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Old 01-09-2014, 12:40 AM   #106 (permalink)
RustyLugNut
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Altered flame fronts does not negate thermodynamics.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UFO View Post
I'd like to see all these "open-minded" experimenters who counter the demonstrated thermodynamics with rhetoric of catalytic effects, altered flame front velocities and long complex molecular chains explain how thermodynamics does not govern under those circumstances.

Yes, it's facile to make the claim that on-vehicle hydrogen generation won't work because the energy in exceeds the reclaimed energy, and it's certainly valid to counter that we are not considering the whole system. Ultimately it is up to the critic to re-define that system, and that has not been done, I think because it is not understood.

Or is thermodynamics just so much bunk?
Hydrogen/oxygen is not a catalyst as the HHO proponents have put forward. It is consumed in the process of course, as a "seeding component". It happens on the thermochemical scale. The thermodynamics of chemistry. And it doesn't break the laws of said thermodynamics to alter the flame front and recover the lost energy of combustion. drrbc has pointed out repeatedly that we are not looking at a closed reaction. We are adding additional air and fuel to continuously produce energy, the bulk of which is wasted. Why the recovery of a percentage or two of this energy is not understood by forum readers is beyond me.

Reduce aerodynamic drag and less energy is needed to move the same speed.

Reduce rolling resistance and glide further on the same energy expenditure.

Reduce pumping losses in an engine and gain up to 15% more useable energy to move the vehicle. We all see this as part of the diesel cycle advantage.

Reduce combustion losses? Reduce heat loss? Improve the pressure gradient across the piston surface? All this can be done with a small seeding of oxygen/hydrogen.

A graduate level understanding of combustion may be needed to fully understand this, but the theory is not beyond those who have at least an undergraduate science background. Thermochemistry, Gibbs free Energy, reaction rates, etc.

That is why I simply seek to map the pressure curve. If that doesn't convince you, then I don't know what will.

I will build and integrate a system to do A-B-A tests. I will then offer to travel to any of the North American Skeptics on this forum and THEY can test the system and make a report here on Ecomodder. Of course all I ask is that you cover my travel expenses.

First things first - a suitable generator will be built. Then electronic controls implemented. Then the tests. Hopefully the instrumentation will include an in-cylinder pressure sensor.

Again, I am not creating energy from thin air. I am using a small amount of energy to recover a portion of the massive energy that is lost in the internal combustion engine. Wrap your head around that and it becomes plausible.
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