Higher than expected for a Jeep
 

OK, this last fill showed me 21.67. Way better than I imagined. So I am not sure if this is factual or an anomoly. I altered my habits with brake and throttle. Mostly highway and 2 to 4 people. When in the city, chose freeway over streets where I could.

So I have a conundrum. I believe I have an answer for it. DPoV and others, might remember I wondered how to deal with offroading mileage. Since next weekend is going to have an all day adventure. That will kill my average. I'm thinking of throwing out those fill ups. Or better, is there a way to have a second mileage log for the offroad stuff?

So, I got a better return for my troubles this week. Have I reached the limits? Was this a fluke? DPoV, any ideas?

oh it's possible alright. i pulled almost 23 and a half last tank. No, I don't think you've reached the limits. I thought I did when I couldn't get past 21, but then i got 22, then 23, my short term goal is 25, which I hope to reach. It wasn't a fluke. you definitely did well. Keep up the good work! shortest road doesn't mean the most efficient. I'll take the roads that are longer, but don't have stop signs on them. or I'll take the ones with street lights instead of stop signs. I've took down one the off-roading adventures and i got like 18. I don't know. Admins, would it be possible to have a seperate one if your vehicle type is "truck" or "other"?

It's the warm weather, meng, :)

Congrats.

No, I thought that he lived in a hot climate? or was that another Jeeper? I can't recall. less use of brakes and throttle have yielded me some of the way I've gotten over 23. ever since I've tried new techniques and the weather getting nicer it's been going up.

Its going to get hot here. At least I don't live near Death Valley like I used to. Last week temps were near 80 on Monday, and below freezing again Thursday. We had rain and snow Tuesday and Wednesday. Might get some again tonight and tomorrow.

At least here, when the sun goes down, so does the temp in the late summer. When I lived in the Mojave desert in Cali the temps would remain high well after midnight. Now I live in Utah near Salt Lake City, and work and recreate in the West Desert/Great Salt Lake Desert. Looking forward soon to a trip on the old Pony Express route and branching out to other interesting locations too. Maybe Moab next fall.

Tires are at 32 psi, anything higher and I cannot stand the ride. I am still going speed limit and sometimes 5 over. Just rethinking how I accelerate and brake. I am sure, if I didn't have that mountain pass on my commute, the mileage would be a little higher. Sorry, but I haven't wrapped my mind around going too much slower than everyone else yet. I use cruise in mostly flat terrain, but hills I take over as the cruise kicks it down too soon. I watch the MPG gauge in the overhead console knowing it is off a bit (sometimes high sometimes low...), as it does give me an indication if I am wasting gas or doing OK. At least it is better feedback than waiting till the pump. My Jeep is too old for the ScanGauge. Even so, this Jeep isn't doing too bad for 150,000+ miles on the clock and having no idea how the previous owners took care of it.

I am going to see about using an old truck bedliner to help smooth the bottom. Nobody wants the thing and I can't keep it around, so I'm slicing it up soon. I think I will fit it in with a modification of my transmission crossmember and tucking the transfer case skidplate up a bit. Gives me more clearance and smoother belly. And as mentioned before, I'm going to start building some bumpers (as soon as the Ranger project is complete), so I can get rid of that plastic rear bumper that I see as a bit of an underbody flow parachute. Again, protection and aero assist.

I might have to get rid of the Jeep soon. gas is getting so high, that it'll cost 80-90 bucks to fill-er up. and I can't deal with that. even while beating the EPA. As for the ride It really doesn't matter to me, cause the roads are so crappy, (some are cobblestone with bricks jutting up in the air) that no matter what the PSI it feels like your driving over small logs and large rocks. so I run 37psi.

i know what you mean DPoV, i just filled up and it cost me $63.51. anyhow, i dont know about omiting the offroad mileage, maybe just not log the tank? i personally dont worry about how the difference is reflected, i just put in the notes that that tank included an offroad excursion.
maybe you could make a vehicle profile for tanks which include offroad trips. an option on how to do it would be to fill your tank right before you go offroad, that way you would have the real mileage for a smaller fill and then fill up right after getting off the trail, and use that info for an offroad fuel mileage log.

just a thought, it would be interesting to see how it compares on road with changed driving techniques compared to off road driving styles

-john

In the garage they have a trip log function where you can log each off road tank.

I'll see about the different loggings. For extended offroad excursions I always fill before I go. And carry a 5 gallon can sometimes too. But I'll see about showing mileage for such trips.

Very few FE methods transfer to offroading. Well, shutting down for extended times waiting on others is a great way to save fuel.

DPoV, I hear ya on the cost of filling a 23 gallon tank. Believe me, getting the Ranger finished soon makes me happy, so I can get my Neon back! Just because, I rarely go below 1/2 tank if I can help it. That way topping off the tank isn't so painful. I am also looking forward to another offroad project that should be a little better on fuel than the ZJ...

well last time i put gas in my tank it was 1/8th below half, and it cost me $50 :EEK!: That's where I got the 80 to 90 from. Good news for the neon!

As for the trip log. will that count towards your 90 day average and lifetime? or is it separate?

I'd like to make it separate. Not going wheeling this weekend. Gotta work. Busy time of the year out here.

I have been driving a ZJ since 1998, and I have had all three engines (4.0, 5.2, 5.9). I have kept records of every fill-up since I was 17, and my yearly average is almost always 21.4. It varied very little whether I was while living in Midtown Manhattan (and the associated traffic), driving like a cabbie, or living in the suburbs and driving like a granny. It always evened out in the end. Plus, in 2000 I stopped towing and lowered my current ZJ, and put smaller tires on for the sake of handling. It helped me gain .2mpg. I figured out my break even ROI to be 11 years. Only 3 to go!

An engineering friend of mine got me interested in areodynamics and pointed me here, albeit I am far more interested in improving the handling of my cars on the highway than mpg, and since the ZJ is relegated to 95% highway (about 7k a year) duty I figure one will help the other.

finally! a guy with a ZJ that has OBDII!!!! scan gauge anyone? I kinda wanna take my mudding mileage off and transfer it. that 18mpg took down my average, now that I'm getting close to 24mpg's

No scan gauge here, I use the old pencil and paper. I am not seriously considering one either, since I was somewhat forced to sell my car when we moved (we only have/can afford two spots - one for me, one for the mrs.) and while I still do need 4wd (the plows do everything in their power to bury you in), I am questioning if it is worth maintaining a 12 year old truck for the two weeks a year I truly need it. Turning your own wrenches sucks when it is 8* and you are working on 1st ave to replace a cracked header before work.

I wouldn't sweat that 18mpg, my obdI ZJ never got much better than that, even at 170k. The 5.2 never saw above 14mpg even on a trip from NYC to NC, and I bought it brand new. The 5.9 I bought as a beater and got low 18's in my four trips to and from FL.

So what can I do to improve handling? Make an underbelly tray or a front air dam that goes straight down?

that'd moreover improve your aero, not as much handleing. suspension parts are the parts that are with handling, as well as tires. worn suspension parts, mostly shocks are the parts that make your handling go bad.

That is a shame. I am currently running Hotchkiss springs (about 1" drop, much stiffer) Addco front and rear swaybars, Edelbrock and Bilstein shocks and a killer set of Nokian tires in a 235/60/16 flavor - hands down the best tires I have ever used. The rest is stock since it sits with 79k on the clock.

Back to the drawing board, or dealership.

There is a thread on NAXJA.org about using short coilovers and 4 links front and rear on a Cherokee. I'll see if I can find that. But it is a setup strictly for lowering and handling...

I'd still try a belly pan though. since your commute is mainly highway, that slightly better aero could mean 2-3 mpg's better. and do a grille block over the intake, so you can cause the intake to run hotter, making the engine need more o2, you now get less restriction because you open the throttle plate more, and reduce pumping loss at the throttle plate. It shouldn't use more gas even though your on the throttle just a little more, because the air/fuel ratio really isn't an air/fuel ratio, but an 02/fuel ratio. so you get better aero and reduced restriction.

Maybe handling isn't the best term, I am looking for better highway stability and driveability. I know it is a truck, but it tends to dart around easily. I have had it for almost nine years so I am quite used to it, but my wife has a hard time of it compared to her car.

My 4.0 isn't stock, I have the 99+ XJ intake manifold (don't bother), Thorley header, cat back from a 5.9, 62mm throttle body and a FIPK. This raised my overall mpg from 18.7 stock to 21.4 I have now (averaged over the last 1000 miles). I tried a warm air intake by moving my air filter directly next to the header during winter, over 6 tanks (about 4½ months) and my mileage went down to 18.7mpg, and in mid January I switched back - it immediately went back up to 22.6 and regressed towards the mean of 21.5mpg now.

A full belly pan/air dam is in my future. Finding materials isn't easy. Finding time is harder. Much harder.

Woohoo! 21.8 last fill up! So, I might just be doing something right. At this rate, I might be a little upset if I don't see a gain...

competition eh? well I'll have to go all out. I'm using 10% ethanol.. and it's not worth the 10 cents a gallon off. It sucks big monkey turds. I'm dropping from 23-24 to 21ish on this tank I'm sure of it.

Don't sweat competition... I'm sure my mileage won't go too much higher. I haul plenty of extra weight you probably aren't carrying. And people. Besides, I will be rolling in the Neon for part of the summer too.

Exactly. Unless I have to run some very quick errands, which is rare, the jeep doesn't roll unless me, my wife, my friend and his wife and all of our hockey equipment are inside. This weekend I am hauling a set of five tires and rims (roughly 275lbs) upstate NY for my cousin. The trip back will be the first trip I have made empty in nearly two years.

Due to where I work and recreate, in the desert, I carry anywhere from 3 to 5 extra gallons of water, first aid kit, tools, floor jack (yes a 2 ton rolling jack), blankets and such. Not as much as a first responder, but in the desert it can be a while before help arrives. And I can't imagine NOT carrying a spare tire. I know that many of you remove the spare and count on a can of fix-a-flat, plugs and a cellphone. Even on my commute I'm often not in cell range... I know the weight hurts mileage, but the piece of mind is worth it.

And as mentioned, the commute is carpooling so I have 2 to 3 other people with me, and more often than not I don't go into the city by myself. I live in a growing small town 30 minutes from Salt Lake City, and work 50 miles west of where I live.

I find it interesting that there are so many Jeeps in general, but also so many Grand Cherokees here now. I think the owner of the site is getting his wishes for Jeep challenges...

I carry things often with me too. I always have 2 people in the jeep, while the back seats usually have band equipment. I'm in a band, and we've been having some shows lately. We played a show this weekend, and we're playing another in may, then one about a week and a half later in june, then more after that. I'm the bass player, so I usually have a 15" stack amp and head (about the weight of a person) 2 guitars, a bass guitar, boss guitar pedals, and plenty of guitar cords.

And since I am in a band, and play the bass, it's pretty natural that I'd have a sound system set up as well. so I'm carrying 2 12" subs, and a big dual vented enclosure, which weight about as much as a typical female, all powered by 2400 watts of peak power. It gets loud, and mimics a concert :D which is what I like!

Oh, I hate it when my brother wants a ride a few blocks down the street. I always walk if it's within the village, but I don't know what's up with him. then he complains and then I have to take him and use gas anyway :mad:

I like a little competition though. Gives me better mpg's in the end anyway, and same to you guys. :thumbup:

My very first car I bought 12 years ago and I still have it. Its my 1988 Jeep Cherokee XJ. I LOVE my jeep I would not give it up for ANYTHING. Even a pure BEV would be a hard decision and I would kill for a BEV. I have not driven my jeep in over 5 years. I wore the engine out (1.5 quarts of MUDD in the crank while wheeling did not help)

I have 452,000 or so miles on my baby. 31" tires Full Skids plates Rancho 9000's all around with incab control and a 4" suspension lift. 31" is the largest I could go without a higher lift and drive line mods AND the largest I could go and still use my factory rims which I refuse to let go (the 5 thick spoke alums with the JEEP logo engraved in them. LOVE those rims :-) So I actually have some pretty skinny 31's at 12.5inches.

A few years ago I bought another Jeep an 88 Wagoneer (cherokee with 4 lights and woody stickers) I spent a little money on it and made it a donor for my baby.

I FINALLY this past week finished that process. My baby now has a new heart with only 119,000 miles on the ticker (if you have used 4.0 I6's you know thats a virtually virgin engine) I replaced and redid everything short of actually getting to the pistons. Purrs like kitten. I will have her on the road withing 1-2 weeks.

Now I have a big issue with Ethanol. I lost 14.5% of my economy in my club wagon and nearly 30% of my economy in my Voyager and I can directly connect these to ETHANOL.

I really hate ethanol. My baby has never had ethanol. I am praying it does not get hit so bad. I was averaging 24mpg in my Cherokee. (unless I went upstate to the mountains then the larger tires KILLED my mpg :-)

One time on the highway I managed 25.4mpg !! on an 88 Cherokee with 31" tires lift full skids Spare on the roof 3 people and gear!! (we literally went from gas station to onramp to next gas station 410 miles away. I did not trust the gas gauge so at 400 miles on the odo I stopped for gas. Was surprised there was much of anything left in the tank!!

I did the same thing on the way home. 25.3mpg!

I have never duplicated THAT run again :-) hehe

but averaging 24mpg in the summer and 22mpg in the winter was easy.

with ethanol I doubt I will ever hit those numbers again sadly (as it is with some technique and modding maybe)

I love my cherokee. I had someone offer me $500 for her onces. I pointed out the window and said see those 4 tires.? your $500 could not buy 3 of them. GO AWAY :-) hehe

Keep it up jeepers! We can be greener and ecomod too !! and remember while its BAD for aero NO clean jeep is a happy jeep :-)

Very interesting. While I share many sentiments, I hate to crawl under and work on a dirty Jeep. On the trail there is no choice. But I try to clean mine now and again. Not so much mud here though. Your 31s, whats the sidewall say? Most are 31x10.5, I'm looking at some 31x9.5s, though, they are an extremely aggressive tire, the price isn't too bad. They are Interco SSL Radials @ about $130/tire.

Higher levels of Ethanol haven't made it here yet. And E85 stations are few and far between.

An interesting thought here though... Has anyone taken into account altitude in there MPG calcs?

Hmmm maybe they are 10.5's I just remember that the place said they were the skinniest the skinniest 31's they had at the time and were Just skinny enough to fit the stock rims (keeping the stock rims was a requirement for me) When I see the jeep tommorrow I will try to remember to write down the numbers. Been a long time :-)

And when its time to work on the jeep sorry baby out comes the hose :-)

Here we have the 10% ethanol 90% gasoline which for me at least has been disastrous. IT must be relatively unique to me or something as I imagine more people would complain if they lost 30% of there economy or are people just that not caring?

On my van I was able to show conclusively the 14.5% drop in economy. At the time when I noticed this massive drop and thought something was wrong I noticed the Ethanol notices. SO I went to a pump WITHOUT the stickers and asked. They confirmed they were not on ethanol yet. So I filled up there. by the next fill up my mpg jumped RIGHT back to where it was before.

Alas they eventually all went to ethanol addition of 10% and almost instantly my economy dropped 14.5% again. I did the math. 10% ethanol means 10% less foreign oil but a 14.5% decrease in economy means I am actually now buying 4 % MORE foreign oil. Go Figure and its sucking up our water and raising the cost of grain. Joy. :-(

Hmm I do travel to the mountains now and then but there is no way I can see to separate the effect of altitude from the effect of the mountainous terrain itself :-)

What size tank does the cherokee have? I usually go atleast 400 miles, and only use about 19 gallons. the tank is a 23 gallon tank, so I know I can go about 500 miles on a tank.

Ethanol does suck. I dropped back down to 21mpg's again from using it. back to regular :thumbup:

Does anyone know where I can get new o-ring seals for my 90 degree elbow for my fuel filter? And for a power steering pump, should I get one from a donor 242?

I have the cherokee (the small one NOT the grand cherokee IE the XJ is what I have)

My tank is 20 gallons alas around here its not optional THEY ALL have 10% ethanol mixed with the gasoline :-( I would gladly pay 30+cents more for regular gasoline. I would still pay less money than I am not with this ethanol crap :-(

I know that you drive an XJ, I was wondering if the tank size was the same as the ZJ.

Luckily we have a choice here, although it is starting to get more ethanol at gas stations :(

"My tank is 20 gallons alas around here its not optional THEY" :-) hehe

Chris Taylor