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payne171 02-27-2012 11:16 PM

Battery breakthrough
 
Envia battery breakthrough gives General Motors lead for affordable electric cars | Motoramic - Yahoo! Autos

Maybe this is the battery advancement that makes the EV and/or plug-hybrid for the average American to put one in their garage.

deathtrain 02-28-2012 12:35 AM

you mean after the failure of the Volt a Government Motors (GM) backed company has a "breakthrough" say it is not so......

cfg83 02-28-2012 01:47 AM

payne171 -

Pretty cool. I hope this pans out. Here is the Envia website :

Envia Systems | Powering the next generation of electric vehicles

CarloSW2

sendler 02-28-2012 09:21 AM

Great job. Dialing in the nano coating micro- porosity to exactly fit the shape of the ion molecules is going to be the big step forward. This results in improvements in density and also a huge increase in cycle life which is just as big a hold up in people adopting plug ins and hybrids. When cycle life can hit 5,000, we will have a battery that no one will be afraid of. Fortunately, improvements in power/ mass density will go hand in hand with increased life cycle due to the ions not cracking and forcing their way into pores of the electrodes that are too small. Then the last hang up will be price.

user removed 02-28-2012 09:49 AM

We have been anticipating the "breakthrough" in battery technology for decades and billions in financing. I will follow this development closely, especially considering that they are promising a significant increase in energy density, while also promising a significant reduction in cost, the best of both worlds.

If this becomes reality, then the US govt should step in and make sure the availability of these batteries is universal and possibly with much of GM stock still owned by the govt, a deal could be struck that would allow GM to license the technology to everyone at a reasonable cost while lowering or eliminating their obligations to the govt.

regards
Mech

Daox 02-28-2012 10:55 AM

I saw the same article yesterday. If you look at their site these batteries only seem to be tested to 500 cycles, and the AH capacity pretty drastically drops off during that time (a good 20%+ loss). I realize the weight benefit, but they will drastically need to improve cycle life in order to make this main stream.

http://enviasystems.com/images/45ah-cells.png

payne171 02-28-2012 11:42 AM

I agree that it would be better if GM was willing to license the technology to other manufacturers, but dictating a "reasonable" price is trouble. I will ignore the free market because I don't think GM deserves that right after the bailout, but if the government forces a price control on the tech, it will basically tell GM and Chrysler not to bother with that type of research anymore. Furthermore, GM can charge what they want, and competitors can either pay the price or they can massively increase battery research to stay competitive. Either one is good because it either encourages the biggest car maker in the world to continue on this route, or it will increase the spending on battery research, likely both.

esoneson 02-28-2012 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daox (Post 289790)
I saw the same article yesterday. If you look at their site these batteries only seem to be tested to 500 cycles, and the AH capacity pretty drastically drops off during that time (a good 20%+ loss). I realize the weight benefit, but they will drastically need to improve cycle life in order to make this main stream.

http://enviasystems.com/images/45ah-cells.png



These cells will be used in a pack that provides 300-400 miles each charge.
500 cycles will yield 150,000 to 200,000 miles at 100% discharge. And at 70% discharge it is 105,000 to 140,000 miles.

How long will it take you to drive that many miles?

I see no need for any cycle life improvement especially with the low predicted cost to get your vehicle up and running with no or little 'range anxiety'. And by the time you drive over 100,000 miles there will be a better, less costly replacement available to you.

sendler 02-28-2012 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esoneson (Post 289805)
These cells will be used in a pack that provides 300-400 miles each charge.
500 cycles will yield 150,000 to 200,000 miles at 100% discharge. And at 70% discharge it is 105,000 to 140,000 miles.

How long will it take you to drive that many miles?

I don't think you can add it up that way. We are at 70 miles range now with the Leaf and MiEV. The range with the new battery will be 150 miles max. And, regardless of the range that is used, I would actually think a lifetime of 500 cycles would be much closer to, 500 charge cycles even if the discharge was only 50%. I would have to hope for much more than 500 cycles. The nano technology should take us way past that on the first generation as this concept is way more important for longevity than power density.

oil pan 4 03-01-2012 07:42 PM

Is this scale able?
That means is this cheaper than just building a bigger battery and replaceing it sooner?
A lot of these advancements seem to only help the cell phone, laptop and tablet makers.


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