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-   -   '85' VW Jetta WVO success (https://ecomodder.com/forum/showthread.php/85-vw-jetta-wvo-success-22418.html)

james.lafrance 06-29-2012 01:59 PM

'85' VW Jetta WVO success
 
Hey folks, I've been on EcoModder for a while now, and pretty much quite the whole time too. Now it's time to show what I have learned and where I'm at.
Brief history: started hypermiling my stock (96?) Saturn SW1 and found that it was quite easy to reach 50+MPG. That what got me started. Something still tugged at me(my consience? i dunno) and said "good job, but you're still supporting OPEC, poluting, etc.."
Around this time I began collecting WVO from folks and began stock piling in hopes of one day (a) getting a diesel vehicle and (b) using WVO for 'other then vehicle' projects-i.e. oil burner boilers, kero heaters, etc.
Then I upgraded to a 93 Geo Metro, and found that I hardly had to do anything (hypermile-wise) to gain the same 50 MPG. With a little work I easily get 60+MPG. I've pondered EV-ing the car but for now I'm holding off. Batteries for EV applications just don't have what I need.
Roughly 3 years after I began collecting WVO (3-400 gallons) I finnally found a car that was suitable (affordable, and in some sort of good condition). A 1985 Volks Wagon Jetta, diesel engine, non turbo, was sold to me by an uncle of mine for $400. With little work I was able to inspect it here in PA, and then the proccess began....
Biodiesel production was my first choice, mainly from intimedation on the WVO front. After I found out what it meant to 'modify the engine' to run off WVO, as apposed to 'modify the fuel', I abandoned the biodiesel production.
SVO, WVO, WMO, WTO, any oil for that matter just needs to be 'viscus' enough and the diesel engine WILL burn it, AND operate normal!
SOOO, you just 'modify the fuel' -by means of chemical reactions, to form 'biodiesel' (which is as viscous as normal diesel, or close enough)
OORRRR you 'modify the engine' which means taking heat from your engine and using it to heat the filtered WVO(oil) till it's as viscous as diesel.
THE LATTER OF THE 2 WAS EASIEST FOR ME! it fit my application, and after a few years of learning/studying and checking out others progress I came to the conclusion that 'modifing my engine' is much more time saving, simpler-less equipment needed, lower cost ($.01/gallon).... also it's not at all anything new, it's just been surpressed information and misleading facts, half truths, and some lies.

Biodiesel advantages
-need only 1 tank on the automobile
-seems more like 'what the car should run on' since it shares many quilities of normal petrol diesel
-just pour it in your tank and go, mabey on an older car you'll have to replace rubber fuel lines, and the fueul filter, but then you just fill up and go.
-good for folks who can't use a wrech at all
dis advantages
-need atleast 1 water heater, several storage containers, a couple pumps, test equipment, just more processing equipment in general, compared to WVO
-Lye, sodium hydroxide... caustic chemicle in general, CAN be very dangerous.
-Methonal, well methanol is supposedly a chemical/alcohol that if spilled, even in small amounts, warrants a EPA clean up... there are procedures for the use of Ethanol, which is moonshine/pure alcohol/natural & safer, but it's a bit more involved and more complicated then Methanol use....
WVO advantages
-all that is needed is a tank to store and settle WVO/oils, a pump/air compressor to force the dirty oil through a series of filters, and a tank to fill up. that's it... the 3 basic esentials of WVO productin/refinement
-free to collect, cheap to filter, only costs encured are: electric used for pump or air compressor, filters (vehicle, boiler fuel filters, etc.), low 1 time cost of "modifying the engine", and mabey containers to store WVO/oil in (if you can't find them for free)
WVO disadvantages
-have to "modify" the engine, which is actually not very hard on most vehicles
-need 2 tanks, one for diesel, one for WVO
-Need to start the automobile on diesel, and need to turn off the car on diesel. you have to warm it up, and purge it out to ensure an easy normal start.
-if you can't afford the 'automatic' shutoff and purge system gadget, and you forget to switch back to diesel before letting the car sit for a while... well you only have to forget once to fix that! hahaha, it'll take a little while to start...

in my opinion, WVO has the better lists, so here's how i did it.
1. took my 'heater bypass' coolant line, cut it, and routed it through a heat exchanger.
(any cooant line will work BUT on a vehicle with a 'heater bypass' line, it is prefferable to tap in there. Reason is because this line will always heat up first to heat the engine, before sending heat to the cabin/driver's compartment)
the heat exchanger is out of a VW near the same year as mine, and it's used as a transmission fluid heat exchanger i believe.
2. i took the heat exchanger 'bolts' and threaded on standard IPS 90' elbows (with heat resistant epoxy), and out of those 90's i threaded barb fittings for my fuel lines
3. found a spot under the hood to install a tank, made a card board mock up, traced it onto sheet steel, folded it up like an origammi cube and welded it shut.
4. then i cut out holes for the fuel lines, near the bottom. and for the fill cap as well. i cut standard IPS fittings and welded them to my holes, put fittings in them and started running fuel lines.
5. got a $70 fuel sellector valve for Autozone. followed the directions for wireing it up, and put a switch in the dash to control which tank to use. then connected my fuel line to it, and ran fuel lines from the valve to the intake and return on the 'fuel pump/injector/ fuel intake manifold'.
6. filetered WVO , filled up my tank (which I did pressure test first) and hollar'd ''****'' then shoot.

almost 9000 miles on just WVO in a little over a year and a half. it's paid it self off. I am pleased and would like to help ANYONE WHO IS INTERESTED! Thanks to everyone who's posted info, help, and/or support! Pictures to come soon!

james.lafrance 06-29-2012 07:36 PM

WVO project pictures
 
Pictures by shotgunjames - Photobucket

here's some pictures of the finnished project.

NachtRitter 06-29-2012 08:20 PM

Straight WVO is probably fine for older diesel engines (pre ~1990's?) but not so good for newer engines from what I understand.

JethroBodine 06-30-2012 07:21 AM

Nice project!

What did the fuel selector valve originally come in? I'm looking to do a WVO tank in my Jetta once I get the diesel up and running and hadn't done a lot of research on valves, yet. That one looks perfect for the job:thumbup:.

Nacht- The MKIII VWs on (93-later) have catalysts in the exhaust, so I don't think they would do well with WVO. No experience to back that up.

james.lafrance 06-30-2012 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NachtRitter (Post 314511)
Straight WVO is probably fine for older diesel engines (pre ~1990's?) but not so good for newer engines from what I understand.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQmMVYMJwF0

this is a 2005 i believe, and my friend has a 2001 that we are preparing to do. my understanding that if the oil is clean enough there will be no problems. if the oil is heated and becomes 'thin' enough, it'll work the same as diesel!

Quote:

Originally Posted by JethroBodine (Post 314511)
What did the fuel selector valve originally come in? I'm looking to do a WVO tank in my Jetta once I get the diesel up and running and hadn't done a lot of research on valves, yet. That one looks perfect for the job.

well, i'm not sure of it's original application other than it's for a truck (gmc, mabey ford) that is diesel and has 2 tanks. you can go to autozone atleast, and they'll show you it before you buy it, or they'll show it to you on the computer. it is perfect, after looking at tons of different types and ideas, this one is cheapest, easiest, and smallest. i've had one problem around 7000 miles, and it got 'stuck' between the diesel and WVO, so no fuel would go through. we credited that malfunction to 'bumping the switch' or 'having it stuck in one position'. autozone has a lifetime warranty on that part, so i took it back and had it changed out for a free new one! no harm no foul, learned how 'to operate' my switch that way.

brucepick 06-30-2012 08:09 AM

Nice writeup!

james.lafrance 06-30-2012 06:46 PM

sorry to quote you again, but you said:

Quote:

Originally Posted by NachtRitter (Post 314511)
Straight WVO is probably fine for older diesel engines (pre ~1990's?) but not so good for newer engines from what I understand.

key word is PROBABLY, i'd bet alot-if not all in- that DEFFINATELY would fit in that quote better. Older diesels WILL run on multiple fuels, kerosene, off road, engine/petroleum based oils/distilates, vegtable oils, really any type of oil that has a CERTAIN viscosity-not to thick, not to thin- it'll run fine. keep in mind that most of that can be backed by books and research, but some is my opinion and experience.

I've seen a few NONsucces stories, but IMO their failure was most likely neglegence on the part of "cleaning" of the oil. It's a good idea to find a small or used water heater, fill it all the way with small pieces of stainless tubing, connect your fittings and have a good base of air bubbles, connect a small air pump/fish tank, now you've got a OIL DRYER. Little air bubbles will float up collecting water, and as the heater warms it lets the water evaporate when the air bubble bursts. if you've got the "picker skills" you'll find a small circulator or pump for circulating the oil as it heats and bubbles. "WET" oil WILL 'coke' the engine. very bad to try to burn veg oil and water, you end up with some kind of glycerine by-product i think.... that's just what i've seen, can anyone confirm or deny this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by brucepick (Post 314568)
Nice writeup!

Thanks!

I am not bashing you at all, and i hope nothing sounds sarcastic. I APPRECIATE ANY AND ALL FEEDBACK, wether critisism or praise, i can learn or teach with either. THANK YOU and everyone else!

james.lafrance 07-01-2012 12:00 AM

Oh, yeah, some one brought up a good point. In my install, my tank is in an akward spot to access belts. I can access and change them but I don't have huge hands either! aside from that there isn't too much in the way, a mechanic might be aprehensive at first but he'll soon realize -with a little explanation- that it's quite simple. and thats if you 'need' a mechanic...for any big jobs, mabey. knock on wood, sorry i can't say since i havnt needed a mechanic to do any major work.

mwebb 07-01-2012 12:11 AM

bad idea
never use this in a VW TDi

never
your success is not measured by a few tanks of fuel over a few months.

your particle filter will fail
your engine will become clogged with doo doo
your EGR systems , both of them , will be clogged
the EGR cat converter / filter will be clogged
the variable vanes in the turbo will get sludged up

ask me how i know this

Mother VW does not have any responsibility to warranty this
use the correct fuel
use the correct oil

pain will become your constant companion otherwise

orangustang 07-01-2012 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mwebb (Post 314664)
bad idea
your particle filter will fail
your engine will become clogged with doo doo
your EGR systems , both of them , will be clogged
the EGR cat converter / filter will be clogged
the variable vanes in the turbo will get sludged up

I don't think any of this actually applies in the case of a non-turbo '85 Jetta. Obviously no VGT vanes to gunk up. A quick parts search didn't give me any results for cat or EGR parts, which leads me to believe it wasn't equipped. Same for a particle filter.

As for the engine itself clogging up, it probably depends, as suggested above, on how well the fuel is cleaned and utilized. I'm sure if a mid-80's Benz can handle it, his Jetta can, too.


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