[jcp123]

Originally Posted by mpg_numbers_guy

It's got more mid-range torque than a Toyota Sienna! My dad drove me down to college in our family minivan with a luggage carrier on top - about a 4 MPG penalty. Trying to go 75 MPH with that it constantly downshifted to 3rd gear @ 4500 RPMs because it didn't have the torque - while my Civic has never downshifted on any hill below 75 MPH. It did once on a steep hill going 78 (not me driving, I promise!!!). Van got around 22.5 until he got so mad he slowed down to 60-65 lol and finished off at 23.6. Speed really does kill!

I don't want to be the village dick, but I don't think that's a great comparison. My Ma has an '04 Mazda3 hatch with 2.3 and automatic. It downshifts or goes out of lockup if a dog in Newfoundland farts. My wife's Chrysler Town and Country resolutely resists downshifts. There's a little bit going on with torquebands, and how loaded each vehicle actually was, but it comes down to some engineer somewhere determining how the vehicle should "feel" and where the shift algorithm should choose a downshift.

I have never driven a D17 of any stripe, but I can say that my D16 vs my SVT Focus is weak sauce for torque, just to compare my two m/t four cylinders, and my butt dyno got a lot more shove out of my slushbox trans Echo than my Civic. The D-series wants to, needs to, begs to be revved, pushed, used, and prodded. It's endearing as an enthusiast, discouraging for running taller gearing.

All that aside, if you can make a G1 Insight work for you, DO IT! I really can't so I think folks who can, and have some interest, should.