Vetter streamliner body kit

[jkv357]

Originally Posted by sendler

Moto GP racing leathers have evolved to include a huge, tear drop shaped "spine protector" which is obviously designed to be a helmet fairing aero aid.

You would think any little bit would help at those speeds. MotoGP bikes are breaking 200 mph regularly now.

Compared to a Busa or ZX14, the MotoGP bikes are tiny, with much less frontal area and are designed for a smaller rider. Larger production "high-speed sport tourers" are a compromise - that's why the larger rider gave a better coefficient of drag.

Another interesting thing the "speed hump" does is provides a spot for a battery-powered fan to drop-in to cool the rider off the track.

[aerohead]

Originally Posted by aerohead

Book,'Aerodynamic Drag,' by Sighard Hoerner,self-published,might be a source for that data.

The closest thing I could find to a head fairing was from Hoerner's drag table for landing gear (all data from NACA (now NASA))
*A wing with 1/2-retracted Goodyear Aerowheel had Cd 0.19.
*When the best fairing was placed behind it,the drag dropped to Cd 0.10.
*This is a 47.3 % drag reduction.
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*Between Hoerner's book,and TECHNICAL AERODYNAMICS,by Karl D. Wood,Cornell University,it looks like the presence of an open cockpit can increase fuselage drag from 41.3% to 87.5%,depending on the case specific application.
*A windscreen can add another 33% drag.
*A fully-enclosed canopy of best design,with no more frontal area than 10% of the host fuselage frontal area added 8.5% overall drag.
*The addition of the two wheels and the affect of ground proximity appears to add drag on the order of 0.0436 to a fuselage Cd measured in free-flight.
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*I looked at Craig Vetter's 1981 Kawasaki,KZ 250 project and in plan-view measure a chord-to-thickness ratio of 3.333,or 30% thickness.
*According to Hoerner,the 'ideal' section achieves the drag minimum with 25.5% thickness.(NOTE the difference between Vetter's and 'Ideal' is so statistically insignificant that I will chime in with Craig's comment that you can experiment all you want,but you'll end up doing essentially what he's done.It's just borne out of the experimental data).
*Jean Andreau's 1937 Cd 0.201 Peugeot 405 used 3.781.
*The 1951 75cc Moto Guzzi Minimotor LSR streamliner utilized the 3.92 ratio.
*So too for the 1957 MG EX 181 LSR streamliner.
*Volkswagen's 1981 Cd 0.14 'Flow' body was very close (3.847).
*Porsche's 1982 956 canopy is based upon a 3.617 section
*Daihatsu's Cd 0.163 UFE-3 is 3.866.
*The 2012 Edison-2 is based upon a 3.351 section.
*An effective fineness-ratio for Craig's KZ is 2.698:1 (almost identical to Paul Jaray's 1922 patented 'Kombination-form' roof section in plan-view.

[aluminumwelder]

I think there are a ton of people interested in getting a kit, but the price point of $2000 with shipping is a deal breaker. It really does have to be a good ROI and economically feasible.

Just look at the graph of solar growth vs cost. It's obvious when the price drops everyone starts using it.

I think who ever is doing your fiberglass work is going to have to take a paycut if you really want to sell these things.

[Grant-53]

Right now these are cutting edge prototypes in limited production.

[8307c4]

Yeah, cutting edge prototypes...

How much debris gets flung in your general direction, how many people yell at you, how often do you have to hear it, would telling these people that you're working on a cutting edge prototype make a difference?

[beatr911]

To some, there comes a time where it doesn't matter how much guff is received or expense spent to do what is felt to be right.

I'm sure some brilliant person has the means and abilities to make it all happen sucessfully in a big way with the general public. Until that day, this is all we got.

To those sipping the kool-aid and actually building streamliners: HUGE RESPECT.

[sendler]

Originally Posted by 8307c4

Yeah, cutting edge prototypes...

How much debris gets flung in your general direction,

Planning on flinging?

[Grant-53]

I get a bit of crap on a couple of forums from time to time about aerodynamics and safety posts. It doesn't help my anxiety/depression disease any but I have pills for that. After many years of working with the public selling auto parts I have concluded that many folks are abusive because they are afraid of loss in some form. As a matter of fact since I started using a homemade fairing on my bicycle and obeying traffic rules I have had no one make rude remarks or gestures. I have had people stop and compliment my fairing often. Hopefully I can finish optimizing the design and sell plans online. I am polite and smile at people I pass when I can. In the movie "Harvey" the main character has a line, "I used to try to be clever. Now I am just polite; it works better that way."

[RedDevil]

I believe many people see anything that is different from what they are doing as a threat, especially if it is healthy, clean or benevolent in any way; as it suggests that they fall short by not doing it; as if it makes them look bad.
They have a choice: comply, ignore or fight it. Obviously, not everyone will choose from the first two options.

It is not your fault. This is a free world, you have the right to do what's good.

[hyper-miler]

Originally Posted by S

There have been quite a few comments through this thread about "cheap" and people not being willing to spend to get a good product .

something that I haven't heard mentioned so far is wind noise for the rider.

I think there are a ton of people interested in getting a kit, but the price point of $2000 with shipping is a deal breaker. It really does have to be a good ROI and economically feasible.

The noise can be greatly reduced by completely enclosing the motorcycle/scooter. Monotracer is an example.



One other point is the compromise between side winds and width as here in California it would be hard to lane split if the bike gets to wide.

As Craig Vetter says "Back in the 30s, Wunibald Kamm said that you could cut off the long tail without adding too much drag.

Why would I want to add any drag? "

The "open cockpit" has a negative effect on MPG.
I am going to completely enclose my 07' Burgman 650 and compete in Vetters competition and see how much is that negative impact.