Go Back   EcoModder Forum > EcoModding > Fossil Fuel Free
Register Now
 Register Now
 

Reply  Post New Thread
 
Submit Tools LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 12-04-2016, 07:35 PM   #61 (permalink)
EcoModding Apprentice
 
Enki's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: N/A
Posts: 142
Thanks: 32
Thanked 30 Times in 21 Posts
That might be true for my platform, but I don't think anyone has really bothered to test it; MPG is more of an afterthought where I normally live (forums wise). I'm investigating it because while E85 is plentiful where I live, I do want to go to other places that may or may not have it and getting good MPG on the sauce would be beneficial for those sorts of trips.

No, the modifications are not for the same reason.

My car actually has two fuel pumps; one is a sender that's in the tank, the other is a high pressure pump driven by the camshaft. I was able to figure out (through testing theory) that the issues my platform has has to do with oil getting into the high pressure fuel pump, and combined with lots of heat (as it's bolted directly to the head) and some kind of chemical reaction with the ethanol, sticky films are formed that gum things up and prevent the pump from building the requisite 1800 PSI needed by the injectors to flow properly.

I did this by boiling E85 in a pot on a hot plate (even tested some ceramic coatings to see if they would help; they did not):



And before anyone asks, yes, there was a fire:


Unfortunately, there aren't any aftermarket injectors for my platform, so I don't have that option; I'm adding 3000 CC worth of injectors pre-throttle body, however, and that will basically double my overall fuel flow into the engine.

__________________
  Reply With Quote
Alt Today
Popular topics

Other popular topics in this forum...

   
Old 12-05-2016, 03:16 AM   #62 (permalink)
It's all about Diesel
 
cRiPpLe_rOoStEr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Porto Alegre, Rio Grande do Sul, Brazil
Posts: 12,864
Thanks: 0
Thanked 1,683 Times in 1,501 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by 123gts View Post
I agree there are lots of problems with how ethanol is made in the USA it starts with over production of corn and corn subsidies.
Even though I'm from Brazil, I'm actually favorable to corn-based ethanol. Sure it would be better to diversify the feedstocks, but since the distillation-dried grain has a higher concentration of protein over the raw grain it's still highly valuable as a cheaper alternative to soy-based products. It's also a good alternative to provide a certain degree of stability to ethanol prices when the sugarcane is out of season.


Quote:
Yes hydrous is illegal at the pump because it isn't denatured. you can add things like methanol to hydrous ethanol to make it denatured. If you take ethanol after it has been distilled and try to mix it with gas it will not mix.
Not sure about the denaturation, but here we mix hydrous ethanol with gasoline and there is no problem.


Quote:
Brazil is doing things right when it comes to ethanol.
Actually some things are done wrong nowadays, no wonder the cost of running on ethanol here is not advantageous in most of the country anymore. As I mentioned before, there's an enormous dependence to sugarcane as the main feedstock, and it leads to the production becoming concentrated in fewer states such as São Paulo, Alagoas and Pernambuco. Well, since almost every state has at least a handful of cachaça distilleries (I'm just not sure about the Northern states), and many other traditional alcoholic beverages made out of other feedstocks, it doesn't seem impossible to get the ethanol production less centralized. For example, sometimes grape-based ethanol is imported from Italy, so why not using the mashed graoe leftovers from wine production here in Rio Grande do Sul to brew ethanol fuel?
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2016, 09:11 AM   #63 (permalink)
Volvo-driving MachYeen
 
Fingie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Finland
Posts: 788

Neo Volvo - '98 Volvo S70 10V
90 day: 24.98 mpg (US)
Thanks: 298
Thanked 82 Times in 68 Posts
Here in finland, ethanol is made from leftover waste from the food industry. The War Wagon shall soon run on alcohol, like it's owner!

(don't drink and drive, folks. My friend almost killed himself DUI)
__________________
If you don't make any mistakes in your life,
life itself will be a f*ckup.



With Volvo to Valhalla and back!
  Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2016, 04:12 PM   #64 (permalink)
home of the odd vehicles
 
rmay635703's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Somewhere in WI
Posts: 3,891

Silver - '10 Chevy Cobalt XFE
Thanks: 506
Thanked 867 Times in 654 Posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by cRiPpLe_rOoStEr View Post
Not sure about the denaturation, but here we mix hydrous ethanol with gasoline and there is no problem.
HE Blends.BV - General FAQs

There are many ways to mix hydrous with gasoline, some easier than others and some dependent on a specific temperature during mix but there are many techniques of emulsifying fuel these days so you can do it "permanently" without phase separation issues.
  Reply With Quote
Old 10-06-2017, 10:54 AM   #65 (permalink)
Rogue Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
I mentioned earlier that I was planning to advance the base timing of my Civic to try and get better mileage out of the E85. The plan is to use an Arduino DUE to read and modify the cam and crank signals so that the ECU thinks the motor is in an advanced position. After reading the altered signals it will apply its normal maps and the result will be an advance of the base timing. I don't want to get into any mapping modifications because at that point I would probably want to start from scratch and use my dusty Megasquirt 3.

Here's a post where I was looking for connectors to hook up the Arduino DUE. http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthrea...tml#post538255 I have the connectors. I think the only other hardware I need is a box and mounting hardware for the DUE, and a power supply.

Here's the code for the DUE. I'd love any feedback. I used example code and help from my good friend Karl Walter of Waltech Systems Waltech :: Home. This will be to test the hardware before I try and changes.

//hardware test
//this code will read the cam and crank signals and relay them with the same timing
//no attempt is made to modify their timing in an effort to test the hardware setup.

const int crankInPin = 22; // the pin number of the crank signal
const int camInPin = 24; // the pin number of the cam signal

const int crankOutPin = 23; // the pin number of the modified crank signal
const int camOutPin = 25; // the pin number of the modified cam signal

void setup() {
// initialize the output pins:
pinMode(crankOutPin, OUTPUT);
pinMode(camOutPin, OUTPUT);
// initialize input pins:
pinMode(crankInPin, INPUT);
pinMode(camInPin, INPUT);
// Attach an interrupt to the ISR vector
attachInterrupt(digitalPinToInterrupt(crankInPin), crank_ISR, HIGH);
attachInterrupt(digitalPinToInterrupt(camInPin), cam_ISR, HIGH);

uint32_t timehi_crank = 0;
uint32_t timehi_cam = 0;

}

void loop() {
//simple counting timer to set pins back to low
//normally pulse width will be RPM dependent, this should work as long as the signal is short enough
//to not overlap at higher RPMs. Hopefully the ECU only uses the distance between the
//signals, not the signal width.
state = digitalRead(crankOutPin); //check pin state
if (state == HIGH)
{
timehi_crank ++;
if (timehi_crank > 1000) //adjust this number to get the signal pulse width you want //want
{
timehi_crank = 0;
digitalWrite(crankOutPin, LOW);
}
}

state = digitalRead(camOutPin); //check pin state
if (state == HIGH)
{
timehi_cam ++;
if (timehi_cam > 1000) //adjust this number to get the signal pulse width you want //want
{
timehi_cam = 0;
digitalWrite(camOutPin, LOW);
}
}
  Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to sameb For This Useful Post:
Fit_is_slo (03-27-2018)
Old 03-19-2018, 04:47 PM   #66 (permalink)
Rogue Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
I’ve done a few tests with the Due. I haven’t been able to start the car with it in place. Several different versions of the code that are meant to read in and write out the signals unchanged haven’t worked. The car won’t start. Fires at the wrong time. I scoped one channel at a time. I could only tell that the modified signal is noisier. Maybe I can use a two channel scope this week and see both signals in real time. If I could log the pins on the arduino with a time stamp that might be easier.

Since I don’t have access to the scope very often I’ve been looking at raising the compression. I think the mechanics will work out with d16 parts, but not yet sure about timing.
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2018, 09:54 PM   #67 (permalink)
Rogue Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
I took video of my scope runs. Looks like crank is the issue.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...cQeLtyGW8cMCQg
  Reply With Quote
Old 03-25-2018, 09:58 PM   #68 (permalink)
Rogue Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
I also bought a junkyard core engine assembly, d16z6 engine code, to make my d17a1 destroked and high compression.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-11-2018, 11:57 AM   #69 (permalink)
Rogue Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
The core didn’t work. Thrown rod made nasty crank. Friend found another one in good shape for $50. Just finished sealing up the bottom end. Car’s been apart for almost a month so getting tired.
  Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-2018, 03:48 AM   #70 (permalink)
Rogue Engineer
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Cottage Grove, OR
Posts: 26
Thanks: 0
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
The high compression rebuild is running. It's currently stuck down the road with a broken fuel pump relay/it won't start. I had to stick in a 4 rib belt for the alternator, and then cut it down to 3 ribs, and it's still crooked... but maybe it will hold. Anxious to get a tank through it!

  Reply With Quote
Reply  Post New Thread


Tags
2001 honda civic dx, d17a1, e85, high compression, rsx-s injector





Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.5.2
All content copyright EcoModder.com