I needed an Eco Beater. I had already driven for Uber in Ontario near the end of 2015 and things went well for me up there. Anyway, last week I scored a 2010 Insight LX with 87k miles for $6300. All in (taxes, title, etc) it's $6853.


About the Car:
I originally intended to get a cheaper car ($3000 range) but this Insight was too good an opportunity to pass up. I test drove it and everything was in good shape.

There are two new-looking Bridgestone Ecopias on the back wheels, the front wheels are like performance tires, made by Falken, but they're worn. Passenger side is almost at the warning bars. I'll have to replace them sooner than later, and I'll probably go with more Ecopias. All 4 are 175/65/R15. I put 44 PSI in all the tires.

I also installed new wiper blades and really bright (and cheap) LED lights for the interior.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/insight...hts-01-900.png

The car ate the curb at some point, and has a ding in the middle of the front bumper, but there's no other major cosmetic damage, and the interior is looking nice.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/insight...hts-02-900.png

My first tank came in at 48.1 MPG. I filled up early actually thinking it was close to out, but it looks like the gauge is conservative. It turns out I had over a gallon left.


Fate of the G1:
I can't sell the silver Insight right now because it's still registered in Ontario. I've applied to Honda for a certificate of compliance with US standards (EPA, FMVSS) but I haven't got that yet. Once I get that if I drive to Canada (going there for XMas) then I can drive back to the states with it and register it in Georgia. Honestly though, I'm really attached to the silver car, and its insurance is incredibly cheap, so I'm tempted to keep it. Also, there's the issue of the low market value for G1's in general right now, so if I tried to sell it might end up on the market for a while. Economically however I should sell it since I now have the black car. I'm not driving the G1 enough to save $70/mo in gas versus a G2. Basically, its future is up in the air.


Ridesharing:
I was already familiar with Uber from doing it in Canada, so I signed up with them. I've done like 3 days of ridesharing with them so far. My other job (warehouse & internet work for small online retailer) is up and down with business from week to week. It's feast or famine. Fortunately that allows me to be incredibly flexible with my hours, which makes ridesharing in my time off attractive. I can't do it every day however, so for now on those days I'm using the silver Insight because of its superior fuel economy.

I also signed up for Lyft but they still have to background check me. Once that's done I can drive for them. I heard (from a couple other drivers) they pay way better than Uber. I guess I'll find out.


Benefits of Ridesharing:
My commute is ideal for ridesharing. I drive through a high income area on the way to the highway, and my job is close to Atlanta itself. This means plenty of opportunities for rides.

I mentioned above my current job is kind of a drought-or-flood place. The unreliability of my schedule (sometimes I can get only 20 hours, other times I can get 35+) means my paycheck varies week to week. A flexible second income like this could really help me.

Drawbacks // Risks:
Is the money really worth it? That's the main question. With Uber I think (so far from a very limited time doing it) that I might be in the black. Uber doesn't seem to pay as much down here as it did in Canada, but to be fair the US dollar is stronger. However, in my first 3 days of part-time driving I was able to recoup the monthly insurance premium. But honestly it's too early to tell.

Will passengers or all the miles destroy the value of the car? I feel like I got a sweet deal on it, but I have to acknowledge that knowing me I will almost certainly spend some money to make it better. For example, I'll likely get LED brake lights and turn signals, I'll get two more LRR tires, and I want to change the CVT fluid and filters sooner than later. So the total price isn't going to be $6853, it's going to be higher. I am keeping receipts so I can write off stuff on my taxes. For example I had to get a suction cup windshield mount for my phone, so I've got that receipt. I'll also keep them for gas and for the expenses mentioned above. In any case, add everything up, I'll want to exceed that plus what I paid for the car before the car bites the dust. I am optimistic, I think I can do it and then make a profit afterwards.

Planned Mods:
- Fix lower front bumper cover
- Grill block
- ScanGauge (will take from G1 when I get OBDIIC&C working on G1)
- Underbody Aero
- Possibly a WAI
- Possible rear window wiper delete
- LED brakes & signals
- Window tint
- Full Regen Brake Switch

Implemented Mods:
- LED interior lighting

RedDevil 11-23-2016 03:18 AM

Looking good :)

I had to replace my low beams with HIDs as the halogen bulbs seem to underperform in the projector housings. I got overlooked by other road users as well (but we have no OEM DRLs or side markers here...)
The same H11 halogen bulbs are in the fogs (EX trim) where they seem much brighter. They lose out against the HID low beams though, so I replaced them with LEDs for DRL use.

Cheapo LEDs everywhere except the dash, indicators and brakes.
The LEDs in the license plate lights keep failing on a schedule, so those need regular checking.

Swapping the horn for an Accord one is almost mandatory. The Insight OEM horn somehow sounds pathetic. The Accord horn sounds right without being much louder, just more real car like.

RedDevil 11-23-2016 05:15 AM

About the WAI:
I tried removing the intake snorkel and drove with varying levels of grill block, resulting in higher intake temps.
Removing the snorkel has little effect without grill block, but once the radiator heats up the intake air it really takes off. Like 15 miles of nothing, then poof.
I keep it on nowadays and just partly block the grill; that seems to heat up earlier and more gradual, less prone to overheating except in traffic jams with A/C on.

Apparently there is no FE benefit from taking it above 30C (86F); beyond 50C (122F) efficiency even drops. I bet it troubles the EGR function.
As grill blocking raises the under hood temperature it may cook the 12V battery - a 2nd gen weak spot anyway. I have a gauge setting monitoring battery voltage...

Vman455 11-23-2016 10:49 AM

Congrats on the new car! The G2 already has LED brake/tail lights, so you'd only be looking at turn signals, reverse lights, parking lights, head lights, license plate lights to be full LED on the exterior. Try the Philips Vision for the 168/194 license plate bulbs; they're warrantied for 12 years.

Vman455 11-23-2016 10:56 AM

Also, if you ever need to replace the rear bumper cover, consider switching to the 2012+ design, which has a sharper cutoff line on the sides. It was good for +1mpg on both EPA city and highway tests.

2011 (same as your 2010):
http://static.usnews.rankingsandrevi...ngularrear.jpg

2012-2014:
http://st.motortrend.com/uploads/sit...gular-rear.png

RedDevil 11-23-2016 10:59 AM

My rear bumper is damaged a bit, but I was told I could not retrofit a 2012+ bumper without modifications. That would not stop me if I needed one hard enough, but as yet I do not need it hard enough.

Daox 11-23-2016 11:52 AM

Nice new wheels, congrats!

Natalya 11-24-2016 01:58 PM

@RedDevil:
12V batteries are a weak spot on the G1 as well. I guess in both cars Honda didn't adequately isolate them from the engine bay temperatures, although with the G1 it might be possible to finish the job with some kind of rubber seal. The G2 12V battery is in a tough spot to insulate.

What year Accord do you take the horn from?

@Vman455:
It looks like the rear hatch is also different on the 2012+ model. Would they be able to fit? I have a 2006 V6 Mustang that got rear-ended. I had them replace the rear bumper-cover with the bumper-cover for the 2008-2009 GT500 and it fit almost perfectly. There's like a small I guess indentation that doesn't line up 100% but anyone who didn't own a Mustang and just looked at it would not have been able to tell the difference. Maybe with the Insight it's the same situation?


Oh and I got approved for Lyft. I only did 1 night of Lyft driving so far, but the money was almost twice the Uber money. I don't know how Uber is going to keep drivers with a difference as stark as what I saw in just one night. I know they're developing UAVs but it's going to be a while before they can build a functioning fleet of them.

RedDevil 11-24-2016 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Natalya (Post 527795)
What year Accord do you take the horn from?

Dealer did it, guess they took a new one so it must have been a 2012 or 2013 model.
The Accord has two horns, one low and one high tone. I got the high tone one. The frequency is slightly higher than the Insight horn, but it sounds much richer; like trumpet versus tin can/kazoo.

Somehow the kazoo infuriates other drivers.
I had one change lane towards me on a crash course, blew the kazoo, he jerked back startled, then angrily drove into my lane again.
I was on the brakes already and missed him by an inch.
Then there were the cars and bikes that even though they should have heard it ignored the horn completely apart from the odd middle finger.
Accord horn, problem gone.

My old '85 Civic had the same problem and solution.
Getting my Insight was a feast of Hondanese recognition having driven 4 other makes in between.

MetroMPG 11-25-2016 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vman455 (Post 527718)
Also, if you ever need to replace the rear bumper cover, consider switching to the 2012+ design, which has a sharper cutoff line on the sides. It was good for +1mpg on both EPA city and highway tests.


Interesting factoid! Thanks.

bikeprof 11-25-2016 09:51 PM

Mine, 2010 w 137K n running good ��
CHANGE the CVT oil like NOW !
Weakest like of this Honda IS the tranny, FYI..., do it NOW !
Then 20 ish K miles after that, oil is light green out of bottle, brownish color means old !

I'm getting ~50 MPG's regular, no additional aero mods, but they are 'a coming...

Good luck on you G2 ��

Tires I have on the EX are 185/65/15's

Natalya 12-01-2016 03:36 AM

Two days ago I ordered both CVT filters, a new crush washer for the CVT drain, and a new CVT pan gasket. When all that comes in I'll get the fluid and change everything.

bikeprof 12-01-2016 08:37 AM

? AFTER many inquiries..., the G2 has INSIDE filter for the transmission, do you plan to REMOVE n REPLACE the tranny CVT filter after REMOVING the transmission and opening it ?
That's a lot of work !
In my G2, it took only 3-three quarts and a crush washer.
The "special" tool to remove CVT plug is a 3/8's extension �� (lol)

Natalya 12-01-2016 12:40 PM

You don't have to remove the entire transmission, just the lower pan. Read this:

Cvt filter change & cooler filter change. - Insight Central: Honda Insight Forum

bikeprof 12-01-2016 01:32 PM

�� + �� = ��
THANK YOU so much...!
My eyes are open now, hearsay is bad and because of not wanting to take things apart n break them, I don't investigate at times ��

NOW I WILL do the PROPER JOB thanks to y'all...

Natalya 12-16-2016 03:08 AM

Changed CVT fluid and both filters. I used 3.75 quarts of CVT fluid, but maybe 3.5 would have been enough. FSM says 3.0, but that doesn't include replacing the internal filter. The fluid coming out was close to black, I hope it wasn't too far past its intended service life.

http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/cvt...replace-06.jpg

Also replaced the gasket seen in the photo. Carb cleaner plus a rag, all you need, but it takes a while. I think I spent about an hour and a half working on that.

MobilOne 12-16-2016 03:45 AM

Try brake cleaner from Wmart for $3.97 a spray can. Nice work! How many of us Atlanteans are on this site?

bikeprof 12-16-2016 09:06 PM

Mucho YUCK !

Mine was very dark, not as yours but I do/didnotice the lack of shifting or even more, the initial fluid pump when cold to get the G2 going.
Maybe �� for now but filters will be R & R soon !

samwichse 12-17-2016 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Natalya (Post 529609)
Changed CVT fluid and both filters. I used 3.75 quarts of CVT fluid, but maybe 3.5 would have been enough. FSM says 3.0, but that doesn't include replacing the internal filter. The fluid coming out was close to black, I hope it wasn't too far past its intended service life.

http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/cvt...replace-06.jpg

Also replaced the gasket seen in the photo. Carb cleaner plus a rag, all you need, but it takes a while. I think I spent about an hour and a half working on that.

Yikes! That was way past due.

Natalya 12-17-2016 05:05 PM

Yeah I'm glad I didn't wait for the maintenance minder and just went ahead and did it. When I return to the States I will do the oil and brake fluid as a precaution. I've only put 2000 miles on the car since buying it.

Natalya 01-16-2017 12:15 PM

Cross-posting from IC -- I got some more LEDs for the ZE2. Now if I use the first light switch position it's only using LEDs. (Already replaced the front side-marker and driving-light bulbs.)

http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/rev-led-comparison.jpg

Yesterday I replaced my reverse lights and rear side-marker lights with LEDs. In the above photo the left one has been replaced, while the stock bulb is in the right. It's pretty bright outside, so it's hard to tell, but the LEDs are way brighter than the stock bulb.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/rev-led.jpg

This is one of the new reverse LEDs in the housing, it's a large boxy rectangular thing.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/rear-side-led.jpg

The rear side-marker light is seen here slightly above the rest of the stock LED fixtures. For this I used a red LED.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/led-packages.jpg

These are the packages, I got them off of Amazon.

The new reverse lights are wayyyy brighter than stock. I reversed down the driveway last night and even from the top of the driveway, about 120 feet away, that whole side of the house was illuminated, along with the driveway itself. The red side-markers are also brighter than stock, but not to the same degree.

Natalya 01-28-2017 03:06 AM

http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/scangauge.jpg

ScanGauge II installed above the speedometer. It's a little crooked in this photo, I adjusted it after and it's straight now. I wish I could have gotten its wire to go through the windshield defroster duct, but it didn't work out. I'll have to take apart the entire dash if I want to do that.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/ze2-block.jpg

I also made a coroplast partial radiator block. It blocks a little over 50% of the radiator surface, probably like 60%. It looks beat up because it was previously a lower aero panel on the silver G1, but it wasn't the right size so it got damaged when it was used in that capacity, and I was tired of reattaching it every so often. So I sacrificed it to make this rad block.

I wrote the measurements on it so anyone else with a G2 Insight can easily copy it. It fits really well.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/ze2...-installed.jpg

Like my G1 coroplast rad block it sits in front of the radiator with a tab on the top so you can easily remove it.


And I don't have photos, but I installed a dash cam, it hides in front of the rear view mirror, and is wired through the driver's side A-pillar down to an extra 12v socket I installed hidden from view behind the stock 12V socket.

RedDevil 01-29-2017 04:11 AM

Some concerns.
Does that block the A/C radiator as well? I'd prefer to leave that open.

This will also force the air over the radiator, so the air intake snorkel (would be on the right just outside last pictures frame) will only get more cold air than it does already.
Lukewarm air seems to get best FE at low loads...
But your SC shows '28cIA' so you appear to be doing fine. What am I missing? ;)

FWIW, I've blocked the grill instead of the radiator to good result, it does raise the air intake temp somewhat without having to remove the snorkel and also seems to aid FE a few %, though that is always hard to measure precisely.

I only ran into trouble once, on a very hot (40C on the nose) day gridlocked for hours with my then little boy aboard. Had to run A/C all the time. Saw the air intake temp rise hover round 50C all the time, then suddenly it went up to 70 within a minute.
I was about to get out and rip the grill blocks off, but at the same time the jam dispersed, we got moving for a mile or two at speed and everything went back to normal.

iveyjh 01-29-2017 09:51 AM

Drawbacks // Risks:
Is the money really worth it? That's the main question. With Uber I think (so far from a very limited time doing it) that I might be in the black. Uber doesn't seem to pay as much down here as it did in Canada, but to be fair the US dollar is stronger. However, in my first 3 days of part-time driving I was able to recoup the monthly insurance premium. But honestly it's too early to tell.

Will passengers or all the miles destroy the value of the car? I feel like I got a sweet deal on it, but I have to acknowledge that knowing me I will almost certainly spend some money to make it better. For example, I'll likely get LED brake lights and turn signals, I'll get two more LRR tires, and I want to change the CVT fluid and filters sooner than later. So the total price isn't going to be $6853, it's going to be higher. I am keeping receipts so I can write off stuff on my taxes. For example I had to get a suction cup windshield mount for my phone, so I've got that receipt. I'll also keep them for gas and for the expenses mentioned above. In any case, add everything up, I'll want to exceed that plus what I paid for the car before the car bites the dust. I am optimistic, I think I can do it and then make a profit afterwards.

You will probably do better just claiming mileage on your taxes. IRS allows 53.5 cents per mile. I would do some calcs and estimates if I were you. Keep receipts and compare, I usually come out better with mileage.

S Keith 01-29-2017 11:28 AM

If the vehicle is EVER used for personal use, tax deductions get extremely sticky. Any expenses have to be ratioed with documented personal/business uses. In the vast majority of cases, the mileage deduction is the best option unless you're willing to document every mile on the car.

Also "upgrades" that aren't explicitly required for business use are hard to claim as deductions. Even worse if the car is used for non-business activities of any kind.

IMHO, "destroying the value of the car" isn't relevant if you're using it to generate revenue, particularly if you're going to make enough to pay for the car several times over its revenue-generating lifetime. If you spend X on an asset to generate revenue, and you generate 4X in revenue, the end value of the asset is very small compared to the revenue dollars.

Natalya 01-29-2017 12:03 PM

@RedDevil
I think I took the ScanGauge pic before I made the block. That said, I don't see myself using the block in warmer months. Last year during the summer I took the block out of my G1 and didn't put it back until winter. I have it in there because recently its been taking the car a while to get up to operating temperature. That will of course change as we move towards spring.

Intake air temp is a whole different situation, I'd like to maintain a higher IAT, but like you said that's either going to be a grill block or a WAI. I haven't had time to inspect the air intake to see how feasible a WAI would be on the G2.

@Ridesharing Economics
I have what I consider my "real" job and I do Uber//Lyft on the side. My real job is incredibly variable in terms of hours I can work, due to business volume and even day to day fluctuations. I also don't party as much as other people my age, so I can drive the high demand hours on the weekend. The point of this car was to guarantee a second income in case demand at my "real" job should get low for a long period.

But, to your point, not 100% of the milage is for ridesharing. It's a lot bigger than the G1 so I've used it to carry large stuff and carpooled with my derby team mates and whatnot. That's why I have been keeping a log of the odometer every time I ride share (with dates too) and how far I went while doing that. And I have all my receipts -- gas, phone holder, transmission fluid change stuff (did it myself), etc.

So is it worth it? I guess it depends how long I do this, how long I keep the car, what kind of fuel economy I get out of it, what I sell it for in the end, and the low price I paid for it. Currently my real job has been doing well, so I've been working there a lot, and not doing much ride sharing. But usually around March we slow down, so who knows right? Also this is good for me in other non-financial ways. I can be shy and I don't have great social skills. This exposes me to lots of random people and is helping me interact better with people. That's a positive I didn't expect when I started doing this. Anyway, only time will tell how it works out.

Natalya 01-30-2017 11:00 AM

Yesterday I installed brake drag reduction clips. I did a write-up on Insight Central, but it's really easy and took less than an hour.

These are the ones I got at Amazon.com -- Raybestos H6001

http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/bdrc-03.jpg

Only thing you gotta watch out for is to make sure that you get the little ends of the clips in the right notches. You can see one here at the end of the blue arrow, that's where the ends need to be. It's easy to get the side facing you but harder to tell if the one on the inside the wheel well is facing the right way, so use a mirror or a cell phone to verify proper installation.

Natalya 02-04-2017 01:49 AM

New best tank on this car, 53.34 mpg. Hypermiling to the extreme -- I was going 50 in 65 zones, frequently not even getting up to 35 on a lot of normal roads, hanging out in the right lane, killing the engine then neutral coasting backwards to park in some spaces, trying to not use the HVAC system, etc. It's hard to maintain this driving style over the life of a tank, especially since you're pushing the car farther and farther and it lasts longer. I got to 502.1 miles, and could have gone further, but this represents 10 days in a row of driving like a turtle.

:turtle:

I should look at doing a WAI and an aerodynamic grill block and an underbody aero panel at the very back of the car. LED headlights might also help, but that's mucho denero. I'm glad everything else (except turn signals) is now LEDs because when I'm going slow I'll put the sidemarker lights on as I'm driving so that people see me.

Also, I haven't gotten to rideshare recently. I've been sick for a week, and my real job is really busy. I need to get back to that once I feel better.

bikeprof 02-04-2017 03:32 AM

Wow ! That's a LOT of work you've been doing...
I'm getting ~50-51 MPG all the time, even freeway speeds(usually not over 68 MPH).
Get the latest computer download, this helped my G2 get an extra 4 per gallon !
I'll get info for you maana... ��

Natalya 02-04-2017 05:40 PM

My difficulty in getting good MPG probably also has something to do with my commute. In my G1 I struggle to get the numbers other people cay they can get with ease, and I've modded that car way more than this one. There's a big elevation change and there is only one flat portion of the trip, everything else is hills.

Natalya 02-12-2017 12:13 PM

http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/nerd.jpg

Aww yeah, I'm back at it with the coroplast. I could not believe how cheap it was here in the USA. One 4' x 8' sheet cost only $15 US.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/aeropanel-00.jpg

I used half the sheet at the back of the car. In stock configuration the ZE2 Insight is already pretty well covered at the front. Click here for a higher resolution version of the picture where you can read my measurements in case you want to make your own.


http://www.lady-natalya.info/ZE2/aeropanel-01.jpg

There are two plastic trim clips and two black screws holding on the bumper cover at the back. This panel slides underneath the bumper cover lip and is affixed by those screws. I also put some extra screws, 2 on each side, into the plastic trim behind the wheel wells. You can see those on the left and right. Then up front I put 4 screws into a plastic piece that hangs down. Those ones have black washers, which is why they can be seen in this photo.

There are two cut-outs for the exhaust. The funny diagonal one might not be like totally necessary, but eventually the muffler would have worn a hole there anyway, so it seemed prudent to make a cut-out.

*EDIT*
Oh I almost forgot, yesterday I took out the partial radiator block. It was warm last night and I had the A/C running (because I was driving for Uber and Lyft, as a faithful hypermiler I would NEVER run the A/C in a situation where I could have just used a tank-top + shorts + sandals) and I saw the water temp at 86C and heard the cooling fan come on. But if it gets cold again (because global warming isn't real, right guys?</sarcasm>) then it'll go back in.

iveyjh 02-13-2017 08:13 AM

Awesome work!

Ecky 02-13-2017 09:54 AM

Great looking panel! Almost certainly some of the lowest hanging fruit.

Natalya 02-13-2017 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ecky (Post 534334)
Great looking panel! Almost certainly some of the lowest hanging fruit.

Quite literally if you look at where it is on the car. ;)

Another easy option is going to be that Honda Green oil you've mentioned for the G1. I need to figure out if a G2 can take it because it's coming up on an oil change. My G1 still has Mobil1 0W-20 in it, I should switch it over too but that's probably not going to be for at least another month.

Ecky 02-13-2017 11:58 AM

It should be fine, Honda uses it in all of their hybrids in Europe, and the even thinner NEXT oil in Japan.

RedDevil 02-13-2017 04:56 PM

I had Green Oil in mine, not an issue there.
It will help if it is really cold. You will notice the engine revving lower when cold as it does not have to work as hard.
It makes little difference compared to regular 0W20 in summer.
Don't pay more than $15 extra for the Green Oil (compared to 0W20) as you will not earn it back. It can save you half a tank of gas over its life, tops.

If you were in Anchorage instead of Atlanta it would be a different story :)

mechman01 02-27-2017 02:54 PM

Duuude that looks really good, great job!

MetroMPG 02-27-2017 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Natalya (Post 534256)
Aww yeah, I'm back at it with the coroplast. I could not believe how cheap it was here in the USA. One 4' x 8' sheet cost only $15 US.

Yeah, last I checked it was $20 per at the Home Depot (Ontario).

And any colour you want, as long as it's white!

ThermionicScott 02-27-2017 05:47 PM

I'm kicking myself for not scooping up more of those coroplast campaign signs after the (US) election. :(

Natalya 02-27-2017 07:27 PM

Well my plan was to grab some, but last year neither of the candidates (where I live anyway) was popular enough to have a bunch of yard or intersection signs. I actually can't recall seeing a big coroplast Hillary or Trump sign that would have been suitable.


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