Call me twisted...

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by TheEnemy

When you guys were talking about rural I was snickering. I know of places that are worse, like areas of Nevada.

Worse? Hey, some of us think those places are BETTER :-)

I'd still argue about the truck as daily driver, though. My truck, which I use as a truck, runs about 26-27 mpg on average, and that's mostly loaded or on roads where you need a high-clearance vehicle (if not both). And with a class 3 hitch, it'll pull a trailer with about as much weight again, if needed, though admittedly I have to downshift to 3rd on some of the steeper hills. But my daily driver gets 70+ mpg - and the purchase price of both together was less than half the MSRP of the cheapest bottom-of-the-line F-150.

[TheEnemy]

Im not saying I couldn't do without a truck, or that its the best thing to use as a daily driver.

Its just that options are either a second vehicle, or one that doesnt do much better and a trailer. I can't even argue about a second vehicle because I have "toys" that get driven on the weekend.

[jamesqf]

Agreed, and why not the second vehicle? (In general, not you personally.) After all, very few of us try to cut boards or drive screws with a hammer, we use a tool suited to the job.

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by Fat Charlie

I swear I posted this this morning, but somehow it didn't stick. I'll summarize.

Arragonis- I know places where you can wander all day without seeing anyone. We call that normal here. Over your way, the land was developed before transportation existed, and the land is quite finite. The US grew with the idea that land was cheap, and everything since the 1940s was with the idea that not only was land cheap, but gas was cheaper- so the scattered towns became scattered themselves. Every small town doesn't have everything you need anymore, and delivery doesn't exist.

The UK is kind of small in terms of land mass but there are places which have not been developed. When I used to think of Japan I used to visualise a landscape of buildings, factories and large populations. I've looked more and its more complicated than that - it has mountains, quiet forests, shoreline - all the things we have here. The UK is the same - visit London or the South East and it is mostly concrete which some (very expensive) green bits. Here in Scotland once you get out of the central belt (the bit between Edinburgh on the East and Glasgow in the West) it is open countryside. Go 50 miles north it is almost wilderness.

England is the same - divided east to west by the penines and the peak district. Travel 30 minutes out of Leeds (large city) or Manchester on the other side and it is a wild and beautiful mountain landscape.

Originally Posted by jamesqf

...After all, very few of us try to cut boards or drive screws with a hammer, we use a tool suited to the job.

This kind of links back to my original point. I have had the requirement for a truck like vehicle 2 times in the last 10 years. If I had to pay an expensive price for a tool (e.g. > £200 ~ $320) I would probably look towards buying or hiring it instead - e.g. I didn't buy a chainsaw the one time I needed it when I moved house I rented one and I've never needed one since. A truck would set me back probably £2-3K at the least and then I have the cost of tax and insurance for something I don't really need.

I have quite a few American based friends and 2 have SUVs and trucks. One uses it every day and bought it because she thinks its safe (gets 17 MPG on a good day and it spends weeks at a time getting it's gearbox rebuilt) and the other does 190 miles a year towing a boat in and out of the water.

The latter I would suspect falls under the title of "useful tool", the former not so much.

[bestclimb]

Your requirements for a truck are not my requirements for a truck. My truck mostly sits, but I have plenty of room for it it is paid for, so it's care and feeding are pretty minimal. You are correct that in the US most trucks are wasteful, unnecessary and are not being used to their capacity 90% of the time.

I carry a pocket knife every day, from the time I put my pants on to the time I take them off. I don't use it all the time, nor even every day, but it's nice to know it's capability is there. When I do need to use it I could as a friend but that does not always work. When I do need to use it, having one close is extremely handy.

This line of logic works for me keeping a truck around, it works for some people driving one every day. It may very well be silly to pay the insurance, and fuel costs for carrying around a bunch of unused utility, but it is their money to use as they see fit.

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Arragonis

The UK is kind of small in terms of land mass but there are places which have not been developed.

There are even a number of places in the UK that have been undeveloped over time. Consider all the hill forts along the Ridgeway, Hadrian's Wall, or the stone circles at Callanish and other places in the Western Isles. Not a heck of a lot of people around those parts nowadays.

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by jamesqf

There are even a number of places in the UK that have been undeveloped over time. Consider all the hill forts along the Ridgeway, Hadrian's Wall, or the stone circles at Callanish and other places in the Western Isles. Not a heck of a lot of people around those parts nowadays.

Yep - and none of them use Trucks

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Arragonis

Yep - and none of them use Trucks

Wanna bet? Don't know about today, but when I used to spend some time in those parts (say late '90s) there were pickup trucks (and 4WDs like Land Rovers) being used.

PS: It appears perfectly possible to buy a pickup in Scotland, too. See e.g. http://www.freeads.co.uk/scotland/bu...ick-up_trucks/

[Arragonis]

Originally Posted by jamesqf

Wanna bet? Don't know about today, but when I used to spend some time in those parts (say late '90s) there were pickup trucks (and 4WDs like Land Rovers) being used.

Agreed - no idea what I was tapping there

In those cases they tend get used though pretty much every day as designed and intended - as heavy load carriers and/or to get to tricky places.

Some people of course only use them on days off in the country, but they have the odd bit of space or maybe a whole country estate to keep them in.

Originally Posted by jamesqf

PS: It appears perfectly possible to buy a pickup in Scotland, too. See e.g. Pick-up Trucks For Sale in Scotland | Freeads Vans & Commercial Vehicles in Scotland's #1 Classified Ads

Yep it is. I can also buy a cement mixer, or a chainsaw. None of them will be of benefit to me as I don't need them.

Its a culture difference - 99% of us in the UK mow our lawns using electric mowers, in the US it tends to be petrol ones. Petrol ones are available here but most of us choose the electric option. Or maybe no power at all.



I didn't see the justification for most people having a truck just in case, maybe there is some in the US or maybe not.

EDIT - Anyway we have flown this thread to Cuba and back. Back to "gas prices". Anyone else see the news that your excess shale gas might be turned into Diesel for $2 a gallon ?

[jamesqf]

Originally Posted by Arragonis

In those cases they tend get used though pretty much every day as designed and intended - as heavy load carriers and/or to get to tricky places.

Sure. We agree there, and that's what I use mine for. Seems like we have two extremes: A lot of Americans buy trucks they don't really need and use them as daily drivers, while a good many Britons probably could use a truck but get by with a car or van.

Its a culture difference - 99% of us in the UK mow our lawns using electric mowers, in the US it tends to be petrol ones. Petrol ones are available here but most of us choose the electric option. Or maybe no power at all.

What, no more Flymos? Used to love doing my friends' lawn with one.