2011 Fiesta mileage from cold start

[Bruce]

Originally Posted by Old Mechanic

Hit my "ideal" route today, averaged 47 MPH with MPG meter reading 50.7 when I got home. Total of 95 miles.

regards
Mech

Mech,

Are you coasting much to get these results, or is that harmful to the DCT? Does this trans even have a neutral, or is it just like holding the clutch the whole time you're coasting?

I always enjoy and learn from your posts. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

Thanks,
Bruce

[user removed]

I coast a lot. My Fiesta is a rebuilt salvage vehicle, so there is no warranty from Ford once it went to the salvage auction. Recalls are still done by Ford but no warranty repairs.

Coasting in "neutral". I don't think it really is neutral, because I can feel the transmission downshifting as the vehicles speed decreases in neutral, so my best guess would be it uses the clutch to coast. Not sure if it really has a neutral, it could be just a disengaged clutch.

As far as damage, lets just say I hope not, since I would have to pay if there was damage. I would not recommend coasting in neutral as long as you have a factory warranty, since Ford can tell from the data recorder in your car what you have been doing and could deny a warranty claim based on "improper" operation by the driver.

I have been using neutral coasting for 12k miles now and in my case it makes a significant difference. Today I reset the MPG guage at the top of my driveway and got it over 40 MPG in 3 miles at 40 degrees ambient temperature. I probably coasted 40% of that distance and had it at 23 MPG .3 mile from my house with coasting over 50% of that distance.

Can I tell you absolutely that coasting will or will not damage the transmission? The answer is no. In my case if it causes damage I will have to pay out of my pocket to get it repaired. Experience tells me that extensive coasting will not damaged the gear trains in the transmission but could cause premature wear in the throwout bearings and clutch release mechanisms. That being said it can't be as bad as someone crawling through bumper to bumper rush hour traffic in some of the more congested commutes in the US.

Whether you should or should not might be best answered by refraining from coasting in neutral until your warranty expires. There has been a higher than normal customer service issues with the powershift transmissions in Fiestas. My gut feeling is it is mostly due to drivers being unfamiliar with the type of transmission which is automatically shifted but technically a manual transmission.

If you decide to refrain from coasting, you might ask someone at the selling dealership if it is OK but I doubt they will authorize coasting without consulting Ford first, and I would bet Ford would say no, especially since it is illegal in some states dating back to the 1930s when Plymouth built a car with freewheeling which coasted every time you let off the gas.

regards
Mech

[Bruce]

Mech,

Thanks for the extensive reply. My brother-in-law and daughter both recently bought Fiestas and I wondered if coasting would be advisable. Based on your info, I'll recommend against it.
Thanks!
Bruce

[user removed]

Probably the best while you have a warranty. My 2011 cost me $10K with 3770 miles. Probably $6-7K cheaper than OTD from Ford (including all of their additional fees). For that up front cost savings I am willing to risk a tranny issue.

I also do not carry collision insurance, but do carry comprehensive. I had an 08 Altima I sold to my son in law, basically for about $10.5k. It was a salvage car. He drove it a year and got hit in the rear end by a F150 and it totalled the car again.

The insurance company GAVE HIM $17K FOR THE CAR!

The reason is in Virginia there is a law that allows you to sue to recover "diminished value" of a car after it has been repaired. The insurnace companies will fight you tooth and nail to keep from paying for the loss in value when carfax shows you car has been wrecked, so it is hard for them to tell you the car is worth less BECAUSE it has been wrecked and repaired.

My son in law used the windfall to buy another car. He made a good chunk of cash after paying for all of his operating expenses.

regards
Mech

[Bruce]

Not often you come out ahead when dealing with insurance companies, but good for him. My daughter had a chance to buy a rebuilt Fiesta for $11.4k but opted to go with a new one with a warranty. I've read of a few problems with the trannys and figured that one major issue would cut into her savings and the hit she would take when she sells/trades a rebuilt vehicle would wipe out the rest.

[roosterk0031]

Great info, younger brother has a Focus DCT, and complained to me about how it works in stop and go traffic in Chicago. I'll have to recommend him using neutral to coast it's a mini P&G.

The way it works is when you let off the brake and push on the gas the it takes off as it should, but go to no throttle the clutch stays engaged so you have to brake to get it to unlock the clutch, might as well do it with the shifting lever and get a better glide than with the brakes. Tranny/clutches see the same work, but more efficient to slip it into N.

I rented a Focus with DCT tranny for a long weekend and it was pretty nice, I could do without the all the electronics but engine, tranny abs and traction control worked great. MPG was empressive, but most of my miles were intersate.

[user removed]

Originally Posted by Bruce

Not often you come out ahead when dealing with insurance companies, but good for him. My daughter had a chance to buy a rebuilt Fiesta for $11.4k but opted to go with a new one with a warranty. I've read of a few problems with the trannys and figured that one major issue would cut into her savings and the hit she would take when she sells/trades a rebuilt vehicle would wipe out the rest.

The shop I got my Fiesta from is owned by a father (72 years old) and two sons and his daughter work there. The youngest is 48 years old. I have known and worked with them for 25 years. Occasionally I have helped them with electrical problems and once saved them from scrapping a Focus wagon they had rebuilt but would not start when cold. They took it to two delerships who charged them but could not isolate the problem. The crazy thing was they had another Focus in back of the shop that was not repairable but had a running engine that started fine cold.

It took me 14 hours, tried all of the service bulletin procedures from the local dealership, then I stopped reading all of that crap and started doing my own analysis. It was a returnless system and I finally lucked up and replced the fuel pressure sensor which fixed the car. They had sold it to a customer and given them their $5K back and were going to scrap the car for parts.

The old man painted my rebuilt Civic VX in return for my saving them from loosing the money they made on that car. When I bought my 11 Fiesta they gave me a 90 day warranty. I figured out the accent lights wern't working right and the dipstick was chewed up where it had been hit in the collision. The old man says, go grab another dip stick from one of the other cars, and his son pulled the console and found the plug to the accent light switch was not connected. They had never messed with any of the interior, no broken glass, no airbags had ever deployed. I dont think it had any frame damage and when they aligned it (4 Wheels) I got them to set the toe to the minimum spec (closest to 0). I'd bet the accent light plug was never hooked up at the factory

Unless you have a similar working relationship with a shop, it probably is not worth the risk to buy a rebuilt salvage vehicle. My buddies have done hundreds, maybe even thousands of them and some people have bought several cars from them, to let their teenagers drive so if they get in a wreck, it's not a brand new car that just got wiped out. The old man was a sharecroppers son, had 11 brothers and sisters, and moved out when he was 16 years old and worked in body shops ever since. Today he is worth a couple million or more and he still rebuilds one or two cars a week, one tough cookie.

regards
Mech

[user removed]

Originally Posted by roosterk0031

Great info, younger brother has a Focus DCT, and complained to me about how it works in stop and go traffic in Chicago. I'll have to recommend him using neutral to coast it's a mini P&G.

The way it works is when you let off the brake and push on the gas the it takes off as it should, but go to no throttle the clutch stays engaged so you have to brake to get it to unlock the clutch, might as well do it with the shifting lever and get a better glide than with the brakes. Tranny/clutches see the same work, but more efficient to slip it into N.

I rented a Focus with DCT tranny for a long weekend and it was pretty nice, I could do without the all the electronics but engine, tranny abs and traction control worked great. MPG was empressive, but most of my miles were intersate.

I'm retired and manage to avoid most of the traffic here, which can get nasty.
If the traffic is crawling and you can coast in neutral you can get some unreal mileage if you can just keep moving at an average of better than 15 MPH. I have not tested it yet (in the Fiesta) but you can calculate the idle speed fuel consumption with a MPG gauge by coasting down until the MPG gauge starts reading below it's maximum. On my 2002 Insight it would coast down to 16 MPH before the gauge dropped below 150 MPG (max reading). Using that data the idle consumption was 16/150 of a gallon per hour or .106 GPH. Thats about the lowest idle consumption of any passenger car engine in that 1 liter engine. I need to check it in the Fiesta. That meant at 60 MPH I was getting over 500 MPG coasting, in the 02 Insight.

regards
Mech

[RiderofBikes]

Just to add, ive been Powershift N coasting and EOC for just over 20k mi within a years time. with no ill effects(that i know of anyways) im still under warranty but aslo already at 50,000 mi in 1.5yrs. I dont do it as often since i dont drive it everyday for my work commute anymore. It gets driven MORE instead by my fiance, ~1200mi/wk nowadays instead of 400mi/wk...

Ill be seeing if i can get the tranny fluid changed using the "Extreme Condition", under warranty to give me a cushion of time to see if all is right, before it disappears completely at 63000mi mark.