Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH
I don't hate crossovers because they are wagons with a slight lift - which is fine by me. But if you don't like wagons it would make sense that you wouldn't like crossovers.
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I would take a shorter wagon over a taller crossover.
Here's an example of what I see when I compare a crossover to the competition:
Camry vs. RAV4 (at least when I researched back in 2020):
- The Camry costs less than the RAV4
- The Camry gets better fuel mileage than the RAV4
- The Camry has more leg room than the RAV4
- The Camry has a 5 star crash rating from NHTSA whereas the RAV4 only has a 4 star rating
- The Camry has a Top Safety Pick + from the IIHS as is, the RAV4 doesn't even get into the Top Safety Pick category unless it has certain options.
- And if you think the RAV4 is a heavy weight so it's not an apples to apples comparison when it comes to safety, the reality is (when compared with similar options) the RAV4 is only 50 to 70 lbs heavier than the Camry
So yes, the Camry does have half the cargo space as the RAV4. But if Toyota made and sold a Camry Wagon, it would likely have all the advantages above plus the extra cargo space.
This reminds me when Mazda stopped selling the Mazda 6 wagon in the USA back in 2008 and replaced it with the CX-5 crossover. The wagon had more passenger and cargo room, better fuel mileage, better power and cost less.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH
extra ground clearance without the extra roof height.
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To me crossovers have too much roof height. Not that head room is a bad thing, but the greater the crossectional area and the boxier the shape the worse the aerodynamic drag. And a crossover seems to be going for both boxier and a bigger crossection.
I'd prefer cars to be built a bit shorter and longer. It just makes more sense in my head.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH
The extra ground clearance is nice as is AWD without much of a mpg penalty. Can you take 2wd cars down forest roads - sure I've done it plenty of times - but the extra ground clearance is nice to speed things up.
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I must admit there has been a few times I wished I had a higher ground clearance or maybe even AWD. But to me there's more penalties than just fuel mileage: crossovers also cost more and also have less leg room.
Quote:
Originally Posted by redpoint5
Pretty sure there's a hitch for all those cars, though some aren't tow rated.
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The Avalon also isn't tow rated. But I do have a custom hitch on it that comes through the bumper instead of one that hangs down and drags like on most cars.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSH
Those monthly payments are pretty crazy considering most are more than I've ever paid per month for a vehicle all-in (Purchase, fuel, maintenance, insurance)
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Of course I calculated fuel at $4.50 per gallon. These are new cars, not 3-year-old cars that normally would cost about half as much. And this is a 5 year loan, so if someone had a 7 year loan they might see lower prices. And add to that the resale or trade-in value of a previous car.
Here's the totals after 10 and 15 years ownership:
Total/average monthly
10 Years, 175,000 miles:
- Mitsubishi Mirage = $40,102/$334
- Chevy Spark = $42,825/$356
- Prius Prime = $44,711/$373
- Corolla Hybrid = $45,792/$382
- Nissan Versa = $46,545/$388
- Ford Maverick = $48,262/$402
- VW Jetta = $49,381/$412
- Corolla non-hybrid = $50,152/$418
- Camry Hybrid = $50,592/$422
- RAV4 Prime = $62,186/$518
15 Years, 262,500 miles:
- Prius Prime = $48,922/$272
- Mitsubishi Mirage = $50,744/$288
- Corolla Hybrid = $53,364/$296
- Chevy Spark = $55,950/$310
- Camry Hybrid = $58,164/$323
- Ford Maverick = $58,904/$327
- Nissan Versa = $59,670/$332
- VW Jetta = $60,962/$339
- Corolla non-hybrid = $62,084/$344
- RAV4 Prime = $62,186/$378