Metal shaping technique showcase/discussion for ecomodders
 

A thread for metal shaping techniques: showcasing, discussion, and teaching/learning.

All metals, all reasonably DIY friendly tools and supplies for making or modding cars, bikes, motorcycles, and more.

Post whatever shaping work you have done or that you admire. Also books, videos, websites...

... just keep in mind that this is the DIY subforum ... whatever seems to speak to an ecomodding interest in DIY metal shaping belongs here, I figure.

Here is one to start. I love his discussion of making compound curves. I love the simplicty of his basic tool set.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=L7B7lCDq7cY

I have zero metalshaping experience. And I am going to include aluminum composite sheet shaping as "metal shaping," even though it is definitely cheating.

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I plan on taking a class or two after the 1st of the new year.

https://www.proshaper.com/coachbuild...aping-classes/


He’s a real Metal worker and runs a first class operation.

Check out some of his videos.



:turtle:

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Cool. Will make a point of watching. When you do his class, I hope you'll post about it.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-f...1-100-0866.jpg

For the record here is my Polymetal picture from 2015. Sheared, rolled and braked with a hand operated bench brake with an 18" lever arm. I'd like to see 5ft rollers made from old water heater tanks to roll full sheets.

Chris Runge is on that other level. A practical project might be an EMPI Imp in stainless steel.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-f...52-0000000.jpg

[Tesla-powered?] Cyber Dune Buggy

edit:
For comparison, a 2-door Type 181 in aluminum.

https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-f...-not-thing.jpg

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incremental_sheet_forming

I can imagine a situation where you put a strip of metal in a U-shaped buck and then pass a nylon roller back and forth incrementally conforming a cycle fender. The edges that were held in the form would be trimmed, else bead rolled and wire-wrapped in a separate operation.

Love how the spare tire is recessed into the hood.

incrementally
 

Some metals begin fully annealed and work-hardens during forming. In order not to tear the metal, it may require re-annealing as you draw it deeper and deeper towards the finished product.
Around a decade ago, Chrysler mentioned that some of their body panels required six separate stamping operations, six sets of stamping dies, plus the multi-thousand-ton presses to force the sheetmetal to the depth of the final shape.

All metal work hardens when forming, tearing is caused by thinning below the tensile strength needed during the forming or granular formation. Annealing stops the granularity and makes the metal more plastic again.

At McStarlite, we baked our aluminum at 350 between passes in the press which should have been an ageing temp but it worked.

Stamp forming is kinda violent and doesn't allow the metal to flow thicker which is why there are ripples along the flanves. Tonnage is just the power required to move that metal. On a couple of square ft you can get to 100 tons required really fast.

I am going to try and make another upper grill block for the mercury. I cut a section out of a water heater skin and just wanted to attempt to make the right curve that I wanted. I only used the shrinker (blue in background of last picture). I did use the stretcher (yellow one on right) to flatten out the hood side a little bit because I over shrunk it. I need to make the flange not so thick. It made it difficult to get the metal to move. My vise is a little high too. I ended up using a stool :D so I could get more leverage on the shrinker.

Pics and captions:
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0
I just cut out a small section of a water heater skin. This piece is probably about 3"x10"

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0
I flattened the piece back out some more and put it in the vice with a 1" piece of square tubing and used a carpenter's hammer to bend it over to a 90

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0
And finally the end product. You can see the cut out piece on the right, that is the bumper side. The left end of the piece is towards the hood. Most of the curve is towards the bumper end. I wanted it to be kind of flat as it meets the hood. It lines up with the hood curve a little better that way.

The longer version of this post can be seen here:
https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthre...tml#post632893

The rest of the pictures are on my camera. I will upload them when it is completely finished. Here is my first attempt (and it looks like only) at the grill block. Again cut out of a water heater skin. I bent a 1/2" flange on the 2 short sides of a 27.5"x10.5" piece. Then I shrunk the bumper side. I didn't shrink anything on the upper side. It didn't put a curve all the way across the panel though so I got out the english wheel and rolled it across the 2 shrunk sections to roll it over. That worked. Once I had that pretty well lined up I test fit it, but couldn't close the hood to check it. I marked a line and cut out a notch so that the hook could grab the latch and shut. I had to stretch the 2 sides back out a little bit as I had over-shrunk it. Now the short sides touched the hood, but there was a gap in the middle because the hood has a curve to it. At first I tried english wheeling the middle 1/3 section to push it out and curve it. It seemed to help but wasn't enough. I trimmed the top of it so that it was in line with the notch I had made earlier. Then I used the shrinker on the middle 1/3, a little heavier in the dead center though. Once I finished that and test fit it again it was all pretty well lined up. There was still a little gap, but because of how it is screwed into the bumper I could just pull up a little bit and it filled the gap well. I then used a box to make some endplate template. Unfortunately the bumper is cracked and broken a little on top so I had to modify that side a little more to get it to fit well. At this point I was thinking about trying to bead roll the mercury logo onto it so it wasn't so plain looking. I didn't want to mess up all that work so I got another piece of metal, attempted to hand draw the logo and then bead roll it. I don't think it turned out very well. I will definitely try again though. I stopped there as I had been messing with it for awhile and the sun was starting to set.

I want to strip the panel down and paint it once it is finished. I need to see if I can remove/level the marks from the wheel though. They aren't very deep though so if I lay the primer on a little thick it will probably mask it pretty well. I am planning on welding the end pieces on (of course before paint), backup attachment is pop rivets. This was kind of an introduction to it before I attempt to start patching rust holes in the car.

TLDR:
I did record the process so a video version of that description should be available once I finish it completely.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0
https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pw...-no?authuser=0

Nice tools. I'm sure each one will get better. Else just paint it black.

In the sheet metal trade, we just made stuff thicker and used 120 grit sanding disks to grind off the high spots, but went looking and added bunches of filler to the low spots, sometimes making the part with filler everywhere. Straight bars with sandpaper stuck on for making stuff flatter. You may be able to do the same with your existing part if you can tolerate the new thinness which would be not much thinner (maybe .005 thinner).

Why not use the existing stick on emblem?

Mine didn't have an adhesive emblem, it was painted/printed onto the grill. But I could just buy one. I was thinking about trying to paint one on too.

I bought a lathe! :D It's a 9" south bend ~24 inch center to center (or how long of a piece you can turn). It needs a belt so I still haven't used it yet, but I did get it out of the van and into the garage. I had to separate the lathe from the table to fit the table in the van. I didn't take any pictures of getting the lathe out of the van because I did it after work one night at 2am. It's a little rough, but hopefully with a little TLC it will clean up well and work better than it looks.

It came with the tailstock, another chuck (both 3 jaw though), a live center, some brazed carbide cutting tools, and a taper attachment. I think one of the first things I am going to do after getting it going is a quick change tool post. So much more convenient than the old style tool holder on it.

I only have 2 "immediate" uses for it. When I try to combine the axle shafts for my metro/mercury swap and I can make dies for the bead roller instead of having to search and buy a set I can just turn some down.


https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-m...1-dsc00961.jpg
https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-m...2-dsc00962.jpg
https://ecomodder.com/forum/member-m...4-dsc00965.jpg

This is an artform that I really have a lot of appreciation for.
If I didn't live in an apartment and had a garage, I'd be doing it already.

I didn't watch the video ( perhaps later, but for now it is not something I am even able to do because of lack of tools and garage space. )

So this may have been covered in the video, but if not, here are some general questions :

What would be the cost to do something such as a Honda Civic fender in normal guage steel ?

And aluminum ?

I know it varies, but a ballpark figure on the cheapest it could cost ? ( no free materials that is )

I'm assuming that when creating something such as a fender, you start with a wood "buck" that looks much like the cardboard inner structure Darin used on his Insight tail.
I assume you wack the metal till it roughly "drapes " around to shape.
You then continue pounding to get the metal shaped even closer to your buck.

But then here is the part I'm confused about : how does one get the metal to become perfectly smooth and straight without the use of body filler ?

I remember paint and body class in high school. It really surprised me how precise you have to be to get a smooth panel .

I am just getting into it myself and haven't watched the video either, so I don't know if I have the correct answer (plus there are usually more than one way to skin a cat).

If you mean material cost and assuming no mistakes were made I think you could get a big enough sheet of steel (at least from my local steel shop) for $10. No idea on aluminum, though I know the $ per the lb cut offs sold at the same shop are like 3x as much as steel.

I've never heard of the method you describe, though it certainly sounds like it has merit. The way I've seen it done is by using a teardrop mallet and a sandbag (not a literal sandbag, but pretty close) beat the panel into roughly the shape you want. Then english wheel the panel to make it smooth and finish the curvature. You could also just skip the hammer and go straight for the wheel, but it takes a lot longer.

Like I said, I am still a newb to this so this may not be a good way to do that.

I started cleaning up the lathe, they had sprayed oil on it before they set it outside. It only sat out, under a tarp, for a few days. The compound seemed stuck. I loosened the gibbs adjustment and it came free. I tightened it back down until I couldn't feel any play. I need to get a dial indicator for it I suppose. I was messing with the gear change mechanism and noticed the spindle would stop when it was in a certain position. Turns out there is a broken tooth on one of the gears. I went looking for a replacement and found an easy repair I might try. Now I just need to figure out how to remove the gear.
:turtle:

https://i.imgur.com/TPtJmSR.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/iF6LrZ7.jpg

I'm no expert but from years of reading magazines and Internet — Your both right!

If you follow Chris Runge, Ron Covell or Jesse James compound curves start by disrupting and then smoothing a flat sheet. You can expand metal with a mallet and a wooden stump and shrink it with an edge crimper. Once it's in rough shape English wheel, hammer and dolly or planishing hammer.

Eventually it's down to the technique in paintless dent removal — glancing light on a water sheet and a nylon pecking hammer.