Driving in snow.
 

I have lived in deserts almost exclusively since first obtaining my driver's license twenty-three years ago, and if I was not living in a desert, I probably was not driving. It did snow in Afghanistan. Hey, did you guys know that I drove Army trucks?!

Also the only experience that I have leaving hardball is Afghanistan.

Well, it snows up here. It snowed eight days ago and it is supposed to snow tonight and throughout tomorrow.

Eight of my clients live down dirt roads with hills and I am supposed to see four of them tomorrow. One canceled last week because someone already got stuck.

I have always heard that a smart driver with FWD can maintain traction better than a driver relying on A\4WD, but do you guys think that I will be okay with my old Honda?

I believe that most of you live where it snows, but I do not know how common it is to drive down dirt roads, and it does not seem like a great combination.

I guess that I will be ordering an E-Tool

https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1539674786

What do you guys think?

Thanks! Have a great day!

I see them in walmart in the camping section.
Julius Caesar said something to the effect of "no battle field implement has won more battles than the etool".

With snow it all depends on how deep it is most of all and if it's melting or not.

We've had long discussions about AWD several times before.

It doesn't help with braking or cornering, so it's really only useful for acceleration.

Tire choice or chains make all the difference in the world.

If you run out of ground clearance, you're probably going to get stuck.

I'd probably attempt the trek because adventure is my personality. A shovel is a good idea. I prefer a square-point, or a snow shovel to the Army one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qxF8JazQFpA

Ground clearance is important on roads with deep snow?

Does anyone plow dirt roads anywhere?

I recently bought a square-nosed shovel for another project, so I was planning on keeping that in my car, at least until I bought the E-Tool, but the point about the square nose makes sense. Coleman sells a $10 folding shovel, but the only square folding shovel that I can find is $40 on Etsy, plus $10 to ship.

Who uses Etsy?
https://www.etsy.com/listing/6343470...sr_gallery-1-8

Should I carry a bag of kitty litter or is there something better?

Well, it is 0330, and it is still raining, although it is down to 36°. I took melatonin a couple of hours ago, but still feel completely awake, which is a problem, because I am supposed to be at a client's house in five hours.

I need to cut back on cat videos!

Get a real snow shovel. If it doesn't fit in your trunk, it'll fit in your backseat. Get the e-tool as well, because if you're on a dirt road things may have gotten a little too funky for the foot and a half wide plastic blade.

But for snow removal, use a tool actually designed for it. If you're trying to move a lot of snow with an e-tool, you may be better off walking.

Tread depth. If your tires are more like sleds than cleats, you're not going to have a good time.

My tip is to go for it. Take it easy, give yourself more time, and also to test your traction every once in a while until you get a feel for it. To do this I just mash the gas pedal here and there while going straight. It gives you an idea of the traction you have available. Do not swerve back and forth to test traction. :) But, test the conditions. You'll get used to it quickly enough and it won't even be an issue after that.

Almost no one in maine has a paved drive way, almost everyone has their dirt road or drive way paved.

We have snow shovels, so I will grab one, and my square-nosed shovel.

The first family asked me to reschedule. It looks like we already have four inches of snow and it is still falling.

Getting close to the clearance of your car, no? The problem with a car when it runs out of clearance, it runs out everywhere since it's so flat underneath. You end up high centering on the snow and have to dig the whole thing out.

In a truck, you'll bury the differential, but the rest of the frame won't be resting on top of the snow. Much easier to dig out a differential than an entire car.

I got a portable winch for my car.
Trying to dig out a car is not really practical.

Will a giant cargo strap work (assuming anything is within reach?) If you remember my thread about moving Dad's shed Aerohead said they move things on the ranch by hammering a stake into the ground and pulling on a winch. I bought one, but it broke, although I still have the cargo strap that I bought at least twelve years ago.

Is this the time for a super-sturdy air dam?! :D

My second family recommended that I came an hour later than normal and parked on the street.

I wish that going back to bed resulted in sleep, but I kept thinking that I needed to get the shovels, clean the snow off my car, and scrape the windshield.

There is probably about fifteen minutes' worth of stuff that I am forgetting.

:thumbup:

I do the very same

I also don't follow "common" advice to drive in a higher gear to avoid spinning.
It makes you drive faster, not safer, and alienates you from road conditions.

I run a low gear, that way, any reduction in traction, any excess power you try to put down on the road, will be noticed right away, rather than in the next bend.

That, and it brakes far better.
Engine braking is key in snow !

People who say AWD isn't that big a plus in the snow don't seem to understand that.

Good tires and keep speed reasonable. Nokian WRG2-4s on all my cars. AWD is a nice plus and usually comes with a couple more inches of clearance.

New electronics driving aids work pretty sweet too.

I almost went off a cliff due to engine braking in my 4x4 truck causing the backend to step out. I was in drive too, so the engine braking was very slight. Control was regained (barely in time) by shifting to neutral at the last moment and taking the longest steering path around the corner.

I prefer to do my braking with the brakes, not with the engine. It's much more controlled that way.

AWD allows you to get into more trouble, but doesn't help very much to avoid trouble. Basically, it allows you to use more aggressive throttle without losing traction, which isn't very valuable when you are running tires appropriate for the conditions (snow rated tires) or chains.

I spent 2 hrs and then 3 hrs digging out my Subaru once. Didn't expect deep snow in May on an unplowed road and high centered. After 2 short hours of digging out, I was able to reverse back down the road and again high centered even worse than before. 3 hours of digging with my bare hands and the plastic base of a camping propane bottle, in a tee shirt and jeans. Also had a screw jack that I used to put 1 set of chains on various tires about a couple dozen times.

Sharpen that up and you'd have a grass whip/zombie protection.

What do I need to know about chains?
 

Most of the snow has melted, even in the yard, but it will be back!

Also, what kind of kitty litter is best? :)

Get yerself a set of Z-style cable chains. I bought a set for the Prius used from CL for $20. Only difficulty is the knuckleheads trying to sell 'em never list what size they are. I use an app called OfferUp now that CL is falling out of favor.

https://www.vulcantire.com/graphics/surgripz.jpg

I must be paranoid, I carry chains year round in my Saturn and two sets in my truck. I drive my car if it will get out of the driveway, my driveway is the worst I will encounter. If there is too much snow for my car I hub up and take my truck. With BFG MTs and my Diesel I say bring it! Ready for winter all year long.

These are the highest-rated Z-chains for my Accord, $66.43 and rated 3.9/5: Security Chain Company SZ129 Super Z6

Dirt roads are actually better than pavement in the snow, IMHO, as long as the snow's not deep enough that you're playing snowplow - in which case you have problems on either dirt or pavement. That's because of the rough dirt underneath.

WRT 4WD, where it really matters is going up hills, and especially starting on hills. On the level it's perhaps a little help in deep snow. Downhill it just leads to overconfidence...

IMHO again, the thing to really worry about is not snow, but black ice. With snow you may have problems*, but you KNOW there's a problem. Black ice will take you by surprise.


*Carry a good sleeping bag & some energy bars or trail mix if you're going anywhere off well-travelled roads.

Negative reviews are probably from people that don't know how to install the chains, use them improperly, or had unrealistic expectations of what they were for.

I've put various types of chains on and off probably a hundred times. The only style I've had problems with are the auto-tensioning type that pull the excess cable into a reel. They're also the easiest to put on and perform very well when they are working, so I expect they are rated very highly.

Someone complained his rusted after the first use, but he did not say that he rinsed it off and sprayed it with oil.

Steel + water + salt = rust?!

I'm shocked! Shocked!

Well, not that shocked.

Some people complained that they could not properly tighten it, although I do not know if they faulted the design. The one that I remembered said "Avoid this if you are old and weak."

Well, now I need to prove to myself that I can put it on properly!

In unrelated news, I am going to make sure that I have my bike pump in the car!

I've seen your photo. Rubber bands won't pose a problem to you.

I've seen your photo. Rubber bands won't pose a problem to you.

Old and weak people should have dedicated winter tires, installed by someone else.

I do not need winter tires as long as I can use chains? If the blacktop is paved, but the dirt roads aren't, should I don my chainmail when I leave the main road, and doff it before returning to the asphalt?

Use the chains when you need the traction, and keep 'em off when you don't. I don't have snow tires for the Prius because I carry Z chains in the winter. No sense buying snow tires when there are very few snowy/icy days here in the valley.

You do not want to run your chains on bare pavement very far. It is easier to install your chains before the snow gets deep. Make sure you are in a safe spot when you stop to chain up.

I realize topography is different, but nobody uses chains here and very very few have studded tires. You're over thinking it, drive reasonably and you'll be fine.

Snow isn't really a problem, hard packed snow and ice is what makes it difficult.

With all this global warming we have been having you better get used to it.

Well, that kind of depends on just how much snow you have :-)

No, not unless the snow is packed.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1539843851

Pushing snow uphill with chains. When you can barely open your door due to the depth of snow, it's too deep.

Something natural if you're dumping it on the ground. I'd use sand if I was going to carry some type of traction aid. I've never carried anything like that, but I have used floor mats for traction. It works, but they'll never be the same again!

I tried my floor mats when I got my Subaru stuck, but I think that I was too cold to work effectively. I sure hope that I had a coat with me, but probably not gloves, and I might have been there until the snow melted had someone not stopped to help me.

I was proud of how well I cleaned my floormats before I sold the car. I am not sure what my ex had done to them, but they were dark!

They weren't supposed to be!

I don't think winter tires make much of a difference in deep snow. You simply need chains then.

They do make an enormous difference when the road is covered with a thin layer of snow, just below freezing. Fresh winter tires have almost as much grip on that as on dry tarmac, summer or all season tires behave like they are on ice.

I found a picture of my floor mats! (Yay?)
 

This is only the before picture, but with the exception of one spot, all four floormats looked brand-new afterward. I do not know if I still have a picture of the result of hours of cleaning, just the what you can see of them when I took pictures of the car before I sold it.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/attachme...1&d=1539855770

But there you've got a plowed road on a sunny day without much wind. Try the same place when it's snowing and the wind is blowing... well, I've never measured it right where that picture was taken, but at the weather station on a peak about a mile away, it usually tops 100 mph during a storm. Interesting driving, as you often can't even see the road, you have to look out the passenger window at the snow bank.

Actually, I shared that because, with thirty feet of snow, it was entirely possible that normal vehicles would have high-centered on snow at some point.