When will the 1G Insight finally be bested?
 

When do you think a major carmaker will finally release a car that beats the first-generation Insight's mpg? What do you think that car will be?

The 2011 CR-Z won't do it. The CR-Z is sporty, and will probably end up with some needlessly large power plant. Even if it ends up Insight-sized and Insight-shaped, and with a CR-Z HF powerplant, it'll still have a steel chassis, plus the weight penalty of 10 years of extra crash regs holding it back.

The 2014 Prius will surely be impressive, but unless Toyota comes out with a very small (iQ-based?), very aerodynamic (not iQ-based) dedicated hybrid, I don't think it will be sufficient.

An Aptera 2g or 2h would qualify, but I said major carmaker. So if they sell 50,000 of them a year, that would do it. Until then, it's in the same category as the 125mpg HyperRocket motorcycle.

When the driverless car gets approved for transporting humans on the highway (2025?), a one seat, "coffin on wheels" layout becomes attractive. That could easily get 200mpg at the kind of speeds we're accustomed to today.

Are there any other cars that look promising enough to beat the Insight at its own game?

Never....if I have anything to do with it!!!!!!!!!

Opps :o

Since you excluded the Aptera - I just don't know.

VW is supposed to be building a production version of its 1L car for 2010.

Robert - great poll question!

I suspect: never. That's it, as far as high-efficiency internal combustion autos go, at least for the North American market.

(Assuming plug-in hybrids don't count.)

And as an aside, I don't buy the statement that crash protection necessarily means weight gains.

EDIT: both Mazda and Ford have publicly stated several times that they aim to trim a serious amount of weight from their vehicles - on the order of 10+%. Are their cars going to be 10% less safe? I don't think so.

I dismissed that one as greenwashing when I read it. I seriousy doubt we'll see it.

VW likely won't even put a diesel in the Polo they're considering bringing to North America - what does that say about their seriousness regarding efficiency?

...a small diesel-powered Prius might get there, but will Toyota do it?

You know, I asked somewhere why cars are getting so heavy, bringing up the fact that a car which 10 years ago might have been 2500lbs has steadily grown to 2800lbs or so, and a lot of it was cited as being stiffer frames for, among other things, crash protection. It's odd that even Americans could build a 2300lb economy car in 1960 (the Falcon), when big was still the fashion, yet today we can't seem to get weight in check.

The brand new version of my 20 year old truck weighs a good 700 pounds more:eek:

If Toyota doesn't, then hopefully an ecomodder or two will!! :)

As for weight, it's not only the frame, but all of the electronic gizmos: power steering, power windows, power seats, BSI's, ECU's, huge speakers and subwoofers and CD changers, extra-large alternator and battery to power it all, etc. Also, more insulating material to make it quieter inside.

It's already been done! the Suzuki Twin, 100mpg hybrid "The car Americans don't want" Suzuki's Twin Hybrid achieves 100 mpg and I believe the cost is around $9,000-10,000

Hi,

I certainly hope that Aptera will be able to sell more 2e/2h vehicles than that by 2015.

The Toyota 1/X could do it.

A Toyota/Scion FT-EV (EV version of the iQ) would do it.

The Nissan Leaf would do it.

The Mitsubishi iMiEV would do it.

A plug in Prius would do it.

Well, if we go by the EPA standard, not hypermilers standard, the 2010 Prius gets 50 combined while the cvt Insight got 47. The manual Insight got 53. So it should not take much to surpass the Insight with the next generation hybrids.

Maybe it says that they're interested in shipping cars that sell, and how many Americans would want to buy a diesel, given all the examples on the roads that noise & stink are inseparable from diesel? And yes, I know the arguments about Europeans being able to build clean, quiet diesels, but that doesn't cut much ice when I pull up next to a contrary example of a brand-new American diesel pickup idling at a light.

@Suzuki Twin: that is a niftly little keicar. I presume that 100mpg figure is on the Japanese 10-15 mode, which results in much higher numbers than the EPA's faster test. It has a smaller frontal area, but a much higher drag coefficient, than the Insight. Someone should ecomod one.

@Toyota 1/X: Wow! It's a mini-Prius, made of extremely expensive materials! I want one. Yes, that would beat the 1g Insight if it came out without getting bloated on its way through the focus groups. The concept is awesome, but what if the production version ended up with a price tag a few grand less than the Insight-II? Hint: no carbon fiber, no Lithium-ion.

RobertSmalls -

I love looking in the Japanese car mags. Here is something that may just be a fig-newton of the artist's imagination, but who knows? :

http://ecomodder.com/forum/member-cf...ius-2-door.jpg

I think it's a proposal for a Honda CR-Z fighter. Is it a Toyota CRX/Insight/Prius ?!?!?!?!?

CarloSW2