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Old 07-12-2014, 02:08 PM   #25 (permalink)
Ecky
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I bought into hybrids.

Honda's IMA packs will reliably last 8+ years, with some expected to last 20. Toyota's should last even longer because they use a smaller range of the battery's available capacity. I would be concerned about buying one that's 8+ years old without taking a close look at the battery, but many first-gen Insights are still under warranty for battery replacement. One plus for Honda's IMA system is that the car still works even if the battery dies, which as I understand it is not true of the Prius. You lose assist, but for years it'll still auto-stop with only a tiny fraction of the battery's capacity remaining, and when it goes completely you can still drive around with a very small, very efficient (but not very powerful) ICE equipped with electric power steering and a highly efficient DC-DC converter. A new battery can be purchased with more capacity than the original one for about $1500, and you can get one that's been refurbished for ~$500.

Due to the electric assist, the gearing on hybrids tends to be very favorable for us.

The main reason Honda's newer hybrids aren't as stellar as the 1st-Gen Insight, as I understand it, is that they're not selling them at a loss anymore. Due to the aluminum construction and attention to detail in weight reduction, I've seen estimates ranging between $40-60,000 to roll each of the original Insights off the assembly line. With those cars, the 5MT is preferable because the CVTs have a relatively high failure rate before 200,000 miles, so if it's on the table at all, look for one with low miles. I believe they addressed this with all later CVT-equipped hybrids, so don't be afraid of a CVT Civic or CR-Z.

The main downside to the hybrid systems, as I see it, are the losses involved with using a battery. The motor is not 100% efficient. You lose energy to heat both when charging and discharging the battery. The DC-DC converter is better than an alternator but it's still stacked on top of the other hybrid electronics.

That said, for a new car I'm not sure what I'd get. The Civic HF has a very attractive price and very little to fail. Ford has some ecoboost models that got my attention. My Insight was a no-brainer at $3900 off the lot with a brand new battery and zero mechanical issues, but I'm mechanically inclined enough to repair just about anything that goes wrong. Parts are not bad, and you can find anything you need. There's a 2006 CVT for sale nearby with 60k miles on it, but the owner is asking a very silly $11k for it.
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