Time for New Hot Water Heater
 

Looking at Solar collector + Tankless electric (no natural gas and super high propane prices here ($3.75 a gallon)

Haven't decided on either just yet, but looking for opinions + deals.

Looing at Bosch AE125 for heater (not sure yet) , and whatever I can get cheap for solar. (South Louisiana is hot a lot of the time).

FYI My ground water is currently 68 degrease.

Any and all info is highly appreciated.

Why tankless? You need to store that solar energy...

Any chance of frost there? If so maybe a drainback system to an electric tank (Marathon)? The electric element would be backup.

How many people and how many gallons a day do you use?

You should try and get F-charts.

Here's a setup that Common Ground has here in New Orleans. They use garden hose and (painted?) black food grade barrels as a collector:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2205/...1c6a50.jpg?v=0

As far as tankless goes, I'm assuming you're using that as a backup and the collectors as a preheat. The problem that I've heard tankless heaters have is that parts and people who can do repairs are both hard to find and expensive.

Good luck with the project :thumbup:

For solar you need to know what your solar window is like where you live, this basicly brakes down to, how many sun hours per day do you average each month of the year, then you subtract your shading, add your BTU's needed of hot water, and you end up with a very good idea on what size of a solar hot water collector you are going to need to keep you happy.
I haven't spent enough time in your part of the country to know who you might have for consutants or installers, but expearince seems to show that unless you spend ALOT of time learning this stuff your self, you are going to spend more money over sizing your system or going back and adding on or fixing mistakes then you would have spent hiring a consultant to spend a few hours look at your land and needs and giving their recomendations on how to make it work so well that it will not only blow your mind but make everyone else who sees it want to fallow in your foot steps.

Have you looked into if its worth it in our neck of the woods (WI) Ryland?

I'm planning on purchasing a house in the next year or so and looking into a lot of this kinda stuff. Loved the outdoor chilled fridge posted last week or so.

You could say I've looked in to it, I've been part of installing 4 differnt solar hot water systems and they work great! I've also taken steps tward getting my solar site assesser certification, and grew up with solar electric, and installed correctly, and in the sun, these systems work great.
most of the systems I've worked on were used for space heating as well, heating domestic hot water first, then heating the floor, so even on a compleatly overcast day the chance of it collecting enough heat to heat your domestic hot water without your instant hot water heater coming on was really good, add to that a well insulated storage tank, and you still have 100+F hot water in the morning.

Hi DREMD,

Here's a good site for this type of info.
http://www.builditsolar.com/
Hope it helps.
JJ

Been trying to post with no luck for 24 hours err.

Solar tank would be separate from tankless water heater. A tanked water heater would perform similarly because the thermostat would trip when pumping water in.

2 people + Guest (every month or so 3~4 extra people)
Also much of the time (25%) there is nobody there.
So what we have is a large variation in use, hence the Tankless.

Unsure of total gallons per day (depends heavily on occupancy, other factors)

http://www.boschhotwater.com/StartPa...7/Default.aspx <- Totally open to other options.

We are on a ground water well with poor flow (4gpm MAX, more like 3gpm) so total flow on a tankless isn't a huge deal.

Just scored a FREE! 40 gallon solar hot water system.
I didn't get a real good description, but
Built in 70's
Never installed/ used
2 layers of "space age" glass
40 gallon tank underneath
4 feet x 5 feet
And free if I pick it up next week in Baton Rouge (60 miles each way)


Sweet!

Alright, Been super busy lately, but I picked up the Water heater today :-)
It is a passive type, Reflector box with tank in center, 1 pane of glass is there, 1 missing.

Tested for leaks, None found

Pressure washed

Wire brushed-> Cold Galv. -> Rustoleum BBQ pit black On tank

Cleaned up reflector as best I could and determined that it was hopeless, pealed it up and replaced with the shiniest Peal and Seal that Lowes had (looks good 2 me).

Trying to get a sheet of glass large enough to cover the existing pane tomorrow (essentially double pane with spacer).

Existing layer of glass looks slightly franell.

Box has a spec plate, I'll post up more details soon.

Details and pics. :)

see attachment

got the heater up on the roof, mounted(adjustable angle), partially plumbedfilled with water from hose last night. decided to drain a bit to see how hot the water temp was; 160 deg fareheight ! note i only have 1 pane of glass at the moment, and today is mostly cloudy/ overcast. that being said, does anybody know where to get a deal on an anti-scald valve?

last time I bought an anti-scald valve it was around $30 from a plumbing store, when I was installing solar hot water systems every single system we installed would get one of these valves because the solar hot water panels, after going through the heat exchanger, would get the domestic hot water up to 180 degrees, often before noon if it was sunny out, after that the hot water was being sent through a coil in the floor if it was winter, and in the summer it would go through a dump loop that was berried out side, when we finish the solar hot water system on the garage it will dump the heat in the summer in to a 700 gallon tank of water... home built hot tub?

So you found one in the $30 range, cool I'll keep looking, The cheapest I have seen thus far is $60 (ebay) however I haven't been to the local plumbing supply yet, so far I have only checked the big boxes.

Actually one of my next projects will be a heat exchanger on my central AC unit to interface it with my 20,000 gallon Swimming pool / Radiator :-)

Man I've got to get back to work on the BioDiesel processor it's almost time to fill up again :-(

I wouldn't mind having a hot tub also :-)

Had my first Solar hot water shower today.
It is plumbed up without any conventional water heater.
Today was rather cloudy, only 85deg water, it wasn't great, but it wasn't bad either.
Off to hunt for tankless water heater

I was thinking about this the other day. I have a radiator from my 93 Tercel just sitting around downstairs. Its about 24 inches by 36 inches. What about enclosing it in a wooden box and glass cover? Use the normal outlets out the back side of the box (sealed with silicon of course) and you have a descent solar collector for cheap.

It would work, but I have 2 concerns
1) Capacity Would heat up very quickly, but would run out of steam quickly as well.
2) Pressure House hold water is around 50 psi, radiator pressure is around 14 psi Not sure if it would be up to the job.

I've determined that my tank is simply from a 40 gallon gas water heater, they either cut the insulation / burner out, or bought one un-assembled.

I don't yet have the 2nd pane of glass mounted, but I think it will help retin the heat through the night / clouds.

Just added the second pane of glass.
We will see what improvement that will make in the next few days.
I had 125 degree water at the faucet around 4pm today. (without second pane) That was the hottest I've seen in actual use. (still my only hot water heater)

I was thinking a bit differently than you. I was planning on using this very simple radiator setup for a garage heating system. It wouldn't be hooked up to household water, and thus not need to hold 50 psi.

Keep us updated on the progress. :) I'm quite interested.

Just upgraded from garden hoses + lots of adapters -> PVC + CPVC all painted black with krylon fusion. However I have a leak where I'm interfacing from home copper to cpvc ergh.

Edit: Leak Repaired. Upgraded fittings FTW

I just "Ran out" of solar hot water for the first time.

Time to actually get the electric heater in place.

Now I'm thinking that I'll need a Tankless powerful enough to support usage all on it's own, but just stay off/ low power the majority of the time.

Daox: I think the radiator thing would work great as long as you're using it for hot non-potable water. Many radiators are made with some unsavory materials (like lead) and I wouldn't want to drink water that's been heated up through a radiator...

dremd: Awesome score with the solar water heater! My dad has been talking about getting a solar "batch" water heater like yours for a while, but I don't think it'd be such a great idea in Missouri where the winters are (way) below freezing.
I remember reading a book about solar hot water that said that in the 20's the vast majority of hot water in the state of Florida came not from gas or electricity, but from solar water heaters.

How far we have fallen...

Ordered a Bosch Powerstar Ae 125 last night
http://www.cpotanklesswaterheaters.c.../ae125-re.html

10 year BOSCH Warranty on Referbs. I have a BOSCH DishWasher (refurb 4 years ago) that is simply great, so I decided to give their water heater's a shot

Fed Ex says it will be here on Monday the 14th, Now I Just wish I had ordered it a few days earlier so I could get it working this weekend.

He (your dad) could just use it in the summer.

I set mine up with Cut offs/ bypass for those 5~10 freezing nights we get a year. If I were him I'd just build one. I'm planning on making a pseudo DIY build build a Solar hot water heater like mine once I'm done.

I also read the bit about Solar Hot water in Florida. I saw it in the Orlando Paper Thanksgiving day, inside an article about resurgence of solar hot water in Florida.

Did the on demand hot water heater you bought have an incoming water temp sensor? or variable flame? alot of cheap on demand hot water heaters are either on, or off, so if you are just using a little water it will either cycle on and off, or over heat it, and if the incoming water is already hot, then they still come on and over heat it, or get confused and cycle on and off because they don't always monitor the outgoing temp, they just monitor the amount of water going thru the water heater, of course some of them do monitor the in and out temp, and heat accordingly.

I saw quite a few that appeared to be like you are talking about, this unit does have in/ out temp senders, and I have spoken to 2 people who are using one in their system with no issues. I do wish that there was a "solar rated" or the like making the process easier, I'm guessing others would work as well, but I didn't know.

Installed AE125 today and MAN IS IT COOL.

1'st note, yes I know it says it in the instructions, but I wasn't prepared for 3 double pole 40 amp breakers to feed the beast with.

2nd note "Powering" it up is kind of like the first time you used a CD burner, you "know" it will be quite, smoth, no smells, but you just expect something to smoke/ hiss/ groan/ buzz etc. just the sound of water flowing through the unit.

3rd note DAMN it will make your water HOTTTTTT FAST. Watch that thermostat knob!

4th note It does work properly with changing input temps, I cycled my solar byp*** (for freezes) and I couldn't tell the difference in output temps.

5th note SMALL I just wasn't prepared for how small the thing would be. It is about like a small medicine cabinet

So far (2 hours) I'd highly recommend this unit with or without a solar system.

Water heater is still kicking butt and taking names.

Well pump contacts froze up today, probably ran 8 hours straight, not very eco. But it's fixed now.

New Well pump pressure switch bit the dust today, would turn off at low pressure and ON at high pressure . . . . Waco. . . . . Replaced

I'm having an issue with moisture between the 2 glass panels of my water heater. it looks like there is perpetual rain fall inside lol. Any advice on removing the moisture? Silica? Looks like there might be as much as a half ounce of water inside, I THOUGH I had it sealed . . .

System is holding up to 12 (yes that is correct) people, all showering no problem. When everyone left this morning outlet temp of Solar (inlet of Tankless) was still 80 deg.

No Complaints.

I need to get the Water out between the panels still. . ..

wow, 12 people that's pretty awesome performance!

That's got me pretty stoked on the idea of building a passive batch heater once I get a house again.

The way I see it all I need is about 3 old water heaters, some random pipes, and a few panes of hail-resistant glazing.

Installed a tube between the 2 pannels, I plan on opening it on dry days and closing it at night/ wet days. We will see how it works in comming weeks.

As a side note, I finally did the math on previous propane consumption, came ot to about 75 gallons a month. Now that is not ALL water, we also have a gas stove and gas dryer, however the last month (how long the solar has been up) we have used less than 20% of a 120 gallon tank, so DRASTIC savings there.

I was using about 2x as much Propane as Diesel lol

Awesome results! As I think I mentioned before I have been house hunting since early spring. I can't wait to get into a house to do some work. This is very inspiring!

If anyone else builds one I highly recommend installing a vent / faucet at the highest point. I had a heck of a hard time removing trapped air after my well was offline last week.

Tube appears to be working, much much less fog now.

Dremd,

On the moisture problem between the panes of glass...
I'd recommend getting a 'spray can' of Nitrogen. It's sold in paint stores and it's called 'bloxygen' I think. Painters use it to replace the air in a can of paint so it won't go bad in the can. Once the panes are dry, flush the air out with the N2 and make sure it's sealed up real good with some silicon.

Rich

Sweet!
Do you think C25 would work ok also? (75% Nitrogen/25% Carbon Dioxide) I use it for mig welding and have a rather large tank hanging around.

Yes, any gas that's moisture free would work.

I want to do solar water but in the great whit north it requires a glycol system..

Also the on demand heaters are pretty sweet, especially if your pre heating the water by solar, you'll save big time on electricity.